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the concept of God

Ikari said:
Humans have believed in many gods. No god has yet proven itself to be infinitely stable.
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Therein lies the rub. It's pretty obvious that gods are simply made up, just another construct of the human imagination.
 
calamity said:
Therein lies the rub. It's pretty obvious that gods are simply made up, just another construct of the human imagination.
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It all started with the volcano god, the thunder god and the like. Some of us have moved on.
 
zyzygy said:
It all started with the volcano god, the thunder god and the like. Some of us have moved on.
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Pretty much. What is left now is to explain all the missing pieces, from origins of life to what drove energy into forming matter. A few other things would be to determine if there is or is not a universal consciousness, if other life forms exist off-planet and if there is a method to communicate in real-time over vast distances, not to mention finding a way of traveling those distances instantaneously.
 
zyzygy said:
It all started with the volcano god, the thunder god and the like. Some of us have moved on.
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Nope, according to your extreme faith, it started with your magical and mythical abiogenesis swamp slime cell / buddy. Daddy...

That takes more faith to believe in than a religious creationist could possibly muster.

Oh ye of GREAT FAITH!!
 
Logicman said:
Nope, according to your extreme faith, it started with your magical and mythical abiogenesis swamp slime cell / buddy. Daddy...

That takes more faith to believe in than a religious creationist could possibly muster.

Oh ye of GREAT FAITH!!
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Uh, abiogenesis requires no buddy or daddy. And it takes no more faith to believe in it than some magical creator.
 
Logicman said:
You obviously have no idea, then, about the enormous complexity of a single cell.

Why Abiogenesis Is Impossible
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You got a bunch of people who don't know anyhthing about science making scientific claims. And why do you think any of that garbage is credible at all?

I mean, let's take a look at 'Dr" Jerry bergman. He got his 'Phd' from a non-accredited corrospondance university... i.e. a paper mill whose degrees aren't worth the paper they are printed on. He was fired from a job because he lied about having a degree is psychology when he didn't. so he is a repeated known liar.

And, this si the guy you want to quote as a source?? Riiiight
 
RAMOSS said:
You got a bunch of people who don't know anyhthing about science making scientific claims. And why do you think any of that garbage is credible at all?
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Typical Ramoss. Can't defeat the arguments so you go ad hominem on the source.

RAMOSS said:
I mean, let's take a look at 'Dr" Jerry bergman. He got his 'Phd' from a non-accredited corrospondance university... i.e. a paper mill whose degrees aren't worth the paper they are printed on. He was fired from a job because he lied about having a degree is psychology when he didn't. so he is a repeated known liar.

And, this si the guy you want to quote as a source?? Riiiight
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Dr. Gerald R. "Jerry" Bergman is an adjunct associate professor at Medical University of Ohio and an instructor in the Division of Arts & Sciences at Northwest State Community College in Archbold, Ohio. He teaches biochemistry, biology, chemistry and physics. He has taught at the college level for 35 years including 7 years at Bowling Green State University, 6 years at the University of Toledo, and 20 years at Northwest State. He started as a graduate student in biochemistry at Medical College of Ohio in 1985, and was later hired as an adjunct instructor and research associate in the experimental pathology department and he still is still on the faculty at MCO (now named Medical University of Ohio). He has also worked for several years as a therapist at various psychological clinics including Arlington Psychological Associates in Toledo, Ohio.

Bergman now has nine academic degrees. He obtained an Associate in Arts degree in Biology and Behavioral Science, from Oakland Community College, Bloomfield Hills, Michigan in 1967, a BSc from Wayne State University in Detroit, Michigan in 1970 where he had majors in sociology, biology, and psychology, from where he also obtained an M.Ed. in counseling and psychology in 1971 and studied for a Ph.D. in measurement and evaluation,[1] minor in psychology from Wayne State. Bergman also received an M.A. in social psychology from Bowling Green State University in 1986. In 1992 he received a Ph.D. in human biology, from Columbia Pacific University, San Rafael, California.[2] The degree is legal, but the university faced various accusations and had its accreditation removed in 1997. Some feel that the school's support of Intelligent Design in required readings may have been involved. Others believe that their support of various alternative medical treatments was a factor. The real reason is unknown. Bergman has written a detailed well documented paper on the school's fall from grace.

Bergman next received a Master of Science degree in biomedical science, from the Medical College of Ohio, Toledo, Ohio, 1999. In 2001 he obtained a Master of Public Health degree from the Northwest Ohio Consortium for Public Health (consisting of the Medical College of Ohio, the University of Toledo and Bowling Green State University). In 2004 he received another MA from Medical College of Ohio. Dr. Bergman has also completed coursework at the University of Wisconsin, Miami University in Oxford Ohio (where he was accepted into the doctoral program in chemistry, so far completing 33 semester hours) and the University of California, Berkeley. He now has over 700 publications in a variety of scientific and popular journals, plus 20 books and monographs. His work has now been translated into 12 languages and he has spoken widely in the United States, Canada and Europe on his research. (Creationwiki)

Seems to me he knows a lot more than you do, Ramoss!
 
Logicman said:
Nope, according to your extreme faith, it started with your magical and mythical abiogenesis swamp slime cell / buddy. Daddy...

That takes more faith to believe in than a religious creationist could possibly muster.

Oh ye of GREAT FAITH!!
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It doesn't take any faith at all to say "we don't yet know how life started, but we have a few ideas".
 
Logicman said:
Typical Ramoss. Can't defeat the arguments so you go ad hominem on the source.



Dr. Gerald R. "Jerry" Bergman is an adjunct associate professor at Medical University of Ohio and an instructor in the Division of Arts & Sciences at Northwest State Community College in Archbold, Ohio. He teaches biochemistry, biology, chemistry and physics. He has taught at the college level for 35 years including 7 years at Bowling Green State University, 6 years at the University of Toledo, and 20 years at Northwest State. He started as a graduate student in biochemistry at Medical College of Ohio in 1985, and was later hired as an adjunct instructor and research associate in the experimental pathology department and he still is still on the faculty at MCO (now named Medical University of Ohio). He has also worked for several years as a therapist at various psychological clinics including Arlington Psychological Associates in Toledo, Ohio.

Bergman now has nine academic degrees. He obtained an Associate in Arts degree in Biology and Behavioral Science, from Oakland Community College, Bloomfield Hills, Michigan in 1967, a BSc from Wayne State University in Detroit, Michigan in 1970 where he had majors in sociology, biology, and psychology, from where he also obtained an M.Ed. in counseling and psychology in 1971 and studied for a Ph.D. in measurement and evaluation,[1] minor in psychology from Wayne State. Bergman also received an M.A. in social psychology from Bowling Green State University in 1986. In 1992 he received a Ph.D. in human biology, from Columbia Pacific University, San Rafael, California.[2] The degree is legal, but the university faced various accusations and had its accreditation removed in 1997. Some feel that the school's support of Intelligent Design in required readings may have been involved. Others believe that their support of various alternative medical treatments was a factor. The real reason is unknown. Bergman has written a detailed well documented paper on the school's fall from grace.

Bergman next received a Master of Science degree in biomedical science, from the Medical College of Ohio, Toledo, Ohio, 1999. In 2001 he obtained a Master of Public Health degree from the Northwest Ohio Consortium for Public Health (consisting of the Medical College of Ohio, the University of Toledo and Bowling Green State University). In 2004 he received another MA from Medical College of Ohio. Dr. Bergman has also completed coursework at the University of Wisconsin, Miami University in Oxford Ohio (where he was accepted into the doctoral program in chemistry, so far completing 33 semester hours) and the University of California, Berkeley. He now has over 700 publications in a variety of scientific and popular journals, plus 20 books and monographs. His work has now been translated into 12 languages and he has spoken widely in the United States, Canada and Europe on his research. (Creationwiki)

Seems to me he knows a lot more than you do, Ramoss!
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Does he?? I mean, he is a YEC for heavens sake, and his PHD is from a fake school. ANd honestly, do you really want to use a web site the promotes that the earth is only 6000 years old for scientific claims?? The fact he is promoting his "PH.D' as real already shows that Bergman is not familar with the concept of honesty and truth.
 
There is no concept of gods, only a notion that gods exist. And each notion of a god is no more substantiated than any other imagination. Its like the notion of a tooth fairy. And claiming that the blue one is real, but red, yellow, green, etc. tooth fairies are not real.
 
Logicman said:
You obviously have no idea, then, about the enormous complexity of a single cell.

Why Abiogenesis Is Impossible
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It's not like the cell materialized in an instant out of thin air. No, a tornado did not create a 747. It's more like a tornado gathered up debris that slowly decayed and coagulated into a soup, which after being covered by earth for a billion years turned into oil.
 
RAMOSS said:
Does he?? I mean, he is a YEC for heavens sake, and his PHD is from a fake school. ANd honestly, do you really want to use a web site the promotes that the earth is only 6000 years old for scientific claims?? The fact he is promoting his "PH.D' as real already shows that Bergman is not familar with the concept of honesty and truth.
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That's your spin.

Like I said, when you can't deal with the information provided, you turn to ad hominems. That's the first sign you've lost the argument.

You also apparently believe people can't have in-depth, legitimate knowledge without a high degree. That's another bogus belief to add to your legacy.
 
calamity said:
It's not like the cell materialized in an instant out of thin air. No, a tornado did not create a 747. It's more like a tornado gathered up debris that slowly decayed and coagulated into a soup, which after being covered by earth for a billion years turned into oil.
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But no evidence it turned into a living, complex cell.
 
Logicman said:
That's your spin.

Like I said, when you can't deal with the information provided, you turn to ad hominems. That's the first sign you've lost the argument.

You also apparently believe people can't have in-depth, legitimate knowledge without a high degree. That's another bogus belief to add to your legacy.
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Wow, what a lot of words, and not one thing that can be shown to be true.

For that matter, when you look at that link, there isn't one thing that isn't the logical fallacy known as the 'argument from ignorance', or 'red herring'.
And you swallow that bull.
 
RAMOSS said:
Wow, what a lot of words, and not one thing that can be shown to be true.

For that matter, when you look at that link, there isn't one thing that isn't the logical fallacy known as the 'argument from ignorance', or 'red herring'.
And you swallow that bull.
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Listen, Ramoss, apparently everyone except you and those who think like you knows the incredible complexity of a simple cell. And you want to believe it all came together in a lukewarm swamp?

Laughing Hyena.jpg
 
Logicman said:
Listen, Ramoss, apparently everyone except you and those who think like you knows the incredible complexity of a simple cell. And you want to believe it all came together in a lukewarm swamp?

View attachment 67182103
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I see, rather than actually respond to extracted information that actually TALKS about science, rather than make unsupported claims, you put up that hand waving denial.. And of course, by definition a swamp is full of life so your claim is basically a straw man too.


Too bad you have been busted.
 
RAMOSS said:
And of course, by definition a swamp is full of life so your claim is basically a straw man too.
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The primordial swamp is "full of life"??

We're talking about the very first cell, Ramoss, not what happened afterwards, so your pie-in-the-sky comment is laughable.

Besides, you have ZERO EVIDENCE there ever was an abiogenesis swamp cell.

OH YE OF GREAT FAITH!! LOL!
 
Logicman said:
The primordial swamp is "full of life"??

We're talking about the very first cell, Ramoss, not what happened afterwards, so your pie-in-the-sky comment is laughable.

Besides, you have ZERO EVIDENCE there ever was an abiogenesis swamp cell.

OH YE OF GREAT FAITH!! LOL!
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Yet, for all the claim of you saying there is zero evidence (despite the fact it was shown that there are self replicating RNA molecules that can evolved, which is evidence) that is much more tha you have.
 
Logicman said:
You obviously have no idea, then, about the enormous complexity of a single cell.

Why Abiogenesis Is Impossible
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So why is your solution so much more probable? Hm? Why is it so unlikely to you and others that the most simple building blocks of what we call "life" came about on their own, but what must be an INCREDIBLY COMPLEX "creator" that formed the universe, all the stars, galaxies, and life as we know it... what? Popped out of thin air? That's what is more probable to you? How do you reconcile any of this?
 
Brother AJ said:
So why is your solution so much more probable? Hm? Why is it so unlikely to you and others that the most simple building blocks of what we call "life" came about on their own, but what must be an INCREDIBLY COMPLEX "creator" that formed the universe, all the stars, galaxies, and life as we know it... what? Popped out of thin air? That's what is more probable to you? How do you reconcile any of this?
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Did you read the article? Why Abiogenesis Is Impossible

Enjoy this also:

“The complexity of the simplest known type of cell is so great that it is impossible to accept that such an object could have been thrown together suddenly by some kind of freakish, vastly improbable, event. Such an occurrence would be indistinguishable from a miracle.”
― Michael Denton, Evolution: A Theory In Crisis
 
Time_Clock-620x587.jpg

We appear just before midnight. Look at the length of the early meteorite bombardment that brought water to the Earth. Millions of years. Did god take a nap or just sit twiddling his thumbs while the Earth filled up? Why he waited for nearly four and a half billion years before bringing us on the scene must remain a mystery. He should have created the Earth complete with water, plants, animals and people. I have been told that there is an old tale about that but not many people believe it nowadays. ( It should say 12 hour clock)
 
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