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There is no God and no afterlife thus live life to the fullest [W:104]

humbolt said:
I've never said I expected you to.
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So moving on,

Life is precious because time in it is slipping by, every second counts, and one should live life fullest. Since there is no actual empirical evidence for an afterlife then we should not take their word for it that afterlife exists, and live life fully.
 
RabidAlpaca said:
Is it possible that since no evidence for your spirituality exists outside of your head, that your spirituality exists only in your head? I have no problem with people who have their own personal beliefs and experiences about things, but I definitely don't think those subjective experiences should then be projected on any kind of religion. (Not saying you are)

I just find that many Christians explain the basis of their faith as their own subjective "experiences with god". I simply don't see the connection.
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If not for real events in my life which correspond directly with the content of prayer, I would question this myself, and have.
 
DDD said:
So moving on,

Life is precious because time in it is slipping by, every second counts, and one should live life fullest. Since there is no actual empirical evidence for an afterlife then we should not take their word for it that afterlife exists, and live life fully.
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Do as you wish. Your life is yours to live. I've made a conscious choice to do something different. That's about it.
 
humbolt said:
Do as you wish. Your life is yours to live. I've made a conscious choice to do something different. That's about it.
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Likewise.

The difference is that I can find actual empirical evidence to support why living life fullest is good, while the religious cannot do the same for their religious concepts.
 
DDD said:
Likewise.

The difference is that I can find actual empirical evidence to support why living life fullest is good, while the religious cannot do the same for their religious concepts.
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My evidence is somewhat different. Understand, one Biblical caution in the NT is that one should not place one's confidence in the world. That places the confidence of the believer squarely on faith in the spiritual. This is not without foundation, but it has no expression in worldly terms. I have no interest in changing your beliefs. I'm satisfied in mine. I trust you are equally satisfied in yours.
 
humbolt said:
My evidence is somewhat different. Understand, one Biblical caution in the NT is that one should not place one's confidence in the world. That places the confidence of the believer squarely on faith in the spiritual. This is not without foundation, but it has no expression in worldly terms. I have no interest in changing your beliefs. I'm satisfied in mine. I trust you are equally satisfied in yours.
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Yes, yes, of course.

The issue though is that to promote an idea in a persuasive way one needs to express them in "worldly terms." Just like scientists work hard to push an idea in this world for the reality in this world, so should other ideas follow suit.

In "worldly terms" the evidence you have is called anecdotal and insufficient to promote a general idea for all others to follow. But that is not your intention neither.

Plus this thread is about living life fullest in this real world.
 
DDD said:
Yes, yes, of course.

The issue though is that to promote an idea in a persuasive way one needs to express them in "worldly terms." Just like scientists work hard to push an idea in this world for the reality in this world, so should other ideas follow suit.

Plus this thread is about living life fullest in this real world.
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The worldly terms is a problem that cannot be overcome - at least by me. The only way to explore the depths of spiritual belief is by jumping in from my perspective. Living life to it's fullest means different things to each of us. I do just that given my understanding of life, or at the very least, I'm trying. Given our time in the world, I recommend others do the same based on their beliefs. I can't think of much worse than a person of good will reaching his or her last days filled with regret.
 
humbolt said:
The worldly terms is a problem that cannot be overcome - at least by me. The only way to explore the depths of spiritual belief is by jumping in from my perspective. Living life to it's fullest means different things to each of us. I do just that given my understanding of life, or at the very least, I'm trying. Given our time in the world, I recommend others do the same based on their beliefs. I can't think of much worse than a person of good will reaching his or her last days filled with regret.
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Too personal and useless position for a debate. This thread is about this world to begin with and anecdotal evidence is all that is offered.

Perhaps you may want to continue from this position in a more appropriate place such as the tavern.
 
humbolt said:
If not for real events in my life which correspond directly with the content of prayer, I would question this myself, and have.
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How many prayers have you made throughout the years that haven't been answered? Pray for grandma not to die and she does anyway? Pray for grandma not to die and she doesn't? I grew up incredibly religious and what it always seemed to be to me was completely random events. If it went in your favor, god answers prayers, if it didn't, it wasn't god's plan.
 
RabidAlpaca said:
How many prayers have you made throughout the years that haven't been answered? Pray for grandma not to die and she does anyway? Pray for grandma not to die and she doesn't? I grew up incredibly religious and what it always seemed to be to me was completely random events. If it went in your favor, god answers prayers, if it didn't, it wasn't god's plan.
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More than not.
 
RabidAlpaca said:
How many prayers have you made throughout the years that haven't been answered? Pray for grandma not to die and she does anyway? Pray for grandma not to die and she doesn't?
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Yet one thing you could absolutely guarantee was that Grandma would die. No amount of prayer to whatsoever kind of deity has ever prevented a human body from eventually dying.
 
Andalublue said:
Yet one thing you could absolutely guarantee was that Grandma would die. No amount of prayer to whatsoever kind of deity has ever prevented a human body from eventually dying.
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Very interesting thread, my new forum friends, for I have also, thought about this quite a bit. So, here is my conclusion, (unless I change it later.) So obsessed am I, I can trace the roots of all North Hemisphere religions, based on the creed back to the Lau Tsu, and the Tao in China. The Way of All Things. I had a lot of time on my hands and it was a lot of work. But, just me, I had to know, for me. Religion spread by foot, word of mouth and by war. It morphed and changed and left clues about that, which I traced.

And though we now have Science we still have the same Mystery of Allness and Oneness, unsolved. We can feel it. It is an emotional certainty for most people on Earth. I just read that 90% of Americans, believe in Ghosts.

There is no proof one way or the other.
All Religions cannot be all Right.
There is some Truth across them all.

My personal experience with meditation seems to suggest this Godness we seek, is Us. it is higher Self, and Quantum Physics suggests it is all powerful, all knowing. IT is all of us at once. Makes sense to me anyway. :mrgreen:

Now take it or leave it, all Religions began as Cults and became War Cults to prevail. Even Buddha was the son of a war lord. Buddhist and Hindu have been slaughtered by Muslims. Buddhists burned out Muslim Mosques in Burma, last year. The story of Krishna is from the back of a war chariot. Lau Tsu, in 2500 BC wrote about Peace and a Way and reasons to follow it, in the "Time of the Trouble with Warlords." We know about Joseph Smith, and the Mormons. They became a War Cult in Ute Indian territory, now Utah.

So, I see war and religion as two sides of the same coin, down to "no atheist in the fox holes." Right. Someone will friendly fire you for being an atheist.:roll: It happened recently, to Tillman,
in Afganistan.

We have religion for two important reasons. A way to instill morality in children, and a way to let God sort it out, in War.

Discuss?;)
 
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Excerpt from....

Imagine a World Devoid of God

His hatred and anger at the injustices in this world, creatures and diseases that exist to cause nothing but suffering like HIV, the worm that eats eyes and so on he blames squarely on the “god” he thinks Christians worship.
He missed the point completely, which is what surprises me. To paraphrase CS Lewis, he has a concept of what a straight line should be, and recognizes that the line the world shows him is crooked. But where does his concept of a straight line come from?

All these things we do because we have a clear understanding of right and wrong. That understanding, whether Mr Fry, Richard Dawkins or any other atheist wants to argue the point, has to come from a place beyond ourselves. Moral behaviour is impossible under the theory of accidental evolution as there is only one mandate – reproduce at all costs to pass on the strongest genes.


Imagine a World Devoid of God
 
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