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Is allowing a temporary tax cut to expire raising taxes

Is it raising taxes

  • Total voters
    27
jamesrage said:
I am pretty sure that if the 47% who do not pay federal income taxes suddenly lost those tax credits and deductions every lib would be screaming bloody murder that you are raising their taxes.
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Yawn. You mean whine more than those rich who are paying a lower effective tax rate than ever and have successfully widened the income gap more than ever? You want to talk about crying? They are having their cake, eating it too, and then bitching that they didn't get to eat the whole ****ing thing themselves.
 
jamesrage said:
I am pretty sure that if the 47% who do not pay federal income taxes suddenly lost those tax credits and deductions every lib would be screaming bloody murder that you are raising their taxes.
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You didn't address the issue. The issue is whether allowing a temporary tax cut to expire is the same thing as increasing taxes.
 
jamesrage said:
I am pretty sure that if the 47% who do not pay federal income taxes suddenly lost those tax credits and deductions every lib would be screaming bloody murder that you are raising their taxes.
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False. All americans who work pay federal taxes. Its called FICA.
 
99percenter said:
Actually 86% of americans pay a positive tax rate. Nice talking points.
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actually far more get more from the government than what they pay in taxes. I think the number is that if you make less than 117K a year you are a net tax consumer federally. and paying state sales tax does not make you a positive federal tax payer no more than paying your apartment rent means you are fulfilling your duties as a car renter
 
99percenter said:
False. All americans who work pay federal taxes. Its called FICA.
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What does FICA stand for and when did it become a "tax" rather than a unconstitutional (if the courts followed the law) contribution?
 
whysoserious said:
Yawn. You mean whine more than those rich who are paying a lower effective tax rate than ever and have successfully widened the income gap more than ever? You want to talk about crying? They are having their cake, eating it too, and then bitching that they didn't get to eat the whole ****ing thing themselves.
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why do you keep lying? the rich are paying far more taxes now than they did for more than half of this country's history and people like you are paying far less of the tax burden share than you have done in the past
 
TurtleDude said:
why do you keep lying? the rich are paying far more taxes now than they did for more than half of this country's history and people like you are paying far less of the tax burden share than you have done in the past
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No they aren't. They are paying lower effective rates, which means they are not paying less than ever and keeping more than ever. You know what effective rates are, yes?
 
TurtleDude said:
actually far more get more from the government than what they pay in taxes. I think the number is that if you make less than 117K a year you are a net tax consumer federally. and paying state sales tax does not make you a positive federal tax payer no more than paying your apartment rent means you are fulfilling your duties as a car renter
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State taxes count because they all add to the tax burden. It might be negligible for billionaires that get their money from cap gains but to working class people it matters.
 
TurtleDude said:
What does FICA stand for and when did it become a "tax" rather than a unconstitutional (if the courts followed the law) contribution?
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Fica isnt a contribution. It is a mandatory tax paid by everyone. When you die you dont get any money paid back.
 
whysoserious said:
No they aren't. They are paying lower effective rates, which means they are not paying less than ever and keeping more than ever. You know what effective rates are, yes?
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I dont think so. I think he just said state taxes dont count.
 
iliveonramen said:
Does the length of time matter? As long as someone has to continue to extend it's not permanant.

Supreme Court Justices serve for life. They are confirmed and until they retire....they are Supreme Court Justices. The Chairman of the Federal Reserve is not permanant or for life, he must be confirmed every so often. Yes, some serve for multiple terms and like Grenspan serve for decades over multiple presidencies but it is not a permanant position.

As long as Congress has to vote on the Bush tax cuts in order to extend them...they are not permanant.
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It's been in place long enough that people do not consider it temporary, and have adjusted their budgets accordingly. And I want to know what you need the money for. You don't even know where all the money, that Congress now spends, goes.
 
jamesrage said:
Would you say the same thing if all the tax deductions and credits people received expired? That would mean the 47% who do not pay federal income taxes would suddenly state paying federal income taxes
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Was the word "temporary" included with the original sales pitch of those individual items?
 
Luna Tick said:
Look at it like a sale in a retail store. If the price of an item is $39.99, then that's the price. If it goes on sale for a week for $29.99, the regular price is still $39.99, but you're temporarily able to get it for ten dollars less. At the end of the sale, it's not a price hike. The regular price was $39.99 all along. There was only a temporary discount. The same is true of a temporary tax decrease. Therefore, allowing a temporary tax cut to expire is not raising taxes. It expires on its own without the legislators doing anything. An actual tax increase requires that they have to actively choose to increase taxes.
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This, really, is the perfect analogy. I had though of the "sale" analogy also, but never could think of a way to state it properly.
 
radcen said:
Was the word "temporary" included with the original sales pitch of those individual items?
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Their income tax rate is still 10-25%. They get tax deductions and credits which negate that 10%-25%.It doesn't matter if those things are temporary or not.If you remove them then that means they pay more money than they did previously. It is therefore a tax increase.
 
jamesrage said:
Their income tax rate is still 10-25%. They get tax deductions and credits which negate that 10%-25%.It doesn't matter if those things are temporary or not.If you remove them then that means they pay more money than they did previously. It is therefore a tax increase.
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The word "temporary" is all-important.

If it weren't, then it never... ever, at any time in discussion beforehand, or after approval... should have been used in the first place.
 
I’m an engineer. If an action causes a result that raises something that action is raising what is being measured. This applies even if the action is temporary that set up the conditions, it’s removal causes the raising.
 
OhIsee.Then said:
I’m an engineer. If an action causes a result that raises something that action is raising what is being measured. This applies even if the action is temporary that set up the conditions, it’s removal causes the raising.
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I'm also an engineer. Engineering is precise and emotionless. Everything that politics is not. Engineering analogies aren't even on the same planet.
 
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