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Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president?

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  • Total voters
    32
Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

No less than any person who entertains socialism deserves to be president. ;)

Socialism isn't treason.
 
Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

I think a big deal is being made out of very little. As has been pointed out already, secession talk in Texas is a longtime joke. Texas Monthly magazine once had a cover showing how Texas could be divided into five states. BurkaBlog :: When Texas Monthly called for secession

How many times has Perry commented on secession? Once? Is this a plank in his platform? If it isn't, my bet is that this is just a petty way to go after him.
 
Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

Socialism isn't treason.

Neither is succession.
 
Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

I like Perry. He hates BO almost as much as I do. And if he doesn't win, Texas is soo outtta here. Will you really miss us? Fear us, yeah. But miss us?

That's the only good reason I've heard so far to support Perry. :sun
 
Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

I don't like Perry, but states should have the right to secede and do.
 
Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

@repeter
Wait, are you saying that secession is un-American?

Secession from the American Union is unAmerican. If a state wants to try it, it is an illegitimate attempt to leave, is only entering a state of rebellion, and should be treated as you would treat any rebellious group. Leaving the Union is not an option. If a state tries it, I'm all for a reenactment of the Civil War, with no mercy for their leaders.
 
Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

Secession from the American Union is unAmerican. If a state wants to try it, it is an illegitimate attempt to leave, is only entering a state of rebellion, and should be treated as you would treat any rebellious group. Leaving the Union is not an option. If a state tries it, I'm all for a reenactment of the Civil War, with no mercy for their leaders.
If you ask me we had too much mercy on the leaders of the last rebellion.
 
Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

Neither is succession.

History and American law both beg to differ:

The Avalon Project : President Jackson's Proclamation Regarding Nullification, December 10, 1832

Because the Union was formed by compact, it is said the parties to that compact may, when they feel themselves aggrieved, depart from it; but it is precisely because it is a compact that they cannot. A compact is an agreement or binding obligation. It may by its terms have a sanction or penalty for its breach, or it may not. If it contains no sanction, it may be broken with no other consequence than moral guilt; if it have a sanction, then the breach incurs the designated or implied penalty. A league between independent nations, generally, has no sanction other than a moral one; or if it should contain a penalty, as there is no common superior, it cannot be enforced. A government, on the contrary, always has a sanction, express or implied; and, in our case, it is both necessarily implied and expressly given. An attempt by force of arms to destroy a government is an offense, by whatever means the constitutional compact may have been formed; and such government has the right, by the law of self-defense, to pass acts for punishing the offender, unless that right is modified, restrained, or resumed by the constitutional act. In our system, although it is modified in the case of treason, yet authority is expressly given to pass all laws necessary to carry its powers into effect, and under this grant provision has been made for punishing acts which obstruct the due administration of the laws.

In essence, secession is a breach of the legally binding contract that is the Constitution. The attempt to breach that contract by taking up arms and declaring part of American soil to be your own is an attack on the republic itself and furthermore: treason.

PS: And it's SECESSION. People have been using the wrong word for about 4 pages and it's a little annoying.
 
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Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

I don't like Perry, but states should have the right to secede and do.

No they don't. Does history mean nothing to you people? There was something that happened between 1861-1865 that settled the question.

If states could secede anytime they got kind of mad, how big do you think the Union would be today? It would be the Confederation of New York and New Jersey, if that. Saying states have the right to secede changes this from the UNITED States of America to the "Kinda sorta Confederated States of America, depending on how the Governor of North Carolina feels about the whole thing today."
 
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Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

History and American law both beg to differ:

The Avalon Project : President Jackson's Proclamation Regarding Nullification, December 10, 1832



In essence, secession is a breach of the legally binding contract that is the Constitution. The attempt to breach that contract by taking up arms and declaring part of American soil to be your own is an attack on the republic itself and furthermore: treason.

PS: And it's SECESSION. People have been using the wrong word for about 4 pages and it's a little annoying.

Oh noes!!!! I put an extra c in the word, clearly that means you're right :roll:

I know the futility of trying to confront you with actual facts but I'll post this anyway;

"Discussions and threats of secession have often surfaced in American politics, but only in the case of the Confederate States of America was secession actually declared. A 2008 Zogby International poll revealed that 22% of Americans believe that "any state or region has the right to peaceably secede and become an independent republic."[32][33] The United States Supreme Court ruled in Texas v. White, 74 U.S. 700 (1869) that unilateral secession was unconstitutional while commenting that revolution or consent of the states could lead to a successful secession.[34][35]"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secession#United_States

Read the Declaration of Independence sometime. There's always been an understanding that it is quite possible for a government to lose the consent of the governed. This country was founded on revolution. It's a little funny to me that people who would never criticize Jane Fonda's activities during Vietnam will accuse Rick Perry of treason simply because he's conservative.
 
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Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

As Governor of Texas, he took an oath of loyalty to the United States. It is a requirement for the office. So he was publicly entertaining treason, no matter how you interpret the US Constitution concerning a states right to secede.
 
Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

If Perry took an oath to defend and uphold the Constitution, wouldn't that actually mean he should oppose those who act without Constitutional authority? Hummmm, interesting question.
 
Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

If Perry took an oath to defend and uphold the Constitution, wouldn't that actually mean he should oppose those who act without Constitutional authority? Hummmm, interesting question.

Well it would certainly make this whole "Is secession constitutional" argument a lot more relevant, that is for certain. Maybe someone who cares ought to look it up.
 
Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

I like Perry. He hates BO almost as much as I do. And if he doesn't win, Texas is soo outtta here. Will you really miss us? Fear us, yeah. But miss us?

Texas is waiting for the outcome of the 2012 election to see if they secede? Perry wasn't even in the race 2 weeks ago, and now the Union depends on him winning?

That is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard.
 
Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

Anyone who even spent any time in Texas would know that this a sentiment that plays very well with Texans and can be chalked up to being nothing more political rhetoric with no serious meaning past playing to the audience.

There is a saying that is very true, it is: "Don't mess with Texas" I n the two and a half years I was living there I was amazed having never seen any group of people as proud as their State as Texans.

There was a time when one could be proud to be from California, but the Liberals have all by destroyed this State.
 
Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

Anyone who even spent any time in Texas would know that this a sentiment that plays very well with Texans and can be chalked up to being nothing more political rhetoric with no serious meaning past playing to the audience.

Uhmmm 5th generation Texan here.

I think Perry is dolt even more now for this crud
 
Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

Uhmmm 5th generation Texan here.

I think Perry is dolt even more now for this crud

I don't know enough about Perry to argue about him being a dolt or not and haven't lived in Texas for many years, but I stand by what I said because I know politicians and I still have friends in Texas who are very proud of the State.
 
Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

I don't know enough about Perry to argue about him being a dolt or not and haven't lived in Texas for many years, but I stand by what I said because I know politicians and I still have friends in Texas who are very proud of the State.

About all the people I know in Texas have always taken the secession thing for what it is, a joke.

Yeah we boast, brag and are loud mouthed but we also have some common sense.

And when Perry got on this roll it was like "oh man what a maroon."
 
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Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

Anyone who even spent any time in Texas would know that this a sentiment that plays very well with Texans and can be chalked up to being nothing more political rhetoric with no serious meaning past playing to the audience.

There is a saying that is very true, it is: "Don't mess with Texas" I n the two and a half years I was living there I was amazed having never seen any group of people as proud as their State as Texans.

"We fought a war over this. Lots of Americans died. The secessionists lost—including the ones in Texas. Secession is no more legal now than it was then.

And while talking about secession undoubtedly plays well among the 3 in 10 Texas voters ill-informed enough to think it's a serious political statement, it also makes the rest of the country (and likely the rest of the state) roll our eyes in bewilderment at the Lone Star Clown."
Texas Secession? Perry, One Third of Texans Are Wrong: Texas Can't Secede - Robert Schlesinger (usnews.com)
 
Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

Uhmmm 5th generation Texan here.

I think Perry is dolt even more now for this crud

You think a conservative is a dolt? That's shocking.
 
Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

You think a conservative is a dolt? That's shocking.

Winston speaks for most Texans. :sun

More Texans dislike Perry than Obama:

"A poll released Wednesday showed that in a hypothetical match-up for the presidency, President Barack Obama would defeat Texas Gov. Rick Perry among Texas voters by a margin of 45-47 percent."
Texans Hate Rick Perry More Than They Hate Barack Obama
 
Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

There are a lot of reasons why I won't vote for Perry... this isn't high on the list
 
Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

All the right leaning people that voted no, would have voted yes if Obama made the statement instead...
 
Re: Does a person who entertained succession from the country deserve to be president

Oh noes!!!! I put an extra c in the word, clearly that means you're right :roll:

This is why reading comprehension is our friend. Secession and Succession are two different thing. Do you understand that yet?

I know the futility of trying to confront you with actual facts but I'll post this anyway;

"Discussions and threats of secession have often surfaced in American politics, but only in the case of the Confederate States of America was secession actually declared. A 2008 Zogby International poll revealed that 22% of Americans believe that "any state or region has the right to peaceably secede and become an independent republic."[32][33] The United States Supreme Court ruled in Texas v. White, 74 U.S. 700 (1869) that unilateral secession was unconstitutional while commenting that revolution or consent of the states could lead to a successful secession.[34][35]"

Secession - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Read the Declaration of Independence sometime. There's always been an understanding that it is quite possible for a government to lose the consent of the governed. This country was founded on revolution. It's a little funny to me that people who would never criticize Jane Fonda's activities during Vietnam will accuse Rick Perry of treason simply because he's conservative.

More failure to read what is being stated in my post. The grounds for a secession being successful which is what your links talks about and whether or not a secession is treason are two completely different things.
 
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