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Racism against Hispanics?

Is it racist to be bigoted rude/insulting against Hispanics?


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The "USA!" chants kinda annoy me anyway. It reminds me of our high school pep rallies when each class would cheer their graduation year. "98! 98! 90, 90, 90, 90, 98!"
 
It seems, by the way you worded your question, Josie, that you don't care for anyone but whites.

Thanks for the heads-up.
 
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The "USA!" chants kinda annoy me anyway. It reminds me of our high school pep rallies when each class would cheer their graduation year. "98! 98! 90, 90, 90, 90, 98!"

1990's? In my day it was "69".

Back to the chant. I don't know why for sure the kids chanted "USA". Was a bit suprising. I can't say I was anoyed by it.
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This is not directed at you.

IMO, many in this country are just too sensative to what they hear. When they hear something they don't like, its the race card, bigot card, or some bs card that is thrown out.
As someone else stated in another post. It would be interesting to have interviewed the kids who did the chant on what they were thinking. Its a little late now, I am sure they would have a different answer because of the reaction by the news media.

Makes me wonder sometimes who the adults are and what happened to "kids being kids"?
 
Way to Godwin. At any rate, you're acting as if I'm translating one into the other in all or even most circumstances. I'm not.

The meaning is circumstantial, just as you can say "have a nice day" and have it mean two entirely different things depending on the delivery and the circumstances.

No, Godwinning would be an argument more along the lines of saying that the chants of USA are reminiscent of the chants for Hitler in Nazi Germany. If anything, I'm saying it's not the same, under any circumstances. Besides, if we're going to say kids can't chant USA at a high school game, what's next? Codemning kids for chanting USA at a college game played on 9/11?

The vast majority of 9/11 observances in this country cannot be seen as politically neutral events. Implicit in their nature are the notions that lives lost at the World Trade Center are more valuable than lives lost in Afghanistan, Iraq, Palestine and elsewhere; that the motives of the 9/11 attackers had nothing to do with genuine grievances in the Islamic world regarding American imperialism; and that the U.S. has been justified in the subsequent killing of hundreds of thousands in so-called retaliation.

The observance at Saturday’s football game was no different. A moment of silence was followed by a military airplane flyover; in between, Block-I students chanted “USA, USA.” This was neither patriotism nor remembrance in any justifiable sense, but politicization, militarism, propaganda and bellicosity. The University is a public institution that encompasses the political views of all, not just the most (falsely) “patriotic.” Athletic planners should cease such exploitation for political purposes. They might at least consider how most Muslim students, American or otherwise, would respond to this nativist display; or better, Muslims and others that live their lives under the threat of our planes, drones and soldiers.

The overwhelmingly white, privileged, Block-I students should be ashamed of their obnoxious, fake-macho, chicken-hawk chant, while poverty-drafted members of their cohort fight and die in illegal and immoral wars for the control of oil. University administrators need to eliminate from all events such “patriotic” observances, which in this country cannot be separated from implicit justifications for state-sponsored killing.

David Green,

http://www.dailyillini.com/index.ph..._lsquoneither_patriotism_nor_remembrancersquo
 
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No, Godwinning would be an argument more along the lines of saying that the chants of USA are reminiscent of the chants for Hitler in Nazi Germany.

You invoked Hitler to make your point, which is a Godwin. The fact that you were saying "this isn't like that" doesn't make it less of a Godwin.

Besides, if we're going to say kids can't chant USA at a high school game, what's next?

You didn't answer my question before: When's the last time you saw a group of teenage sport boosters break into a chant like that when it was one primarily white American team defeating another primarily white American team?
 
Racism is a term used for the act of discrimination and/or the use of prejudice against a specific group of people. It doesn't have to be specifically a race. It can be people from Europe. Muslims. Gays. Asians. Hispanics. Minorities. etc etc.
 
You invoked Hitler to make your point, which is a Godwin. The fact that you were saying "this isn't like that" doesn't make it less of a Godwin.



You didn't answer my question before: When's the last time you saw a group of teenage sport boosters break into a chant like that when it was one primarily white American team defeating another primarily white American team?

Liked. This doesn't have anything to do with when it is "okay" to chant USA or barring people from USA chants during a high school game - that's a straw man. Nobody is arguing that people shouldn't chant USA. What I am asking is, why exactly did it happen here, since it's a peculiar situation for one to be chanting USA to begin with?
 
It seems, by the way you worded your question, Josie, that you don't care for anyone but whites.

Thanks for the heads-up.

WTF are you talking about? I can't see where Josie posted any question, much less one that implies what you say. Seems like your head's already up....never mind. ;)
 
Racism is a term used for the act of discrimination and/or the use of prejudice against a specific group of people. It doesn't have to be specifically a race. It can be people from Europe. Muslims. Gays. Asians. Hispanics. Minorities. etc etc.

eh?????????
 
Pretty academic isn't it?
"Is it racist to be bigoted rude/insulting against Hispanics?"

So the OP wants to make a distinction between being [His own word] "bigoted" ... and 'racist'.
OK, I accept the technicality.
But it's kind of a distinction without a difference... being 'bigoted' instead of a 'racist' toward Hispanics.

It would have been more effective if you didn't use the word 'bigoted' yourself, and just went with 'rude'.
You kinda suicided.
 
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And I just don't agree with acting as if a chant of "USA" is on par with chanting "Long live, Hitler" or something.

Who is saying that it is? Stop acting so sanctimonious.

If you honestly cannot see any malice in a primarily Caucasian team defeating a primarily Hispanic team and then their supporters chanting USA USA then I have lost faith in your ability to comprehend context. For the record, I attend school in Alamo Heights (The winning team's district and their student body has quite the reputation for being a classless bunch.
 
You invoked Hitler to make your point, which is a Godwin. The fact that you were saying "this isn't like that" doesn't make it less of a Godwin.
It's a common misunderstanding of Godwin to say that just mentioning Hitler is a violation. Godwin's about basically accusing the other side of being Nazi or Hitler-like.



You didn't answer my question before: When's the last time you saw a group of teenage sport boosters break into a chant like that when it was one primarily white American team defeating another primarily white American team?

I've absolutely been to college games where chants of USA have broken out. Admittedly though, I didn't pay much attention to the race or ethnicity of those involved so I really can't say if one or both sides were primarily white or not.
 
It's a common misunderstanding of Godwin to say that just mentioning Hitler is a violation. Godwin's about basically accusing the other side of being Nazi or Hitler-like.

It seems to me that the common misunderstanding is yours:

"As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches 1."

You made a comparison involving the Nazis. The rule, quite obviously, applies whether you're asserting that something is like a Nazi thing or dislike it, because in either case you are making a comparison. You pulled a Godwin.
 
It seems to me that the common misunderstanding is yours:



You made a comparison involving the Nazis. The rule, quite obviously, applies whether you're asserting that something is like a Nazi thing or dislike it, because in either case you are making a comparison. You pulled a Godwin.

No, I'm not the one arguing that chanting "USA" is comparable to hate speech. I'm saying there is no comparison.
 
re the OP, my wife is 'hispanic', having a Spanish surname, but is blue-eyed and a natural blonde; her family has been in Texas since the late 1700's, so they were also 'Mexicans' for a time, along with every other European ethnic group, like William Travis, and Sam Houston of course was the Mexican ambassador to the United States. Were the latter 'ethnic hispanics'? Yes, by the definitions used here.

The hubris about it being 'racist' is just ideological nonsense meant to shut down any opposition to criminal illegals swarming the country, that's all, and it's a sleazy, dishonest tactic, trying to create a privileged class of people who it is hoped will vote en masse for whatever political party thinks they can stuff ballots boxes with the 'Latino Vote'. Unfortunately, most 'hispanics' are opposed to massive illegal immigration, and they also don't give a crap if a candidate can speak Spanish or not. The idea that they're all stupid or something and will flock en masse to any moron who babbles Spanish at them and they also all mindlessly support illegal immigration is in itself pretty 'racist', and pretty much proves both parties are busy aggravating 'identity politics' for their own benefit.

My wife's family is bi-lingual, by the way; many speak French and German.
 
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Oh yes, and I forgot to add that it's great when crowds chant USA, any time, any where. It means some people still care about this country, unlike Democrats and Republicans.
 
I have yet to see a reasonable explanation for why they would be chanting that in the first place.

Look at the context: It's a high school basketball game. One team is predominantly white "Anglos." The other is primarily of a Hispanic ethnicity. Both teams are from American schools. After winning the game, the "Anglo" kids break into a chant of "USA! USA!"

1) It wasn't a situation where chanting "USA" makes any sense at all. Neither team represented the USA more than the other team.
2) It wasn't a situation where they'd applaud both teams. Have you ever been to a high school basketball game?
3) The words used were not particularly "racist" or offensive.

Given the context, the idea that this was somehow addressed at one team's ethnicity is the only explanation that makes sense. Despite the mental gymnastics going on. Now maybe, just maybe, they do that after every game they win. That's highly unlikely. If someone can show that, then I'll switch sides.
 
Why complain about the inevitable results of 'Identity Politics' fomented almost entirely by faux 'Liberal' Political Correctness' as a party platform, along with a educational system that aggravates divisions through such transparently racist policies like 'Bi-lingual Education' and other programs that are solely designed to promote hatred of the US and 'Whitey' in particular, through revisionist 'histories' and other 'policies''? That's as stupid as complaining about vaccinations preventing epidemics. You get what you ask for, so don't complain about the results. This is assuming, of course, that the reasons the chanting broke out is even related to the 'ethnicity' of the other team in the first place, which isn't at all clear from the article anyway.

How do people feel about 'Latino' culture celebrating a racist, violent, imperialist, war-mongering, slave owning culture that practiced human sacrifice and played 'ball games' with the heads of conquered enemies? There was a big celebration of Aztec 'culture' here recently; didn't see any complaints about it, from anybody, in the media or elsewhere, so why is chanting 'USA' supposed to be 'bad'?

What would happen if some group of white people 'celebrated' Southern slavery with a pageant featuring blacks picking cotton and serving mint julips to white people? Same thing, but one is a 'pride celebration' and the other is, well, just 'White', and unacceptable ...

Consistency matters.
 
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I have yet to see a reasonable explanation for why they would be chanting that in the first place.

Really? I've yet to see a reasonable explanation for the predominately hispanic team not joining in. There was no reason for them not to. It speaks volumes that they didn't, and about what their high school is teaching them about the US, they were also an 'American' team supposedly so, just maybe, you've answered your own question on why, you just find the answer inconvenient.
 
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After losing the game, you think they would be in the mood to cheer for the opposing team? How many times have you seen this happen?
 
I have yet to see a reasonable explanation for why they would be chanting that in the first place.

Look at the context: It's a high school basketball game. One team is predominantly white "Anglos." The other is primarily of a Hispanic ethnicity. Both teams are from American schools. After winning the game, the "Anglo" kids break into a chant of "USA! USA!"

1) It wasn't a situation where chanting "USA" makes any sense at all. Neither team represented the USA more than the other team.
2) It wasn't a situation where they'd applaud both teams. Have you ever been to a high school basketball game?
3) The words used were not particularly "racist" or offensive.

Given the context, the idea that this was somehow addressed at one team's ethnicity is the only explanation that makes sense. Despite the mental gymnastics going on. Now maybe, just maybe, they do that after every game they win. That's highly unlikely. If someone can show that, then I'll switch sides.

They are playing so dumb. If there was ever a cut and dry case of assholism, it's this case. But it's easier for these types of people to justify it (probably because they use these types of excuses to cover their own prejudices).
 
Really? I've yet to see a reasonable explanation for the predominately hispanic team not joining in. There was no reason for them not to. It speaks volumes that they didn't, and about what their high school is teaching them about the US, they were also an 'American' team supposedly so, just maybe, you've answered your own question on why, you just find the answer inconvenient.

So it was "Hooray everybody?" Again, it wasn't the Special Olympics where you get a gold medal because you tried really hard.

Or the opposing team was supposed to join in with the home fans who were cheering against them?

Think for 10 seconds about what happened. They were just chanting USA because it seemed like the thing to do? That would be pretty moronic.

When I was in high school, our basketball rival was St. Joe's. We used to go to the game and chant "Joe's Blows! Joe's Blows!" Strangely, the kids from St. Joe's never joined in, even though it was pretty obvious that St. Joe's did, in fact, blow. I guess they just couldn't deal with reality. That must be it. Because we meant it as "Good Job Everybody!"
 
Going back to answering the OP, is it possible to be racist to something other than what's considered a race:

(My thanks goes to the Rev. for reminding me of this incident in NY)
Monitoring Of Muslim Students Sparks Outrage « CBS New York

Here is a clear case of racism, without actually having race be involved. The prejudice and discrimination against muslims is racist. The fact that they have been targeted with nothing more than their association to the group (muslims) is a clear act of discrimination, and therefore racism.
 
Going back to answering the OP, is it possible to be racist to something other than what's considered a race:

(My thanks goes to the Rev. for reminding me of this incident in NY)
Monitoring Of Muslim Students Sparks Outrage « CBS New York

Here is a clear case of racism, without actually having race be involved. The prejudice and discrimination against muslims is racist. The fact that they have been targeted with nothing more than their association to the group (muslims) is a clear act of discrimination, and therefore racism.

It's a question of semantics. I'd not call bigotry or discrimination against a particular group "racism" when the group in question is not a race. But that doesn't mean this chauvinism is any less real or problematic.

You can call it "chauvinism" (although that term originally referred to sexism), "bigotry" or something like that.

Some social scientists created a model calling that kind of bigotry "group-focused enmity", which includes racism, sexism, homophobia, ethnic and nationalistic chauvinism, xenophobia and so on.
 
It's a question of semantics. I'd not call bigotry or discrimination against a particular group "racism" when the group in question is not a race. But that doesn't mean this chauvinism is any less real or problematic.

You can call it "chauvinism" (although that term originally referred to sexism), "bigotry" or something like that.

Some social scientists created a model calling that kind of bigotry "group-focused enmity", which includes racism, sexism, homophobia, ethnic and nationalistic chauvinism, xenophobia and so on.

You can call it racism. Hatred or bigotry towards races or ethnicities can be identified as racism.
 
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