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How long will you "blame Bush"?

How long will you blame Bush

  • Less than one more year

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Until this term is over

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Forever.

    Votes: 23 71.9%

  • I'm done blaming Bush.

    Votes: 9 28.1%
  • Total voters
    32
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sangha said:
We're still waiting for your defense of bush* and an explanation for why we should ever forget about the things he did to this nation

:waiting:
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this is about the 3rd time on this forum you have said you are waiting for something that was never asked of me...why do you debate so dishonestly?

why do you assume i'm going to defend Bush?
why do you assume i'm a fan of Bush?

some good advise... keep your partisan/ideological zealotry to yourself, i don't want any part of it.
 
Thrilla said:
no sense in me listing what i'd do to fix the economy... you , as a diehard lefty, won't agree to much of it.
suffice to say, i'd put the job of fixin' the economy in the hands of the only people who can actually fix it... private sector industries.
government can only entice or punish these folks, but they do the tough work of fixin' stuff.
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It was in their hands during our decline. What else you got?


I don't care what the GOP has done to fix anything...I care about what i've done.
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I see.
 
pbrauer said:
Sorry, but approximately 3/4 of the debt was created by Republican presidents. Reagan tripled the debt and Bush 41 doubled it.
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Obama has spent more in 2 years than Bush spent in 8 and wants to spend more. Blaming Bush left the building months ago.
 
Thrilla said:
this is about the 3rd time on this forum you have said you are waiting for something that was never asked of me...why do you debate so dishonestly?

why do you assume i'm going to defend Bush?
why do you assume i'm a fan of Bush?

some good advise... keep your partisan/ideological zealotry to yourself, i don't want any part of it.
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Gee, it's only the topic of this thread. Please forgive me for assuming you have something to say about it (aside from using it to attack the left, the way the OP tried (and failed) to do)
 
Thrilla said:
I guess "Clinton committed perjury and sexual harassment" just doesn't have the same ring to it.
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Lying about oral sex with an of-age willing participant vs lying about the reasons for taking the country to war where almost 5,000 soldiers were killed, thousands more maimed for life, and that we wasted a couple trillion dollars of tax payers money, not to mention the thousands of dead Iraqis? Right you are, it just doesn't have the same ring to it.
 
Catawba said:
It was in their hands during our decline. What else you got?





I see.
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yes, it was in their hands for the decline.... and it will be in their hands for the recovery too.
such is the way of reality.



and i doubt you "see" my point.. I really do.... you're still looking to big brother to save your bacon, so you won't be able to see it.
 
apdst said:
The decline started when the Dems took over Congress.
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Thanks for your opinion apdst, I literally can't tell you what that means to me.
 
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Thrilla said:
yes, it was in their hands for the decline.... and it will be in their hands for the recovery too.
such is the way of reality.
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Well, what have they offered in the last 3 years to fix the problem? More of the same cut taxes for the rich and cutting regulations that got us where we are today?


Good plan you've got there!
 
Catawba said:
Lying about oral sex with an of-age willing participant vs lying about the reasons for taking the country to war where almost 5,000 soldiers were killed, thousands more maimed for life, and that we wasted a couple trillion dollars of tax payers money, not to mention the thousands of dead Iraqis? Right you are, it just doesn't have the same ring to it.
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not a fan of perjury laws eh?... to each their own...<shrug>

so what you are telling me is that is perfectly fine for a President to lie to the American people under oath or color of his office.


no need to go any further... we won't agree on lying being a good thing.
 
GOP Bush and Dem Congress took us to war together (there was a vote, right?). Do you only blame the dealer who sold you drugs for your addiction, or do you blame yourself equally for accepting the drugs?
 
Thrilla said:
not a fan of perjury laws eh?... to each their own...<shrug>

so what you are telling me is that is perfectly fine for a President to lie to the American people under oath or color of his office.


no need to go any further... we won't agree on lying being a good thing.
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All politicians lie. Only the naive and the dishonest deny that

But honest, intelligent people can recognize the difference between lying about a personal issue like sex, and lying about the need for a war that killed thousands of american soldiers and wasted trillions of our dollars

David D. said:
GOP Bush and Dem Congress took us to war together (there was a vote, right?). Do you only blame the dealer who sold you drugs for your addiction, or do you blame yourself equally for accepting the drugs?
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If the dealer got a child addicted to drugs, is it the childs fault?

Dems in Congress voted for IWR based on the lies that bush* and his administration told.
 
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Catawba said:
Well, what have they offered in the last 3 years to fix the problem? More of the same cut taxes for the rich and cutting regulations that got us where we are today?


Good plan you've got there!
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did i say more tax cuts for the rich or more deregulation?

I didn't give any details ...why attempt to make some up for me?

tax cuts didn't get us where we are... some deregulation efforts did, however....as well as a few incredibly educated folks who changed risk management forever.

but , meh, that's all way beyond the idiotic GOP v Dems partisan battle, so i'm sure you aren't interested.
 
David D. said:
GOP Bush and Dem Congress took us to war together (there was a vote, right?). Do you only blame the dealer who sold you drugs for your addiction, or do you blame yourself equally for accepting the drugs?
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The majority of congressional Democrats voted against the war in Iraq. 247 voted nay, and 111 voted aye.
 
Thrilla said:
I guess "Clinton committed perjury and sexual harassment" just doesn't have the same ring to it.
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You know, if we're gonna have politicians lying about stuff, I think I'd rather have them lying about a blowjob than lying about the reasons for going to war.
 
Thrilla said:
did i say more tax cuts for the rich or more deregulation?

I didn't give any details ...why attempt to make some up for me?

tax cuts didn't get us where we are... some deregulation efforts did, however....as well as a few incredibly educated folks who changed risk management forever.

but , meh, that's all way beyond the idiotic GOP v Dems partisan battle, so i'm sure you aren't interested.
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Tax cuts certainly did help get us to the point where the rich own 85% of the wealth. Its not a partisan issue. It is the fact that our economy cannot thrive when we have so much wealth concentrated at the top.
 
Catawba said:
Tax cuts certainly did help get us to the point where the rich own 85% of the wealth. Its not a partisan issue. It is the fact that our economy cannot thrive when we have so much wealth concentrated at the top.
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which has nothing to do with the recession.
 
atrasicarius said:
You know, if we're gonna have politicians lying about stuff, I think I'd rather have them lying about a blowjob than lying about the reasons for going to war.
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sure thing...

then there's the matter of whether Bush lied, or whether he was just wrong.
that question does not arise in regards to Clinton.. Clinton absolutely lied... under oath.

on the long list of reasons to go after Iraq, only the question of WMD is in contention.... but it wasn't in contention back them, there was widespread, bipartisan, agreement on the issue... if Bush was lying, most of DC was right there spewing those lies before he ever came on scene.
I'm more of the mind that they were all simply wrong about WMD's and none were lying.

i've been through enough iraq war debates though... i don't think we need ot go through them again.
 
Thrilla said:
which has nothing to do with the recession.
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No, deregulation and lax regulation were the cause of the recession, but recovering from the recession requires that the middle class has money to create the demand needed by industry to be productive, and to pay taxes to help reduce the deficit.
 
Thrilla said:
sure thing...

then there's the matter of whether Bush lied, or whether he was just wrong.
that question does not arise in regards to Clinton.. Clinton absolutely lied... under oath.

on the long list of reasons to go after Iraq, only the question of WMD is in contention.... but it wasn't in contention back them, there was widespread, bipartisan, agreement on the issue... if Bush was lying, most of DC was right there spewing those lies before he ever came on scene.
I'm more of the mind that they were all simply wrong about WMD's and none were lying.

i've been through enough iraq war debates though... i don't think we need ot go through them again.
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You are wrong, world intelligence confirmed Iraq was of no threat, and we knew that we completely destroyed Iraq's military threat in the Persian Gulf war, and we knew that we did not let them rebuild that threat in the ten years of sanctions we enforced between that time and our invasion.
 
Catawba said:
No, deregulation and lax regulation were the cause of the recession, but recovering from the recession requires that the middle class has money to create the demand needed by industry to be productive, and to pay taxes to help reduce the deficit.
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so you are under the belief that making the rich poorer will make the poor/middle class richer?

but you are semi-correct that we have a demand problem.... government can't help with that though, so I'm not sure waiting on them to ride in and save the day is the wisest choice.

it wasn't lax regulation... it was regulatory capture.
it was a matter of allowing insurance instruments (CDOs, CDSs) not to fall under insurance regulations.
the regulations were on hand to combat what these ultra educated folks dreamed up...but as usual, people in positions of power ( both private an public) decided to redefine reality and ended up screwing a lot of people out of trillions of dollars.
 
Catawba said:
You are wrong, world intelligence confirmed Iraq was of no threat, and we knew that we completely destroyed Iraq's military threat in the Persian Gulf war, and we knew that we did not let them rebuild that threat in the ten years of sanctions we enforced between that time and our invasion.
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if i'm wrong, the entire US government ( including prominent Democrats and the Clinton administration), from the gulf war until 9/11, was wrong.... and lying.

lets see you castigate Clinton for his "lies" about Iraq.. which eventually led to war and death and destruction.
i'll sit here and say that Clinton didn't lie about Iraq .. and neither did Bush.... both were wrong, however.
 
Thrilla said:
not a fan of perjury laws eh?... to each their own...<shrug>

so what you are telling me is that is perfectly fine for a President to lie to the American people under oath or color of his office.


no need to go any further... we won't agree on lying being a good thing.
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I think what is being lied about matters. For example, lying to cover up an extramarital affair doesn't hurt anyone and is pretty meaningless in the grand scheme of things. Hell, if the government prosecuted everyone who lied under oath about extramarital affairs, there'd be no room in jail for anyone who didn't go through a divorce.

I do admit I will never understand why righties cry because Clinton beat the charges of perjury brought against him; while at the same time, they cheer for Scooter Libby having his sentenced commuted without ever spending a day in jail after he was he was actually convicted of perjury. And unlike Clinton who lied to cover up an extramarital affair, Libby lied in a case about a covert CIA agent being outted.

While I don't understand that logic, I do chalk it up to what I experience all the time with the right; where they place their ideology over their country.
 
Thrilla said:
if i'm wrong, the entire US government ( including prominent Democrats and the Clinton administration), from the gulf war until 9/11, was wrong.... and lying.

lets see you castigate Clinton for his "lies" about Iraq.. which eventually led to war and death and destruction.
i'll sit here and say that Clinton didn't lie about Iraq .. and neither did Bush.... both were wrong, however.
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There is a difference you're not considering ...

How many Americans died because Clinton launched Cruise missiles into Iraq ... how many Americans died because Bush launched a full-scale war against Iraq ...
 
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