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Atheism has any value in terms of humanism ?

Medusa said:
on the contrary many atheists never stop blaming god (imaginary god they dont believe ) for the evilness in this life..interesting but many atheists really believe in god more than any believer in this respect.if there was a god he wouldnt let children die of hunger.its one of their arguments now tell me how you put all the burden onto man
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Then they aren't atheists. Sorry, but no atheist blames an invisible skydaddy for anything, ever. Just doesn't happen, or they are lying about being atheist as most xians lie about being xian. That last aspect is discussed in another thread, so no point in going into it here. Suffices to say, no atheist blames skydaddies, or fairies, or brownies, or Zeus, or Aphrodite for their problems. Do they say "Gawd Dammit" and "Jeezzuz Christ!," yeah we do. But they have no more actual meaning that any other curse that really has nothing to do with it's definition.
 
Medusa said:
on the contrary many atheists never stop blaming god (imaginary god they dont believe ) for the evilness in this life..interesting but many atheists really believe in god more than any believer in this respect.if there was a god he wouldnt let children die of hunger.its one of their arguments now tell me how you put all the burden onto man
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Wrong. (Is your shift key broken?)
 
joG said:
Why should it have more or other apriori value than any other religion? I don't see it.
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Or, why is atheism being compared with religion in the first place? Atheism is not having faith, while religion is having faith.
 
DDD said:
Or, why is atheism being compared with religion in the first place? Atheism is not having faith, while religion is having faith.
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And I thought that Atheism was the faith in those having faith being wrong! My mistake! ;)
 
Summerwind said:
Do they say "Gawd Dammit" and "Jeezzuz Christ!," yeah we do. But they have no more actual meaning that any other curse that really has nothing to do with it's definition.
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I actually use: Chesses Fried Crisps to express my frustrations, awe, or anger.
 
Medusa said:
on the contrary many atheists never stop blaming god (imaginary god they dont believe ) for the evilness in this life..interesting but many atheists really believe in god more than any believer in this respect.if there was a god he wouldnt let children die of hunger.its one of their arguments now tell me how you put all the burden onto man
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No, they're not blaming God, but it is a bad argument against the existence of God.
Saying "if there was a God, then it would be like X…" is not the same thing as saying there is a God but he's not like X.
 
DDD said:
Or, why is atheism being compared with religion in the first place? Atheism is not having faith, while religion is having faith.
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Atheism is very much a substitute religion for some people. Most of the "new atheist" types are of this sort. You find them organizing charity drives, for example, to show that atheists are charitable. They are very much into proselytism. They tend to preach that religions are harmful, all bad. You seldom draw a real non-religious atheist into these sorts of activities. They are indifferent to the controversy.
 
LowDown said:
Atheism is very much a substitute religion for some people. Most of the "new atheist" types are of this sort. You find them organizing charity drives, for example, to show that atheists are charitable. They are very much into proselytism. They tend to preach that religions are harmful, all bad. You seldom draw a real non-religious atheist into these sorts of activities. They are indifferent to the controversy.
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We don't have any of them over here. I just assume that everyone I know is an atheist. None of them ever mention religion or go to church. Religion is irrelevant to daily life here.
 
Why would an atheist engage in any humanistic endeavors? If when you die, that's end of it, why should you care about what happens when you're gone?? Why should you care about other people if all they are is an ~80 year long blip in the universe and therefore completely inconsequential in the grand scheme of things?? If we no different than the mosquito you killed lat night after it bit you on the foot for the fourth time, then why not just make your own life the best it can be and forget about everyone else?
 
faithful_servant said:
Why would an atheist engage in any humanistic endeavors? If when you die, that's end of it, why should you care about what happens when you're gone?? Why should you care about other people if all they are is an ~80 year long blip in the universe and therefore completely inconsequential in the grand scheme of things?? If we no different than the mosquito you killed lat night after it bit you on the foot for the fourth time, then why not just make your own life the best it can be and forget about everyone else?
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This always strikes me as a bleak point of view. Do you really believe that if God were proven to not exist, all Chrisitans would abandon their humanistic endeavours?

Most people gain enjoyment by increasing or witnessing the enjoyment of others. It's why you buy birthday presents for your family, why you enjoy watching romantic films, why you keep a pet and buy it treats. Humanistic endeavours are just another form of this.

LowDown said:
Religion may not change as quickly as some would like, but it does evolve over time. That it does not respond to every fad is a feature, not a bug.
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However, the fact that it is often used to prevent such evolution ('God hates fags!') is not a bonus.
 
faithful_servant said:
Why would an atheist engage in any humanistic endeavors? If when you die, that's end of it, why should you care about what happens when you're gone?? Why should you care about other people if all they are is an ~80 year long blip in the universe and therefore completely inconsequential in the grand scheme of things?? If we no different than the mosquito you killed lat night after it bit you on the foot for the fourth time, then why not just make your own life the best it can be and forget about everyone else?
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The flaw there is that many atheists are nice people and care about their fellow human beings. Just like me.
 
faithful_servant said:
Why would an atheist engage in any humanistic endeavors? If when you die, that's end of it, why should you care about what happens when you're gone?? Why should you care about other people if all they are is an ~80 year long blip in the universe and therefore completely inconsequential in the grand scheme of things?? If we no different than the mosquito you killed lat night after it bit you on the foot for the fourth time, then why not just make your own life the best it can be and forget about everyone else?
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If eternity as a soul is waiting Christians after they die, why sho UI of they care about life on earth? If a person will spend eternity Helll, why relieve their suffering now? If they'll spend eternity in Heaven, then their suffering now is inconsequential?
 
faithful_servant said:
Why would an atheist engage in any humanistic endeavors? If when you die, that's end of it, why should you care about what happens when you're gone?? Why should you care about other people if all they are is an ~80 year long blip in the universe and therefore completely inconsequential in the grand scheme of things?? If we no different than the mosquito you killed lat night after it bit you on the foot for the fourth time, then why not just make your own life the best it can be and forget about everyone else?
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Ahh, the ol' "atheists can't be moral" arguments. It's not true. Morality is a product of intelligence and empathy, not gods.
 
faithful_servant said:
Why would an atheist engage in any humanistic endeavors? If when you die, that's end of it, why should you care about what happens when you're gone?? Why should you care about other people if all they are is an ~80 year long blip in the universe and therefore completely inconsequential in the grand scheme of things?? If we no different than the mosquito you killed lat night after it bit you on the foot for the fourth time, then why not just make your own life the best it can be and forget about everyone else?
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So atheists are incapable of love and care then?
 
iangb said:
This always strikes me as a bleak point of view. Do you really believe that if God were proven to not exist, all Chrisitans would abandon their humanistic endeavours?

Most people gain enjoyment by increasing or witnessing the enjoyment of others. It's why you buy birthday presents for your family, why you enjoy watching romantic films, why you keep a pet and buy it treats. Humanistic endeavours are just another form of this.
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So is what you're saying is that you only help others because it makes you feel good? What about doing something completely altruistic that provides you with absolutely nothing? No warm, fuzzy feeling, no expectation of any return - absolutely nothing. Could you give up everything you own to help people you despise and live in absolute misery as a result??
 
pinqy said:
If eternity as a soul is waiting Christians after they die, why sho UI of they care about life on earth? If a person will spend eternity Helll, why relieve their suffering now? If they'll spend eternity in Heaven, then their suffering now is inconsequential?
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The discussion here is about atheists, not Christians.
 
faithful_servant said:
I didn't say that, I asked a couple of questions. Care to answer them?? Others here have....
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Morality isn't unique to theists, that is the answer. Atheists are just as capable as theists of conforming to and accepting society's morals.
 
faithful_servant said:
So is what you're saying is that you only help others because it makes you feel good? What about doing something completely altruistic that provides you with absolutely nothing? No warm, fuzzy feeling, no expectation of any return - absolutely nothing. Could you give up everything you own to help people you despise and live in absolute misery as a result??
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People wouldn't give to charity if doing so made them feel bitter and angry.
 
faithful_servant said:
Why would an atheist engage in any humanistic endeavors? If when you die, that's end of it, why should you care about what happens when you're gone?? Why should you care about other people if all they are is an ~80 year long blip in the universe and therefore completely inconsequential in the grand scheme of things?? If we no different than the mosquito you killed lat night after it bit you on the foot for the fourth time, then why not just make your own life the best it can be and forget about everyone else?
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Because we recognize that the suffering that some other person experiences on the other side of the world is no different than suffering that I experience. the_recruit's suffering isn't unique or special or more deserving of being prevented. Suffering is present. Period. And it ought not happen.

What happens when I die is completely and totally irrelevant to any of that.
 
DDD said:
Or, why is atheism being compared with religion in the first place? Atheism is not having faith, while religion is having faith.
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joG said:
And I thought that Atheism was the faith in those having faith being wrong! My mistake! ;)
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DDD: you are incorrect. If an atheist believes in the healing power of crystals, or astrology or ghosts or vampires, then the atheist is using faith for his belief. There is no scientific evidence for the existence of these things.
atheism is disbelief regarding the evidence for a god claim.

joG: yes it is your mistake. Why do you think it takes faith not to believe?

FFS. For every claim ever made, the default position is not to believe. Do you understand that?

Look at it this way. If I claim the Sun is made of cheese, and if the default position for claims is belief then you must believe the Sunis made of cheese. Seems rather silly.
 
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