Atheism: How Sure are You Gods Do not Exist?

JC Callender said:

Why do you think someone would make up Jesus in order to con people?

Click to expand...

Really? You're kidding. Right?

Ntharotep said:

I was going to skip this because the thread clearly asks for Atheist opinions but I noticed that other agnostics chimed in.
I lean towards the improbability of the Biblical God (partly because of scientific evidence and partly because, emotionally, I just don't want to believe that something like that might exist, especially the Old Testament version).
I have studied a number of religions, non-theist Buddhism being a favorite and probably the closest to my tastes.
I cannot say with 100% certainty that there are no gods, be it the God of Abraham, Allah, Shiva, the theistic Buddha, etc. (thus agnostic).

Click to expand...

Maybe they all exist and take turns judging people upon their death. Whichever gods number gets picked they get to make the judgement on the person who died, no matter the persons religion in relation to the God.

I like something I read in the other thread. The gods we invented so far are all fictional. I believe that 100%. And, any super-being which may exist that somehow has the attributes of any of these man-made gods would be purely coincidental.

Furthermore, that hypothetical being is probably not a god. It's probably just a being far superior to us. We can also be sure, at the very least, that this super-being is not going to match any one particular description of god (pick a religion, any religion) to a T. Therefore I can say without question that I am 100% certain that "gods" do not exist.

An insightful read wrapped in wit.




" In the beginning was the Word. And the Word was: 'Hey, you!' This is the Discworld, after all, and religion is a controversial business. Everyone has their own opinion, and indeed their own gods, of every shape and size, and all elbowing for space at the top. In such a competitive environment, shape and size can be pretty crucial to make one's presence felt. So it's certainly not helpful to be reduced to appearing in the form of a tortoise, a manifestation far below god-like status in anyone's book.

In such instances, you need an acolyte, and fast: for the Great God Om, Brutha the novice is the Chosen One – or at least the only One available. He wants peace and justice and brotherly love. He also wants the Inquisition to stop torturing him now, please..."

JC Callender said:

So you believe Pope Francis made up Jesus?

Click to expand...

What is it with the religious??? When I make a clear statement they always twist it around to mean something else!

You clearly fully understood that my point is that the preist has an easier life than the poor peasant working on the fields and that for the charlatin the life of a priest is highly attractive. That this is and has always been the case and thus there is a clear motivation to make up or more probably embelish the life of Jesus.

Who do you think you are fooling by deliberately mis-understanding the point of my post? Clearly you are not going to be fooled. It is npot going to work on me and those bystanders who read this are going to think you are deliberately disengenious. So who's benefit is your silly retort for?

JC Callender said:

Do you believe the Essenes may have done it for political reasons...to gain more control? See, I totally understand how and why someone could claim to do something manipulative under the cover of being a Christian for personal gain and I can easily see why religious people do bad things....we all sin. I just have a hard time believing someone made up the story of Jesus for personal or political gain because Jesus certainly wasn't pandering to the wealthy for money. He was admonishing the serious religious people of the day. He was helping and associating with the lowliest people in society. I don't understand why someone would come up with a story like that and have all of these apostles and all of these different books written....for what gain, especially at the time when the result was that Christians were often persecuted?

Click to expand...

I certainly don't have those answers but one of the reasons Christianity appeals to leaders is because Jesus didn't "pander to the wealthy" as you say. He told people to be satisfied with what their lot in life. A self-denying person is a person who will not challenge the wealthy. How much more difficult must it be for Kim Jong Un to force his people to accept lives of never being important than for a leader whose citizenry accepts these tenets on faith?

There is a lot of speculation as to why someone would create the Jesus story, and some theories hold that whoever created it - did it to temper Pagan sects who were around at the time. It's a possibility that the creator of the story included birth of a virgin, resurrection, and even communion, which is symbolic cannibalism, to convince the pagans to modify their beliefs. Easter is, after all, originally a pagan fertility holiday and we still find symbols of fertility in bunnies and eggs.
There was a book written more than 100 years ago, entitled the World's 16 Crucified Saviors, and because it's so old, it should be in the public domain and you could probably find a free copy to download. I have the hardback version. The book cites saviors who lived before Jesus, and many of them employ the same tenets - the guy is a god/man (spirtual father, virgin mother), he sacrifices himself for his people, descends into hades for 3-days (or more), rises again. In a few of the earlier stories, the followers of this teacher would eat the dead god/man. In the Jesus story, it's just symbolic, although the Roman Catholic Church still teaches the doctrine of Transubstantiation, which means the wine and wafer turn to the actual flesh and blood of Jesus in the tummy. Gross, huh?

Why did any of those stories come about? It's interesting that most died out and none of them took off like the Jesus story, but, they are very similar.

My guess would be it was to control the people in some way. As I said, perhaps in this case, the pagans. Of course, I can't know anything for sure.