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Do you consider the killing of animals murder?

What about their society? What makes them different from us?

What makes animals (or animal "society") different from us? Is that a serious question? You don't know?
 
Philosophically, when we determine to define this word: Intelligence, we must ultimately conclude that there is as much intelligence in an apple seed as there is in the collective mind of all mankind.

Thus this assertion that the vegetarian is possessed of greater virtue is patently false, based on false premise, for who are you to determine the value of life one over another?

This is a moral question, btw, that most living in rural areas are forced to confront at a very young age: Whether it's a chicken or a carrot, corn or cattle, etc, we must all kill to survive. And the choice is yours. Like everything else though we've found convenient ways to insulate ourselves from all that is distasteful, discomforting, threatening. Very few stop to consider these things while squeezing a peach or picking out pork loins in Piggly Wiggly; we have removed ourselves, distanced ourselves, from this act of taking life.

When speaking of human life, there are exceptions to this thing of "murder," too. (Which we assume is thus one of the defining differences between us and Jesus.)
 
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I have been thinking about this a lot.

I do not think that it is a good idea to hunt animals now that humans dont need to do it. I dont think humans should kill for fun. I know many people that enjoy hunting and they are not bad people but in my opinion killing for no reason is wrong and uncivilized. If society makes it clear to hunters that killing animals for fun is unacceptable then less people will want to do it. While ever it is considered acceptable to hunt there will be a percentage of people that will do it. Where I live ( rural Australia ) it used to be considered pretty funny to kill a cat but a few years ago now some people set fire to a cat and it was in the media and most people were outraged and since then it seems that there are a lot less people killing cats and thinking that it is funny. Or if they do they keep quiet about it.

It annoys me to see people get so hysterical about some guy killing a lion but in a way it is good because humans shouldnt kill for fun and humans that do it should know that the majority finds it to be unacceptable and uncivilized. Sometimes it seems like many humans care more about a stupid lion that would eat them in a second than a human. Lions are beasts and they do things like kill all the male offspring of a new female member of their harem. I care more about a human hunter than some stupid lion but I think that hunters should be encouraged to stop killing lions because us humans are better than stupid lions.

The answer to the problem is to have all of the worlds wildlife protected in enclosed reserves. Let the animals work it out themselves. If any of them go extinct we let them. It is none of our business what happens in the enclosed reserves. No more National Geographic bullcrap.

And all people should be encouraged to get rid of their pets. Domestic pet animals are abominations. The only animals we should keep are the domestic ones we need for food. And they should be killed kosher style but stunned before throat cut.

I am not Jewish but it seems like there is more to kosher killing than making sure the meat is good. We shouldnt kill unless we need to and if we do need to we should not be barbarians about it.
 
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What about their society? What makes them different from us? Elephants bury their own with leaves and grass and watch over them for some time. They come back to visit as well. 5 Animals With a Moral Compass | Animal Emotions

Whether or not killing a particular animal is morally wrong is a different question from whether or not it is murder. I do not believe it is murder but I do believe the unnecessary killing of an animal is wrong. And the more sentient the creature the more wrong it is.
 
I don't know exactly what I believe. I have no problem believing we evolved from something lesser but there are still mysteries to evolution as well.

There's no real mysteries left in evolution to doubt that evolution is a natural process that happens in all organic life. The only "mysteries" left might be the "whats" and "hows" but the evidence for the theory life is organic to the environment around it is insurmountable.

The reason I ask evolutionists is because if we're basically animals but just more cognitively advanced, then where exactly do we draw the line for murder?

Drawing the line for murder as a crime is simple. You draw it at the unlawful killing of a human being. But I think it should be pointed out that in nature, animals kill other animals for more than just survival.

Can a certain animal, let's say a chimp for instance, ever be taught to be smart enough to be considered murdered when killed?

A chimp could be taught a lot of things, but it still wouldn't be a human.

Or what if a severely retarded human being is on the same cognitive level as a chimp?

Are you under the assumption that anyone who believes in evolution is also a believer in eugenics? No, I don't believe in killing a human being that is mentally ill or retarded.

I personally will stick with humans=murder, animals=killing, but it's just an interesting question to me.

So all killing of humans is murder, even in self-defense? Should war be an international crime?
 
Depends on which animal, and the context.

I think killing someone's pet should be murder. Pets have a different level of social privilege than, say, animals raised for food.

I grew up on a farm and we would bond with all of our slaughter animals, but they were still fodder... eventually. Our family dog had a higher status than the steers, but we still treated them all equally (while they were alive). Wouldn't call killing them murder though.

But when sickos abduct animals to do cruel at-home experiments on them, or murder their neighbor's dog because they're barking, then yeah I'd consider that murder.

Murder laws are all about intent. Until intent is proven, it's just homicide. This should point out to everyone how arbitrary our definitions of life and right-to-life are. It all comes down to well crafted arguments and little else.
 
There's no real mysteries left in evolution to doubt that evolution is a natural process that happens in all organic life. The only "mysteries" left might be the "whats" and "hows" but the evidence for the theory life is organic to the environment around it is insurmountable.



Drawing the line for murder as a crime is simple. You draw it at the unlawful killing of a human being. But I think it should be pointed out that in nature, animals kill other animals for more than just survival.



A chimp could be taught a lot of things, but it still wouldn't be a human.



Are you under the assumption that anyone who believes in evolution is also a believer in eugenics? No, I don't believe in killing a human being that is mentally ill or retarded.



So all killing of humans is murder, even in self-defense? Should war be an international crime?

No, I meant that murder can occur with humans and not with animals.
 
Do you consider it murder when someone purposely kills an animal? The question is intended for evolutionists but anyone can feel free to answer.

I put them on the same level morally. If a person capable of killing and torturing an animal, is capable of doing the same to a person. Many serial killers were known to abuse, torture, and kill animals.
 
What does evolution have to do with murder?
 
Do you consider it murder when someone purposely kills an animal? The question is intended for evolutionists but anyone can feel free to answer.

Nope. Murder is defined as killing not permitted by law. So long as it is legal, it can't be murder.
 
That's the facts of the matter.

Murder is a legal term.

There is literally no debate to be had here.

Great, then I'll assume from now on that you inherently believe with all of your heart in every law that's ever been passed in a court of law.
 
Uhm first, murder has a definition and killing an animal doesn't fit it, secondly why would the answer be different for evolutionist, lastly is anybody in america not an evolutionist?

materialists may claim we are all animals
 
No. Not legally or ethically. I'm not a huge fan of sport hunting, when I hunted we ate what we killed, but it's a useful tool for game management.

And yes I believe in evolution.
 
materialists may claim we are all animals

I must be a materialist then because i often can't see any difference in behavior between human beings and other animals.
 
I must be a materialist then because i often can't see any difference in behavior between human beings and other animals.

so dont expect me to treat you like human being
 
materialists may claim we are all animals

Now, it all depends. From a physiological point of view, we are. However, it seems to me that when someone proclaims 'we are not an animal', it is taking it from a spiritual point of view, so there is a disconnect between the people who are looking at it from a physiological point of view. and the spiritual/emotional/intellectual point of view.
 
Great, then I'll assume from now on that you inherently believe with all of your heart in every law that's ever been passed in a court of law.


There is a difference from looking at definitions, and between looking to see if a law is correct, equitable and fair. People who misuse terms are not addressing the right issue.
 
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