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Is Michael Jackson Overrated?

IS Michael Jackson Overrated?

  • He's good but overrated

    Votes: 11 33.3%
  • He IS the King!

    Votes: 15 45.5%
  • He isnt that good and he IS overrated

    Votes: 6 18.2%
  • OTHER / I Dont Know

    Votes: 1 3.0%

  • Total voters
    33
He was a very talented musician - but I think no more or less talented than say Ray Charles or Stevie Wonder. His dancing was irrelevant to me... though I see it as part of his persona / act. I thought the media over-hyped him partly because he was a rather strange and broken individual, as well as a ****ing odd ball especially when kids were involved.
 
He was a very talented musician - but I think no more or less talented than say Ray Charles or Stevie Wonder. His dancing was irrelevant to me... though I see it as part of his persona / act. I thought the media over-hyped him partly because he was a rather strange and broken individual, as well as a ****ing odd ball especially when kids were involved.

He was a legitimate star before the media started overhyping him because of his personal demons.
 
Overrated? Nah...musical genious...supremely talented...psychologicaly a mess...but overrated? No.
 
He was a legitimate star before the media started overhyping him because of his personal demons.

I agree he was a star, but he was no more talented than Ray or Stevie, or for that matter Jimi Hendrix or any of probably hundreds of more musicians and performers. He was over rated because of his weirdness, not because of his talent which was and continues to be sad.
 
I agree he was a star, but he was no more talented than Ray or Stevie, or for that matter Jimi Hendrix or any of probably hundreds of more musicians and performers. He was over rated because of his weirdness, not because of his talent which was and continues to be sad.

Going back to the OP tho, if someone were to say Michael Jackson is the greatest most bestest musician, showman, and singer of all time for ever and ever, OK...then THAT might be 'over-rated.' Ray Charles was absolutely gifted, but wasnt by any stretch the best blues singer pi ani player. But he was AWESOME. Hendrix was an innovater, a great blues guitarist and rock musician...but not the greatest ever. I think as long as the definition remains Michael/Ray/Jimi/? Was An AWESOME fantastic great musician, then I dont see how they could be judged as 'overrated.

Maybe thats what is needed...who is the most overrated musician of all time.
 
Whovian said:
Michael Jackson isn't anything but deceased.

He WAS over rated... and he WAS not that good.

Let's get our tenses right, eh people?

h8er.

12345

Why? Because I did not care for his music and think he was over rated? Does anyone who thinks he was over rated automatically become a hater?
 
Does anyone who thinks he was over rated automatically become a hater?

no, you become a racist. oh wait, Michael wasn't black. nevermind
 
The issue when discussing art is its an entirely subjective thing.

Once you get past the "fundamentals" of something, it is all preference. And even then, some people can see breaking from the fundamentals purposefully as art itself.

There is something to be said with the notion of popularity defining what's "good". Take Mozart or Beethoven for example...are they "great" classical music because they are somehow significantly better by some measurable standard than other contemporary classical composers? Or did their music gain popularity that allowed it to live on through the ages better than other composers and thus the popularity is what essentially dictated they were "good"?

I think in terms of pop music...be it bubblegum, rock, rap, R&B, country, whatever pop you wish...popularity and longevity does say a lot about it. Is Adele a better singer than Britney Spears? Without question in my mind. However, I'd rate Britney as a greater and more influencial all around performer in a heart beat due to her longevity in the public, multitude of successful songs, and essentially helping to create the modern mold for the female young pop star as the first on since Madonna that truly captured such significant and lengthy attention.

In comparison to contemporaries in this age of music, I don't believe Michael Jackson is overrated. Indeed, I think some may underrate him due to his personal isses (Similar to how OJ Simpson is more apt to not appear on a list of the top 10 or 20 running backs in some peoples minds). Thriller was an absolute revolution with regards to music videos and how they were done. The man had a successful mainstream song in five seperate decades. Was regarded quickly as a prodigy as a young child and, unlike many child singers, managed to actually maintain his singing ability after being a child. He's got the largest selling record in the world and the most #1 singles by a male performer in the modern era. He's the only person in the Dance hall of fame whose dancing career focused around pop/rock and roll. He transcended music with regards to putting out mini-films, video games, commercials, etc. He became essentially a social icon as much as an actual performer. The glove, the moonwalk, the kick, the "cha'mone" line, etc. These are random cultural references that if you randomly did today most anyone above a certain age is going to INSTANTLY recognize.

As a musician, the guy was multi-talented in a package I would argue fewer have than the OP makes it out to be. His vocal abilities were excellent and are regarded by many critics as being a major talent. As I said earlier, he was thought of as a prodigy as a child. He had significant vocal range and stylistic abilities with his singing from your more fast paced rapping, to straight singing, hitting large highers or going with teeth clenching aggression. Also, not as commonly known from just his songs, he was rather adapt at beat boxing, mimicing various instruments and used that as part of his song creation method in nailing down tunes. Which leads to the next thing, unlike many current singers Jackson also wrote much of his own songs, which has led to him to be inducted into the songwriters hall of fame as well. His dancing skills were exceedingly good, and to my understanding he too generally was involved in the choreography of his videos. His stylistic range in the type of music he would work with was diverse, from motown to funk to more rock inspired beats.

In terms of the modern era, I'd definitely place him on similar footing as the Beatles, Elvis, and some of the other more highly regarded as extremely influencial acts of the past 50 years.


Nice post. And although Michael Jackson's music was mostly not my cup of tea, I cannot deny his immense talent and popularity. So no, he was definitely *NOT* overrated.
 
Who do you think can dance better?

Wade Robson, "as good as" - because he made that effort.

It's not (as we should know by now) all about dance and song, as alluded to in this thread. I think the man had an on/off switch, because onstage, he was electrifying. Like Prince. Both scrawny sticks of men, but man, they have the stage presence, and talent to back it up.
 
Sadly it seems that the bigger the star, the greater the talent, the bigger the personal demons. the list of famous celebrities who succumbed to these demons is lengthy

Michael's father was a horrific bastard who did a literal ****-ton of damage. Maybe if he'd had a steady start, things would have gone differently.
 
The issue when discussing art is its an entirely subjective thing.

Once you get past the "fundamentals" of something, it is all preference. And even then, some people can see breaking from the fundamentals purposefully as art itself.

There is something to be said with the notion of popularity defining what's "good". Take Mozart or Beethoven for example...are they "great" classical music because they are somehow significantly better by some measurable standard than other contemporary classical composers? Or did their music gain popularity that allowed it to live on through the ages better than other composers and thus the popularity is what essentially dictated they were "good"?

I think in terms of pop music...be it bubblegum, rock, rap, R&B, country, whatever pop you wish...popularity and longevity does say a lot about it. Is Adele a better singer than Britney Spears? Without question in my mind. However, I'd rate Britney as a greater and more influencial all around performer in a heart beat due to her longevity in the public, multitude of successful songs, and essentially helping to create the modern mold for the female young pop star as the first on since Madonna that truly captured such significant and lengthy attention.

In comparison to contemporaries in this age of music, I don't believe Michael Jackson is overrated. Indeed, I think some may underrate him due to his personal isses (Similar to how OJ Simpson is more apt to not appear on a list of the top 10 or 20 running backs in some peoples minds). Thriller was an absolute revolution with regards to music videos and how they were done. The man had a successful mainstream song in five seperate decades. Was regarded quickly as a prodigy as a young child and, unlike many child singers, managed to actually maintain his singing ability after being a child. He's got the largest selling record in the world and the most #1 singles by a male performer in the modern era. He's the only person in the Dance hall of fame whose dancing career focused around pop/rock and roll. He transcended music with regards to putting out mini-films, video games, commercials, etc. He became essentially a social icon as much as an actual performer. The glove, the moonwalk, the kick, the "cha'mone" line, etc. These are random cultural references that if you randomly did today most anyone above a certain age is going to INSTANTLY recognize.

As a musician, the guy was multi-talented in a package I would argue fewer have than the OP makes it out to be. His vocal abilities were excellent and are regarded by many critics as being a major talent. As I said earlier, he was thought of as a prodigy as a child. He had significant vocal range and stylistic abilities with his singing from your more fast paced rapping, to straight singing, hitting large highers or going with teeth clenching aggression. Also, not as commonly known from just his songs, he was rather adapt at beat boxing, mimicing various instruments and used that as part of his song creation method in nailing down tunes. Which leads to the next thing, unlike many current singers Jackson also wrote much of his own songs, which has led to him to be inducted into the songwriters hall of fame as well. His dancing skills were exceedingly good, and to my understanding he too generally was involved in the choreography of his videos. His stylistic range in the type of music he would work with was diverse, from motown to funk to more rock inspired beats.

In terms of the modern era, I'd definitely place him on similar footing as the Beatles, Elvis, and some of the other more highly regarded as extremely influencial acts of the past 50 years.

Anybody who hears somebody hit two notes "He-he!" and doesn't automatically think "Michael Jackson!" was raised on Mars.
 
I agree he was a star, but he was no more talented than Ray or Stevie, or for that matter Jimi Hendrix or any of probably hundreds of more musicians and performers. He was over rated because of his weirdness, not because of his talent which was and continues to be sad.

And I strongly disagree. All manner of artists use gimmicks, that doesn't make them strange.

On the plastic surgery front, I heard at one point that as long as he could still see his father's face in his own, he couldn't bear looking at himself. Don't know if it's true or not, but it makes sense.
 
And I strongly disagree. All manner of artists use gimmicks, that doesn't make them strange.

On the plastic surgery front, I heard at one point that as long as he could still see his father's face in his own, he couldn't bear looking at himself. Don't know if it's true or not, but it makes sense.

the use of gimmicks is not what made him strange. It was his penchant for buggering young boys what did that.
 
Anthony Gormley's "Angel of the North" is possibly the most viewed work of art in the world as it is passed by 90,000 commuters every day. It's good, but not that good.

images

Being passed by commuters is not the kind of experience I'm talking about. There's a difference between listening to a song and passing by a store that happens to be playing it.
 
the use of gimmicks is not what made him strange. It was his penchant for buggering young boys what did that.

AHA! But the vast bulk of his works were fait accompli before that issue came to light.
 
Where did the discussion of "worth" come from?

This is a thread about being overrated. That absolutely implies a discussion about what the artist or his art is worth relative to others..

And this is the criteria by which we should judge art? Whether or not people would burn the author (alive?) or the Statue of Liberty?
That seems just a stranger, Wickerman version of ad populum.

It's the only criteria by which we actually can judge greatness. Everything else is self-delusion.

It doesn't have to be complex to be great. But, yes something can be great even if it's not well-known.
Did Thriller music suck until it was released and sold?

Only to those who actually know it. "Greatness" comes with recognition. There is no objective measure of greatness besides recognition and impact. Everything else is a matter of opinion, but you can always look to an artist's exposure.

Art can certainly be of quality and not be known. But "great?" You can't just take the eminence out of greatness.
 
You guys are making a mistake here about "worth".

Worth and value are two different things. Something (in this case a work of art) can have worth yet no value and vice versa. Value is the monetary denomination placed on it worth is the intrinsic intagible denomination placed on it.

Case in point, at one time Van Gogh's work had no value yet had worth.
 
AHA! But the vast bulk of his works were fait accompli before that issue came to light.

please, he was sodomizing "Carlton" (later of Fresh Prince fame) at the time he released Thriller
 
the use of gimmicks is not what made him strange. It was his penchant for buggering young boys what did that.

I grant you his behaviors with children were beyond weird...I highly doubt he was sexual with them. It would be interesting to know how much of his creative ability was driven by just natural God given talent and how much was the product of fighting shadows. Pretty tragic figure...not that hard to understand and empathize with.
 
I highly doubt he was sexual with them.

as Katt Williams sez "People don't say the same **** about you for 20 goddamn years if it ain't true. If a mother****er calls you a crackhead for 20 years, bitch you are smokin crack"

1 kid accuses you of molestation, it could be bull****
2nd kid comes forward, doubt begins to creep in
3rd, 4th, 5th kid comes along....you are a freakin little boy ****er

how many millions of $$$$$$ did michael pay to how many different little boy's families to buy their silence?
 
MJ was epic, no doubt about it. Sure, many people can do what he did, but he had a certain uniqueness no one has. And he was weird, but weird in a way where it had people love him/ hate him.
 
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