• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagree

The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagree

  • Agree. Respect people's copyrights. Pay for what you use.

    Votes: 10 47.6%

  • Disagree. In the digital age, people should get to copy what they want.

    Votes: 11 52.4%
  • Total voters
    21
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

Keridan said:
This made me laugh :)

Honestly, though, I am for respecting that someone put hard work into something and has a right to get paid for that work. I think the way they go about it and how much they charge is begging to be robbed by people who feel differently.
Click to expand...

Aren't you a Libertarian? Don't you believe in voting with your wallet? If something is too expensive at Target do you steal it? No? Why not?
 
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

Keridan said:
This made me laugh :)

Honestly, though, I am for respecting that someone put hard work into something and has a right to get paid for that work. I think the way they go about it and how much they charge is begging to be robbed by people who feel differently.

I think the internet and digital issues make it a complicated challenge to address. Some people are going with theft, but I would rather the true free market answer to lousy policies were used. In this case, the true method would be giving the option of Netflix, Hulu, Google TV and more causing a huge decline in cable subscriptions and movie sales.

EDIT: As to OP, I think it would be marginally good for the economy and if you combine that with what I said above, you get my vote.
Click to expand...

I live in a nice house in a nice neighborhood. Am I begging to be robbed? What the **** is up with blaming the victim?
 
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

I don't think it would make a difference to the overall economy - it would make a huge difference to the entertainment industry's profits.
 
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

Antiderivative said:
You missed the point of where Long states that once you buy a book, poem, or piece of music, you own it. That the author has received their money, and therefore that particular book, poem, or music of is not their anymore. It is yours, and you have the right to trade it or give it away.

In addition, works of arts, music, inventions, and literature are works built upon themselves and are never are original. To claim that you have an original idea and therefore a monopoly on a piece of thought is completely absurd.
Click to expand...

Does the word plagiarism not mean anything to you? At all? Please try that with a college professor? Try to pass of Nietche's work as your own. Considering you supposedly own it, there should be no harm and no foul correct?
 
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

StillBallin75 said:
Just a warning, you are about to have a herd of Libertarians swoop in on this thread and tear your OP to pieces.
Click to expand...

why, I think a legitimate function of government is to protect property rights and a copyright is a form of property right
 
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

UtahBill said:
making a copy of music, videos, etc. for personal use is little harm or foul, using any copy, legal or otherwise, to make money is where the issue gets important.
Click to expand...

As somebody who makes a very comfortable living from their intellectual property, I wholeheartedly disagree.
 
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

TurtleDude said:
why, I think a legitimate function of government is to protect property rights and a copyright is a form of property right
Click to expand...

You are exceptional though~
 
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

Redress said:
You are exceptional though~
Click to expand...

And he's a lawyer. He needs clients :p
 
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

Hatuey said:
Aren't you a Libertarian? Don't you believe in voting with your wallet? If something is too expensive at Target do you steal it? No? Why not?
Click to expand...

I'm not sure you got my meaning, but I'm going to assume you did and answer appropriately.

Yes, I'm closer to libertarian than other parties.

In a commercial environment, I like to vote with my wallet. I believe in the invisible hand, free markets and other core principals (though I always leave the caveat for supporting some regulations).

If something is too expensive at Target, I look for it at Wal-Mart, Cosco, etc or I try to find a substitute commodity.

All else failing, I follow the law and pay what I need to pay to get what I need for my family.
 
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

Keridan said:
I'm not sure you got my meaning, but I'm going to assume you did and answer appropriately.

Yes, I'm closer to libertarian than other parties.

In a commercial environment, I like to vote with my wallet. I believe in the invisible hand, free markets and other core principals (though I always leave the caveat for supporting some regulations).

If something is too expensive at Target, I look for it at Wal-Mart, Cosco, etc or I try to find a substitute commodity.

All else failing, I follow the law and pay what I need to pay to get what I need for my family.
Click to expand...

So then why don't you apply this to IP? Do you steal a book from your local bookstore because you don't believe you should have to pay for it?
 
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

Antiderivative said:
You missed the point of where Long states that once you buy a book, poem, or piece of music, you own it. That the author has received their money, and therefore that particular book, poem, or music of is not their anymore. It is yours, and you have the right to trade it or give it away.

In addition, works of arts, music, inventions, and literature are works built upon themselves and are never are original. To claim that you have an original idea and therefore a monopoly on a piece of thought is completely absurd.
Click to expand...

Not so fast - it really depends on what kind of "idea" it is. Certainly I can understand why a composer of a piece of music, or the author of a book, or the developers of a video game - has a claim of ownership to their own work. Those creations are generally so complex and unique that they are indeed original and due to the maker's effort and hard work.

On the other hand, I remember watching a Youtube vid of three different comedians (one was DL Hughley, one was Russell Peters, forget who the third one was) all telling the same joke about who the federal government would get to build the border fence once all the Mexicans were deported. Conceivably, all three could have come up with that joke independently - should one of them own the royalties to that specific joke? This would be an instance of where IP would run into some issues.
 
Last edited:
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

Hatuey said:
Does the word plagiarism not mean anything to you? At all? Please try that with a college professor? Try to pass of Nietche's work as your own. Considering you supposedly own it, there should be no harm and no foul correct?
Click to expand...

Yes, but we are not talking about plagiarism and you are distorting the topic at hand. As I already noted, Long properly cites all his references in his works. I also use references in my writings. Enjoy your red herring.

Does freedom of speech mean anything to you or do you like to prohibit people from using, reproducing, and trading ideas that were supposedly original creation of the mind?
 
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

TurtleDude said:
why, I think a legitimate function of government is to protect property rights and a copyright is a form of property right
Click to expand...

Intellectual property differs in nature from other forms of property, for obvious reasons. Some of the rights that should rightfully apply to individual property don't necessarily translate smoothly when we talk about intellectual property and people's ideas.
 
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

Redress said:
I live in a nice house in a nice neighborhood. Am I begging to be robbed? What the **** is up with blaming the victim?
Click to expand...

Whoa there! I see your concern, but I meant to emphasize why the crime is so constant and that I don't like their policies. I don't mean to justify the crime. It's still a crime.
 
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

Luna Tick said:
What if no one pirated anything on the Internet? Everyone only watched movies they paid to see, only used non-freeware software that they've paid for, only downloaded copyrighted music after legitimately paying for it, etc. In other words, everyone adhered strictly to copyright law. Would that help the economy?

Note: This question is only about copyrighted material. Some software is freeware; some books and movies have expired copyrights, etc. Those materials are legal to freely distribute. This thread is not about those.
Click to expand...

I am not too sure it would have much of a impact,maybe on second hand stores it might.I suspect that the reason people download copyrighted stuff is because they are too cheap to go to the movie theaters, buy a brand new game, movie,book, application or whatever anytime something new comes out or simply can't afford it. They might buy a few new movies,and buy from a second hand or used store and get freeware, and public domain stuff. But they are most certainly not going to rush to the store and buy the same amount of stuff that they downloaded for free just because one day they decided to respect the copyright laws.
 
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

StillBallin75 said:
Not so fast - it really depends on what kind of "idea" it is. Certainly I can understand why a composer of a piece of music, or the author of a book, or the developers of a video game - has a claim of ownership to their own work. Those creations are generally so complex and unique that they are indeed original and due to the maker's effort and hard work.
Click to expand...

Those so-called complex creations are built upon the works of others. In essence, you are implying that the works of Shakespeare, Homer, Bach, Mozart were created in a vacuum, when they were not.
 
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

Hatuey said:
So then why don't you apply this to IP? Do you steal a book from your local bookstore because you don't believe you should have to pay for it?
Click to expand...

Okay, now I saw Redress' post and see where I didn't come across right. I do apply it to IP. I'm not advocating the theft.

I might be convinced that the law should be changed, but as of right now it is a crime. I would only advocate breaking a law if it was severely disgusting or morally reprehensible. This one is not.
 
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

StillBallin75 said:
Disagree. Regardless of the morality of IP laws, this behavior is, in effect, depriving someone, somewhere, of income that they would otherwise be receiving if you had obeyed the law - as you have used their creation. You have used a good/service and it is only fair that you pay for that usage in some form. It doesn't matter whether or not it's for "personal use," even if you don't decide to copy and redistribute it.
Click to expand...
carried to an extreme, we should't listen to the radio.....right? I fail to see how listening to music is "using" it....
All my music is paid for CD's.....I paid for each of them one time, get to listen all I want. Hardly seems fair to all those poor song writers, singers, musicians, etc.....
The worst part of their industry isn't plagiarism, it is the music publishing industry that controls what gets promoted, produced, played....
 
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

Antiderivative said:
Those so-called complex creations are built upon the works of others. In essence, you are implying that the works of Shakespeare, Homer, Bach, Mozart were created in a vacuum, when they were not.
Click to expand...

In many cases this is true, but not necessarily so. Either way, the distinction between an original and unoriginal work is often subjective and artificial, which is why I agree with some Libertarian arguments against IP law as it exists today.

But I still think people who put that much hard work and effort into the creation of a work are entitled to some sort of protection.
 
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

UtahBill said:
carried to an extreme, we should't listen to the radio.....right? I fail to see how listening to music is "using" it....
All my music is paid for CD's.....I paid for each of them one time, get to listen all I want. Hardly seems fair to all those poor song writers, singers, musicians, etc.....
The worst part of their industry isn't plagiarism, it is the music publishing industry that controls what gets promoted, produced, played....
Click to expand...

Listening to it on the radio gives them advertising revenue. Buying the CD was fulfilling an implied contract that if you give them money, you get to listen as much as you want.

Just throwing that out there.
 
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

UtahBill said:
carried to an extreme, we should't listen to the radio.....right? I fail to see how listening to music is "using" it....
Click to expand...

Not necessarily, because the creators of the work derive revenue from advertising in that case.

All my music is paid for CD's.....I paid for each of them one time, get to listen all I want. Hardly seems fair to all those poor song writers, singers, musicians, etc.....
Click to expand...

Well, in all honesty it's usually not the artists who are being harmed by the violation of piracy laws - generally speaking it's those who work behind the scenes. Sometimes they are entitled to their "fair share" under the law, sometimes they aren't - it's not an easy distinction.

The worst part of their industry isn't plagiarism, it is the music publishing industry that controls what gets promoted, produced, played....
Click to expand...

I don't disagree.
 
Last edited:
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

Well, stealing is just generally wrong. On the other hand, to believe kids pirating copies of Harry Potter movies could possibly cripple the gargantuan American economy is ludicrous.
 
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

EagleAye said:
Well, stealing is just generally wrong. On the other hand, to believe kids pirating copies of Harry Potter movies could possibly cripple the gargantuan American economy is ludicrous.
Click to expand...

In that case, I would be more concerned about what is wrong with our kids than about the economy. Maybe that's just me though.
 
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

StillBallin75 said:
In many cases this is true, but not necessarily so. Either way, the distinction between an original and unoriginal work is often subjective and artificial, which is why I agree with some Libertarian arguments against IP law as it exists today.
Click to expand...

Just to point out, IP and copyright laws divide libertarians. Not all libertarians are against IP and some support them. However, in my experience it is rather a minor issues among libertarians.

But I still think people who put that much hard work and effort into the creation of a work are entitled to some sort of protection.
Click to expand...

Such as?
 
Re: The economy would be better if more people respected copyright law. Agree/disagr

In that case, I would be more concerned about what is wrong with our kids than about the economy. Maybe that's just me though.
Click to expand...

Pirating is sort of like getting free ice cream. It's what you get when you have a digital file and a world wide computer network.

Can't eat cake all day and not get fat.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom