Religion and Addictive Personalities

Obviously, not everyone who is religious also has an addictive personality; many are born into religious families and never question their beliefs.

But, this thread is about those who convert to religion from a non-religious, or agnostic state.

I propose that there is a link between addictive personalities and conversion to religion. This came to my attention a few years ago when a family member who works in law enforcement explained how recruiting inmates was so easy. "They just go from one addiction, whether that be drugs, alcohol, sex or whatever, to another addition -- religion."

In fact, 12-Step recovery programs tend to focus on converting the addict to religion by claiming that they cannot control themselves, only a higher authority can. An ex-neighbor went to those meetings and she became quite inundated in the rhetoric. She stopped drinking, but only for a few years, then she went back on the bottle and claimed God had forsaken her. It was pathetic to watch.

Interestingly, I've read many other accounts of people who were heavy into booze/drugs who came out of their own accord (no religion), and their results seemed to be lasting.

Some may say that it's easy to convert this type of person because they are at a low point in their lives, but, I think it's more likely that they can be converted because they were addictive personalities to begin with.

What do others think? Can a person who is mentally strong and happy be converted as easily as one who is an addictive personality?

I'm really interested in hearing the views of others.

Seems to me that strong people, i.e those with confidence in themselves and thus stable and content, are less likely to let themselves be exploited.

Because that's what cults like scientology and JWs do, exploit weakness. But as opposed to other main stream religions, provide nothing in return.

I've known a number of addicts in life to some of whom Christianity provided a great crutch. Others found that supportive corset in meetings with AA (or whoever), many with both.

Yet I've experienced (limited experience and thus hardly representative, I'll be the first to admit) that their leaving whatever comfort zone resulted in going back on whatever substance of preference.

I know (did know) only one person who needed neither religion nor anything else to chuck a habit. A person strong in every other way as well.

Not to be misunderstood, I think it's great that help for those in need is available and would never knock it in any way. On the contrary, I find it highly commendable and that goes for the people working in that form of help as well.


But that's not the question posed anyway.

With addiction being a dependence, one has to realize that people principally dependent are more in peril of becoming an addict. The same machinations applying to conversion to whatever may serve as an alternative crutch.

If crutches are needed, so be it. Practising a gained faith seems a lot healthier than crawling into a bottle, mainlining or stuffing one's face with prescribed or unprescribed chemicals to deal with a mental/emotional condition one has no other way of handling.

HowardBThiname said:

Obviously, not everyone who is religious also has an addictive personality; many are born into religious families and never question their beliefs.

But, this thread is about those who convert to religion from a non-religious, or agnostic state.

I propose that there is a link between addictive personalities and conversion to religion. This came to my attention a few years ago when a family member who works in law enforcement explained how recruiting inmates was so easy. "They just go from one addiction, whether that be drugs, alcohol, sex or whatever, to another addition -- religion."

In fact, 12-Step recovery programs tend to focus on converting the addict to religion by claiming that they cannot control themselves, only a higher authority can. An ex-neighbor went to those meetings and she became quite inundated in the rhetoric. She stopped drinking, but only for a few years, then she went back on the bottle and claimed God had forsaken her. It was pathetic to watch.

Interestingly, I've read many other accounts of people who were heavy into booze/drugs who came out of their own accord (no religion), and their results seemed to be lasting.

Some may say that it's easy to convert this type of person because they are at a low point in their lives, but, I think it's more likely that they can be converted because they were addictive personalities to begin with.

What do others think? Can a person who is mentally strong and happy be converted as easily as one who is an addictive personality?

I'm really interested in hearing the views of others.

Click to expand...

IMO, we all have some level of addictive personality. However, conversion is quite different from acceptance.

We *accept Christ as our Lord and Savior. *Conversion sounds more like brain-washing.

WCH said:

IMO, we all have some level of addictive personality. However, conversion is quite different from acceptance.

We *accept Christ as our Lord and Savior. *Conversion sounds more like brain-washing.

Click to expand...

That's a valid point -- we may all have addictive personalities to some degree. I guess I'm talking more about those people who already demonstrate a weakness for addictions -- they seem more likely to buy into a religious conversion than people who are emotionally stable. It's like they have to have something to bolster them in life.

I'm not so sure, however, that conversion and acceptance are so different. Both indicate a change of mindset. And, yes, I think "brain-washing" does enter in, but that, too, I feel might be more likely for someone with an addictive personality. "True believers," such as those who follow charismatic leaders like Jim Jones, are often mentally and emotionally weak, and, while I have no stats on the followers of the Jones cult, I'd be willing to guess that many who joined that cult and accepted its teachings had a history of addictions of some sort.

I appreciate your post. Thank you.

HowardBThiname said:

That's a valid point -- we may all have addictive personalities to some degree. I guess I'm talking more about those people who already demonstrate a weakness for addictions -- they seem more likely to buy into a religious conversion than people who are emotionally stable. It's like they have to have something to bolster them in life.

I'm not so sure, however, that conversion and acceptance are so different. Both indicate a change of mindset. And, yes, I think "brain-washing" does enter in, but that, too, I feel might be more likely for someone with an addictive personality. "True believers," such as those who follow charismatic leaders like Jim Jones, are often mentally and emotionally weak, and, while I have no stats on the followers of the Jones cult, I'd be willing to guess that many who joined that cult and accepted its teachings had a history of addictions of some sort.

I appreciate your post. Thank you.

Click to expand...

Acceptance, to me, is a personal decision to give yourself over to the Lord, allowing faith in his word to dictate your existence. [and beyond]

Conversion, to me, is being coerced by others [worldly beings] allowing them to control what you believe and think. [Obviously, I'm not a fan of organized religion]

The weak minded and easily persuaded do make themselves open to the latter.

HowardBThiname said:

Obviously, not everyone who is religious also has an addictive personality; many are born into religious families and never question their beliefs.

But, this thread is about those who convert to religion from a non-religious, or agnostic state.

I propose that there is a link between addictive personalities and conversion to religion. This came to my attention a few years ago when a family member who works in law enforcement explained how recruiting inmates was so easy. "They just go from one addiction, whether that be drugs, alcohol, sex or whatever, to another addition -- religion."

In fact, 12-Step recovery programs tend to focus on converting the addict to religion by claiming that they cannot control themselves, only a higher authority can. An ex-neighbor went to those meetings and she became quite inundated in the rhetoric. She stopped drinking, but only for a few years, then she went back on the bottle and claimed God had forsaken her. It was pathetic to watch.

Interestingly, I've read many other accounts of people who were heavy into booze/drugs who came out of their own accord (no religion), and their results seemed to be lasting.

Some may say that it's easy to convert this type of person because they are at a low point in their lives, but, I think it's more likely that they can be converted because they were addictive personalities to begin with.

What do others think? Can a person who is mentally strong and happy be converted as easily as one who is an addictive personality?

I'm really interested in hearing the views of others.

Click to expand...

Supposedly religion is a big dopamine high. Listening to music and singing also deliver dopamine.

The anticipation of reward. Follow these rules now and you'll be rewarded after you die.

Money, sex, power, risk taking. These are all addictive. Because that's how our brain's get us to do pro survival things. It gives us pleasurable, addictive chemical rewards.

So yeah. Religion can be a "drug".

HowardBThiname said:

Obviously, not everyone who is religious also has an addictive personality; many are born into religious families and never question their beliefs.

But, this thread is about those who convert to religion from a non-religious, or agnostic state.

I propose that there is a link between addictive personalities and conversion to religion. This came to my attention a few years ago when a family member who works in law enforcement explained how recruiting inmates was so easy. "They just go from one addiction, whether that be drugs, alcohol, sex or whatever, to another addition -- religion."

In fact, 12-Step recovery programs tend to focus on converting the addict to religion by claiming that they cannot control themselves, only a higher authority can. An ex-neighbor went to those meetings and she became quite inundated in the rhetoric. She stopped drinking, but only for a few years, then she went back on the bottle and claimed God had forsaken her. It was pathetic to watch.

Interestingly, I've read many other accounts of people who were heavy into booze/drugs who came out of their own accord (no religion), and their results seemed to be lasting.

Some may say that it's easy to convert this type of person because they are at a low point in their lives, but, I think it's more likely that they can be converted because they were addictive personalities to begin with.

What do others think? Can a person who is mentally strong and happy be converted as easily as one who is an addictive personality?

I'm really interested in hearing the views of others.

Click to expand...

I think you are right but it does not need to be an unhappy addict. Any addictive personality will do.

There are also the other catagories of "believers";

1, Those who say they believe but obviously don't, it's just socially convienient for them to do so. My wife's friend, having failed to find a suitable husband in night clubs (she like them good looking and she is well....), became christian for the period of time it took her to get hold of a good looking virgin.

2, Those who find that religion wil allow them a mental forgivness for sins especially lying. The idea that every body is the same within thee religious comunity, all lying, means that they can put politeness before truth.

WCH said:

IMO, we all have some level of addictive personality. However, conversion is quite different from acceptance.

We *accept Christ as our Lord and Savior. *Conversion sounds more like brain-washing.

Click to expand...

You can have a level of zero.

And *accept Christ as our Lord and Savior. * sounds like a useful hypnotic mantra to me. Bit like the other mantras used in christianity, typically;

Ahmen/hallelujah.

Peace of the Lord be upon you/Praise the lord.

Then the Lords prayer as the long one.

WCH said:

Acceptance, to me, is a personal decision to give yourself over to the Lord, allowing faith in his word to dictate your existence. [and beyond]

Conversion, to me, is being coerced by others [worldly beings] allowing them to control what you believe and think. [Obviously, I'm not a fan of organized religion]

The weak minded and easily persuaded do make themselves open to the latter.

Click to expand...

All good points. There are some very bright people who are spiritual, and even religious to some extent. I agree that the weak minded are easy targets for those who set out to convert. I'm not sure, however, that their conversion isn't in their best interest. It some cases, I think it can replace old patterns and be a lifeline to a better future.

What if...? said:

Supposedly religion is a big dopamine high. Listening to music and singing also deliver dopamine.

The anticipation of reward. Follow these rules now and you'll be rewarded after you die.

Money, sex, power, risk taking. These are all addictive. Because that's how our brain's get us to do pro survival things. It gives us pleasurable, addictive chemical rewards.

So yeah. Religion can be a "drug".

Click to expand...

Bringing out the "science" behind the phenomenon is interesting. I believe I heard once about a denomination that danced or made loud noises, or something. Anyway, it put them into an altered state, which they then attributed to being visited by the Holy Spirit.

It's an interesting field of study to be sure.

Tim the plumber said:

I think you are right but it does not need to be an unhappy addict. Any addictive personality will do.

Click to expand...

True, happy addicts will still gravitate toward that sort of thing, I would think.

There are also the other catagories of "believers";

1, Those who say they believe but obviously don't, it's just socially convienient for them to do so. My wife's friend, having failed to find a suitable husband in night clubs (she like them good looking and she is well....), became christian for the period of time it took her to get hold of a good looking virgin.

Click to expand...

LOL -- that is really funny! I can imagine that.

2, Those who find that religion wil allow them a mental forgivness for sins especially lying. The idea that every body is the same within thee religious comunity, all lying, means that they can put politeness before truth.

Click to expand...

Another great aspect! If you can be forgiven for your sins -- go right ahead and sin -- then, just ask for forgiveness. Guys like Jim Bakker and Jimmy Swaggart come to mind.

HowardBThiname said:

True, happy addicts will still gravitate toward that sort of thing, I would think.



LOL -- that is really funny! I can imagine that.



Another great aspect! If you can be forgiven for your sins -- go right ahead and sin -- then, just ask for forgiveness. Guys like Jim Bakker and Jimmy Swaggart come to mind.

Click to expand...

I find that the more religious a person is the more they are diss-associated from truth. Just does not apply them when inconvienent.

What if...? said:

Supposedly religion is a big dopamine high. Listening to music and singing also deliver dopamine.

The anticipation of reward. Follow these rules now and you'll be rewarded after you die.

Money, sex, power, risk taking. These are all addictive. Because that's how our brain's get us to do pro survival things. It gives us pleasurable, addictive chemical rewards.

So yeah. Religion can be a "drug".

Click to expand...

It's exactly that. Scientists have done fMRIs of the religious having "religious experiences" and the fMRI looks exactly like someone on drugs. There is no difference.

Tim the plumber said:

You can have a level of zero.

Click to expand...

I have a totally non-addictive personality. Many decades ago, I smoked for a while until I realized just how stupid it was to trade my health for "popularity" so I quit cold turkey and never bothered with it again. Same with drinking. I used to drink "socially". One day, after going out to a bar with a friend for some beers, I decided this is just stupid so I stopped cold turkey and never had another drink. That was more than 30 years ago. I just don't have it in me to be addicted to anything.

Tim the plumber said:

I find that the more religious a person is the more they are diss-associated from truth. Just does not apply them when inconvienent.

Click to expand...

There have been scientific studies which show that the more religious you are, the more likely you are to fall for scams and pseudo-science of all kinds. When you buy into one load of nonsense, your critical and skeptical faculties whither.

Cephus said:

It's exactly that. Scientists have done fMRIs of the religious having "religious experiences" and the fMRI looks exactly like someone on drugs. There is no difference.

Click to expand...

Dopamine is released when cocaine is used.

If you know people who use cocaine, dopamine, and other neurotransmitter, addicts are prone to the same behaviors.

Cephus said:

There have been scientific studies which show that the more religious you are, the more likely you are to fall for scams and pseudo-science of all kinds. When you buy into one load of nonsense, your critical and skeptical faculties whither.

Click to expand...

Umm...

I don't know about that. I inhabit the global warming section as a skeptic. I find the sterotype Liberal/Green/atheist/socialist/right on type to be religious in their thinking in that area of life. Often they can be fine otherwise but just lose all ability to think in that area. I have encountered a similar thing with an other wise very clever Christian with arguments of faith. I think the need for identity can overide the ability to switch to seeing both sodes of the argument.

Tim the plumber said:

You can have a level of zero.

And *accept Christ as our Lord and Savior. * sounds like a useful hypnotic mantra to me. Bit like the other mantras used in christianity, typically;

Ahmen/hallelujah.

Peace of the Lord be upon you/Praise the lord.

Then the Lords prayer as the long one.

Click to expand...

If you post here, I doubt you're a zero.

"Accept" to me, is a personal relationship with God. No third parties or middle men.

WCH said:

If you post here, I doubt you're a zero.

"Accept" to me, is a personal relationship with God. No third parties or middle men.

Click to expand...

How is it any different than claiming to have a personal relationship with Santa Claus?

HowardBThiname said:

All good points. There are some very bright people who are spiritual, and even religious to some extent. I agree that the weak minded are easy targets for those who set out to convert. I'm not sure, however, that their conversion isn't in their best interest. It some cases, I think it can replace old patterns and be a lifeline to a better future.

Click to expand...

I was lucky enough to have been shown the path years before my acceptance. I had plenty of issues with addiction beforehand.

Cephus said:

How is it any different than claiming to have a personal relationship with Santa Claus?

Click to expand...

If that's your chosen deity......

WCH said:

If that's your chosen deity......

Click to expand...

Why would anyone in their right mind pick an imaginary man in the sky (or the North Pole) to bow down to?

Cephus said:

Why would anyone in their right mind pick an imaginary man in the sky (or the North Pole) to bow down to?

Click to expand...

Why would anyone want to deny a person right to do so?

HowardBThiname said:

Obviously, not everyone who is religious also has an addictive personality; many are born into religious families and never question their beliefs.

But, this thread is about those who convert to religion from a non-religious, or agnostic state.

I propose that there is a link between addictive personalities and conversion to religion. This came to my attention a few years ago when a family member who works in law enforcement explained how recruiting inmates was so easy. "They just go from one addiction, whether that be drugs, alcohol, sex or whatever, to another addition -- religion."

In fact, 12-Step recovery programs tend to focus on converting the addict to religion by claiming that they cannot control themselves, only a higher authority can. An ex-neighbor went to those meetings and she became quite inundated in the rhetoric. She stopped drinking, but only for a few years, then she went back on the bottle and claimed God had forsaken her. It was pathetic to watch.

Interestingly, I've read many other accounts of people who were heavy into booze/drugs who came out of their own accord (no religion), and their results seemed to be lasting.

Some may say that it's easy to convert this type of person because they are at a low point in their lives, but, I think it's more likely that they can be converted because they were addictive personalities to begin with.

What do others think? Can a person who is mentally strong and happy be converted as easily as one who is an addictive personality?

I'm really interested in hearing the views of others.

Click to expand...

I have a friend who's in AA (13 years now). When she was in her 2nd year some guy came in and basically started trying to recruit people into a nearby Christian church. They put an end to that, but the Christian overtones were there in the program before and after that.

Cephus said:

I have a totally non-addictive personality. Many decades ago, I smoked for a while until I realized just how stupid it was to trade my health for "popularity" so I quit cold turkey and never bothered with it again. Same with drinking. I used to drink "socially". One day, after going out to a bar with a friend for some beers, I decided this is just stupid so I stopped cold turkey and never had another drink. That was more than 30 years ago. I just don't have it in me to be addicted to anything.

Click to expand...

I did the same thing with cigarettes, but how long is "a while"? I smoked 5 years, 0.5 - 2 packs/day, so I definitely had to fight through a withdrawal period. (Mainly consisting of two weeks of ignoring mental whispers along the lines of "who are they to tell you not to smoke? You can do what you want. Besides, withdrawal isn't so bad. You could do this at any time" and, the worst bit, waking up every 30-60 minutes every night because, in a dream, I had decided to smoke again. I'd wake up sucking in pillow, quite literally).

I ask because nicotine is physically addictive as well as psychologically addictive. So while someone who isn't psychologically addicted isn't likely to have the same oral fixation about smoke inhalation, place/time triggers, etc., they'll still have to deal with the physical symptoms and any resulting mental effects.