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No Bible Cavemen

Logicman

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My theory on Adam and Eve and their descendants is that they were the first hominids who were created in the image and likeness of God with an eternal spirit (Genesis 1:26; 3:22, etc.) - that Neanderthals, etc. - were separate lines of beings who were not created in God's image and likeness.

My theory is supported IN THE BIBLE by the fact that Adam and Eve - the "first man and woman" - had a developed language from their earliest existence. In addition, the Bible says this in Genesis 4:17 about their son Cain:

"Cain made love to his wife, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Enoch. Cain was then building a city, and he named it after his son Enoch."

So already, in the 2nd generation, we have the earliest known Biblical figures speaking a developed language and endeavoring to build a city. This requires a higher level of intelligence than can be found in evolution's early hominid species. I would argue from a Biblical standpoint that it's God-given intelligence.

Certainly, if Genesis is accurate, the earliest Biblical figures were not cavemen.

Discussion...
 
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And if cows could speak, read and write, they'd also probably state that they were made in gods image.
 
My theory on Adam and Eve and their descendants is that they were the first hominids who were created in the image and likeness of God - that Neanderthals, etc. - were separate lines of beings who were not created in God's image and likeness.

My theory is supported IN THE BIBLE by the fact that Adam and Eve - the "first man and woman" - had a developed language from their earliest existence. In addition, the Bible says this in Genesis 4:17 about their son Cain:

"Cain made love to his wife, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Enoch. Cain was then building a city, and he named it after his son Enoch."

So already, in the 2nd generation, we have the earliest known Biblical figures speaking a developed language and endeavoring to build a city. This requires a higher level of intelligence than can be found in evolution's early hominid species. I would argue from a Biblical standpoint that it's God-given intelligence.

Certainly, if Genesis is accurate, the earliest Biblical figures were not cavemen.

Discussion...

You don't think it might be allegorical?
 
From a purely religious approach I would agree with you that your logic is sound enough.
For me, though, there are too many variables. And before I continue, I do not mean any disrespect to anyone's beliefs in my example.
IF Genesis is correct to me is like saying if the Celestial Bureaucracy of Ancient China is correct then the dragons created the world and possibly man, if Taoism is correct then Tao is the energy ultimately behind creation, if the Norse were correct then Ask and Embla were created by the two trees found by the sons of Bor, if the followers of the "Star People" are correct then humans, evolutionary and the final product were experiments for seeding the Earth by aliens...and so on.
I don't have that draw to Christianity that (I once had AND) makes me feel in my heart of hearts that this is necessarily the truth. I don't have that draw to any creation theory honestly.
Its a matter of faith and though I don't know where mine lies, it isn't strong enough to say, yes you are on to something.
But, again, that's just me.
 
You don't think it might be allegorical?

I suppose it could be, but Jesus apparently didn't think so. He spoke about Adam and Eve and others in Genesis like they were real people.
 
My theory on Adam and Eve and their descendants is that they were the first hominids who were created in the image and likeness of God with an eternal spirit (Genesis 1:26; 3:22, etc.) - that Neanderthals, etc. - were separate lines of beings who were not created in God's image and likeness.

My theory is supported IN THE BIBLE by the fact that Adam and Eve - the "first man and woman" - had a developed language from their earliest existence. In addition, the Bible says this in Genesis 4:17 about their son Cain:

"Cain made love to his wife, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Enoch. Cain was then building a city, and he named it after his son Enoch."

So already, in the 2nd generation, we have the earliest known Biblical figures speaking a developed language and endeavoring to build a city. This requires a higher level of intelligence than can be found in evolution's early hominid species. I would argue from a Biblical standpoint that it's God-given intelligence.

Certainly, if Genesis is accurate, the earliest Biblical figures were not cavemen.

Discussion...

That's not a theory it's a speculation.
 
I suppose it could be, but Jesus apparently didn't think so. He spoke about Adam and Eve and others in Genesis like they were real people.

A fictional person confirming other fictional people's existence?
 
That's not a theory it's a speculation.
Theory: 1.a supposition or a system of ideas intended to explain something, especially one based on general principles independent of the thing to be explained
Synonym of Supposition-speculation.
 
I suppose it could be, but Jesus apparently didn't think so. He spoke about Adam and Eve and others in Genesis like they were real people.

Maybe he just thought people would know an allegory, when they saw one.
 
A fictional person confirming other fictional people's existence?

Where's your evidence Jesus is a fictional person? IMO the only people who believe that bs are those who haven't done their homework.
 
I suppose it could be, but Jesus apparently didn't think so. He spoke about Adam and Eve and others in Genesis like they were real people.

Because he lived over 2000 years ago and did not know we evolved from ape like creatures we have now found fossils of. He also thought the Sun revolved around the Earth I'm sure. Both bibles are nothing but records of the primitive beliefs of an ancient world before science and technology found the real answers to these questions. Even the Pope agrees with this and has warned us not to take it literally when it comes to creation especially. You do know that he Pope is infallible don't you?
 
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My theory on Adam and Eve and their descendants is that they were the first hominids who were created in the image and likeness of God with an eternal spirit (Genesis 1:26; 3:22, etc.) - that Neanderthals, etc. - were separate lines of beings who were not created in God's image and likeness.

My theory is supported IN THE BIBLE by the fact that Adam and Eve - the "first man and woman" - had a developed language from their earliest existence. In addition, the Bible says this in Genesis 4:17 about their son Cain:

"Cain made love to his wife, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Enoch. Cain was then building a city, and he named it after his son Enoch."

So already, in the 2nd generation, we have the earliest known Biblical figures speaking a developed language and endeavoring to build a city. This requires a higher level of intelligence than can be found in evolution's early hominid species. I would argue from a Biblical standpoint that it's God-given intelligence.

Certainly, if Genesis is accurate, the earliest Biblical figures were not cavemen.

Discussion...

Bolded is where all this nonsense fails
 
So what follows then (assuming that Genesis is accurate)?

That sapiens sapiens took to cave dwelling later on?
 
My theory on Adam and Eve and their descendants is that they were the first hominids who were created in the image and likeness of God with an eternal spirit (Genesis 1:26; 3:22, etc.) - that Neanderthals, etc. - were separate lines of beings who were not created in God's image and likeness.
1) OT / Hebrew Bible says nothing about God creating Neanderthals or earlier hominids, or how they became extinct -- an odd omission, to say the least
2) Genesis says nothing about evolution, or natural selection, or DNA
3) Contemporary genetics doesn't support the idea that we were all descended from one single male, who reproduced with one single female
4) Neanderthals may make up 1% or more of human DNA -- another odd omission from the OT, no?
5) Neanderthals (and H. floresiensis, and other ancestors) very closely resembled humans


My theory is supported IN THE BIBLE by the fact that Adam and Eve - the "first man and woman" - had a developed language from their earliest existence.
It's not supported by Genesis. Nothing in Genesis would direct anyone to search caves in southern France looking for extinct human ancestors.

At best, you might claim it is not ruled out by Genesis. However, there really is no question that the archaeological and genetic (and cognitive and psychological and neurological and biological) evidence is incompatible with a literal reading of Genesis. As an allegory, there is far less conflict. Or, you can just chalk up Genesis to the human desire for a creation myth.


already, in the 2nd generation, we have the earliest known Biblical figures speaking a developed language and endeavoring to build a city.
OK then. Where is it?

How many "cities" do you know were inhabited by a dozen people?

Current conjecture is that humans developed the ability to use some type of language anywhere from 10,000 to 60,000 years ago. Does that fit your timeline?

The earliest human settlements we know of are in Ethiopia, and date back anywhere from 130,000 to 195,000 years. Does that fit your timeline?


Certainly, if Genesis is accurate, the earliest Biblical figures were not cavemen.
"Cavemen" is an outdated stereotype. Few early humans, neanderthals, ancestors etc lived in caves; they were mostly inhospitable, due to the presence of animals like bears, and poor environmental conditions (cold and damp).

Also, if you're talking about human ancestors, that refers to several different species over a roughly 1 million year timespan. E.g. the earliest modern humans probably evolved in Ethiopia; earlier species in other parts of Africa. You need to be more specific as to which species you're discussing.
 
My theory on Adam and Eve and their descendants is that they were the first hominids who were created in the image and likeness of God with an eternal spirit (Genesis 1:26; 3:22, etc.) - that Neanderthals, etc. - were separate lines of beings who were not created in God's image and likeness.

My theory is supported IN THE BIBLE by the fact that Adam and Eve - the "first man and woman" - had a developed language from their earliest existence. In addition, the Bible says this in Genesis 4:17 about their son Cain:

"Cain made love to his wife, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Enoch. Cain was then building a city, and he named it after his son Enoch."

So already, in the 2nd generation, we have the earliest known Biblical figures speaking a developed language and endeavoring to build a city. This requires a higher level of intelligence than can be found in evolution's early hominid species. I would argue from a Biblical standpoint that it's God-given intelligence.

Certainly, if Genesis is accurate, the earliest Biblical figures were not cavemen.

Discussion...

I've been long curious why Cain was even motivated to build a city. Where were, what 5 people on earth at that time?

Adam, Eve, Cain, Seth, Enoch
 
if Genesis is accurate, the earliest Biblical figures were not cavemen.

And there's the rub. IF Genesis is accurate, but given measurements and the fact that we do know there were cavemen, it seems like that assumption (Genesis being accurate) doesn't pan out.
 
On a side note, Passover 4001 BC is likely the date Adam and Eve left the garden(ancient sacred calendar expert John Pratt has provided evidence in support of that date Beginning of Mortality). I started a thread awhile back that gave what i think is overwhelming evidence that Passover 1 BC was the birth of Christ. i believe there is a Jewish tradition that states from Adam to the Messiah is 4000 years. These dates are exactly 4000 years to the day apart.
 
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My theory on Adam and Eve and their descendants is that they were the first hominids who were created in the image and likeness of God with an eternal spirit (Genesis 1:26; 3:22, etc.) - that Neanderthals, etc. - were separate lines of beings who were not created in God's image and likeness.

My theory is supported IN THE BIBLE by the fact that Adam and Eve - the "first man and woman" - had a developed language from their earliest existence. In addition, the Bible says this in Genesis 4:17 about their son Cain:

"Cain made love to his wife, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Enoch. Cain was then building a city, and he named it after his son Enoch."

So already, in the 2nd generation, we have the earliest known Biblical figures speaking a developed language and endeavoring to build a city. This requires a higher level of intelligence than can be found in evolution's early hominid species. I would argue from a Biblical standpoint that it's God-given intelligence.

Certainly, if Genesis is accurate, the earliest Biblical figures were not cavemen.

Discussion...

Riddle me this Logicman. If Adam and Eve were the first people and Cain was their son, where did Cain's wife come from?
 
And there's the rub. IF Genesis is accurate, but given measurements and the fact that we do know there were cavemen, it seems like that assumption (Genesis being accurate) doesn't pan out.

Both could be correct if the garden of eden was not temporal and fallen like the rest of the earth and when Adam and Eve departed they entered into a world that had been going on for a long time. They could be the first parents of the modern human family, beginning about 4001 b.c.
 
Riddle me this Logicman. If Adam and Eve were the first people and Cain was their son, where did Cain's wife come from?

Not Logicman but just because the Bible only mentions Cain and Abel doesn't mean Adam and Eve didn't have more sons and daughters. The LDS Book of Moses clarifies this:
1 And it came to pass that after I, the Lord God, had driven them out, that Adam began to till the earth, and to have dominion over all the beasts of the field, and to eat his bread by the sweat of his brow, as I the Lord had commanded him. And Eve, also, his wife, did labor with him.

2 And Adam knew his wife, and she bare unto him sons and daughters, and they began to multiply and to replenish the earth.

3 And from that time forth, the sons and daughters of Adam began to divide two and two in the land, and to till the land, and to tend flocks, and they also begat sons and daughters.
 
Both could be correct if the garden of eden was not temporal and fallen like the rest of the earth and when Adam and Eve departed they entered into a world that had been going on for a long time. They could be the first parents of the modern human family, beginning about 4001 b.c.

It's not a true story.
 
My theory on Adam and Eve and their descendants is that they were the first hominids who were created in the image and likeness of God with an eternal spirit (Genesis 1:26; 3:22, etc.) - that Neanderthals, etc. - were separate lines of beings who were not created in God's image and likeness.

My theory is supported IN THE BIBLE by the fact that Adam and Eve - the "first man and woman" - had a developed language from their earliest existence. In addition, the Bible says this in Genesis 4:17 about their son Cain:

"Cain made love to his wife, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Enoch. Cain was then building a city, and he named it after his son Enoch."

So already, in the 2nd generation, we have the earliest known Biblical figures speaking a developed language and endeavoring to build a city. This requires a higher level of intelligence than can be found in evolution's early hominid species. I would argue from a Biblical standpoint that it's God-given intelligence.

Certainly, if Genesis is accurate, the earliest Biblical figures were not cavemen.

Discussion...
Except for the Fact that every human alive today has Neanderthal genes in their body because we interbreed, Opps, so much for that argument.
 
I have facts and reality on my side.

You have no facts that the Garden of Eden or Adam and Eve did not exist. You have faith, just as I have faith in the scriptures. Now I believe what geologists say about the age of the earth and evolution, so do not try and make it a debate on that, I just also believe there was a Adam and Eve.
 
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