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Does God make decisions?

zyzygy

zyzygy

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Does God make decisions? If he does, then he affects the future, but as he is supposed to be omnicient he already knows the future and he knows what his decisions will be so how does he decide whether to answer a prayer or not, for example? How does he decide whether to save people involved in a natural disaster or not? Does this mean that God has no free will if the future is set in stone?
 
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He doesn't do ****

the-more-you-know.jpg
 
a351 said:
He doesn't do anything.

the-more-you-know.jpg
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I am assuming for the sake of the thread that the Christian god exists. It seems to be a bit of a paradox.
 
Non-existant beings can not make decisions, but even if he were to exist, omnipotent beings do not make decisions. They know all information past, present and future. There can be no decisions made because everything was always known and he would have the power to do or change anything.
 
RabidAlpaca said:
Non-existant beings can not make decisions, but even if he were to exist, omnipotent beings do not make decisions. They know all information past, present and future. There can be no decisions made because everything was always known and he would have the power to do or change anything.
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All-powerful and powerless at the same time.
 
zyzygy said:
Does God make decisions? If he does, then he affects the future, but as he is supposed to be omnicient he already knows the future and he knows what his decisions will be so how does he decide whether to answer a prayer or not, for example? How does he decide whether to save people involved in a natural disaster or not? Does this mean that God has no free will if the future is set in stone?
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I don't view God as something which predetermines anything at all. I view us as being the masters of our own destiny to a certain degree, but I think that the vast majority of us fail to recognize that, or give it enough examination to try and understand anything besides the immediate. The future is not set in stone. The future is perpetually forming and is merely the result of everything leading up to it.
 
RabidAlpaca said:
Non-existant beings can not make decisions, but even if he were to exist, omnipotent beings do not make decisions. They know all information past, present and future. There can be no decisions made because everything was always known and he would have the power to do or change anything.
Click to expand...

Minus the atheist quote this is pretty much the most intelligent response in terms of answering the threads. I like it.
 
The closest theology that makes sense is that god sees everything, all possibilities - the past, present and future at the same time. In other words, he's outside of time. Just because he (haha I said "he" ) sees every outcome doesn't mean we don't have free will.

Of course, it gets interesting if/when he intrudes into our space/time - or rather into the way we observe space and time - and creates a supernatural event. Does he do this? Why does he do this ? Outside of faith, we don't know.
 
Thats a simple leap of faith.

RabidAlpaca said:
Non-existant beings can not make decisions, but even if he were to exist, omnipotent beings do not make decisions. They know all information past, present and future. There can be no decisions made because everything was always known and he would have the power to do or change anything.
Click to expand...
 
sure he judges us all when our clock is up. it is not a given that his decisions impact anything more than he intends.
 
My view is that God created our universe, a self-evolving and self-sustaining system. Which means He can observe and watch His creation. Since He is outside of our universe, his frame reference of time is vastly different than our own. I also believe that this system is so complex, initiating a change will inadvertently have consequences that would cascade deeply into the universe. Therefore, to keep stability in the system outside influence is refrained. It isn't that he doesn't have the power to manipulate the system, it is just outside manipulation has such extensive consequences that where there are favorable effects there are also negative consequences. It is much more delicate when you actually think about it. In essence, He gave us existence and life. He has given us the freedom for us to do with it what we will.
 
You don't think an all powerful god couldn't manage this ?

sookster said:
My view is that God created our universe, a self-evolving and self-sustaining system. Which means He can observe and watch His creation. Since He is outside of our universe, his frame reference of time is vastly different than our own. I also believe that this system is so complex, initiating a change will inadvertently have consequences that would cascade deeply into the universe. Therefore, to keep stability in the system outside influence is refrained. It isn't that he doesn't have the power to manipulate the system, it is just outside manipulation has such extensive consequences that where there are favorable effects there are also negative consequences. It is much more delicate when you actually think about it. In essence, He gave us existence and life. He has given us the freedom for us to do with it what we will.
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TobyOne said:
You don't think an all powerful god couldn't manage this ?
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I think God doesn't have the abilities that we think He has. I think He is somewhat constrained to the reality that He created. But again, no one really knows. All of this is speculation. I just read a theory that the big bang could of originated from an event horizon on a 4 spatial dimensional black hole. I read another theory that inside the singularities of black holes there are universes. So, we are essentially in a black hole, and that black hole is in a universe which is a singularity for a larger black hole.

We have no clue. What has me concerned is that spirituality has had a bad wrap after The Enlightenment. I can understand that. But I feel like science should be open to the idea that this existence could of been created. Otherwise we deal with infinite paradigms like those theories above. Ultimately, something came from nothing. We may of been created from a four space dimensional universe, but then what created that one?

Again, I think we should be open to that possibility. I'm not saying I know God exists, but I am open to the idea that the laws that govern us have been created. And I think science should take the same approach. Infaltionary theory was derived so there wouldn't be the "God Ratio". Physicists are troubled that the singularity of the big bang, out of all the violent ways it could of exploded, exploded the way it did. Why? Because there seems to be like there might be a Creator behind life as we know it. Science literally bans the idea of God, and will come up with alternate theories that eliminates that possibility. That to me should change. I believe no one knows for sure, so we should be open to that possibility. And God in this context doesn't have to be of the spiritual texts that we know of today. Those texts could be flat wrong. In fact, I am pretty certain they are, because the laws put forth in those texts make absolutely no sense. God wouldn't be that dumb.

To expand what I said earlier. I do not think it is possible, for even God, to initiate outside influence into the system and eliminate all negative effects while keeping the good ones. That is what I am trying to say. So if you were to talk about humanity for example, there are over 7 billion people on this Earth. If he initiates a change for a unit of people, it would inadvertently affect other people, because we are so interconnected. And while there maybe a gain for that group of people, it is quite possible that more pain would be experienced for others. He is constrained to the system that He created.
 
Nicely said but I think you're not giving god enough credit. As you say, its all speculation but I don' know why we would imagine limitations to a god just because we can't understand how he would do something. The limitation would be on us, not god.


sookster said:
I think God doesn't have the abilities that we think He has. I think He is somewhat constrained to the reality that He created. But again, no one really knows. All of this is speculation. I just read a theory that the big bang could of originated from an event horizon on a 4 spatial dimensional black hole. I read another theory that inside the singularities of black holes there are universes. So, we are essentially in a black hole, and that black hole is in a universe which is a singularity for a larger black hole.

We have no clue. What has me concerned is that spirituality has had a bad wrap after The Enlightenment. I can understand that. But I feel like science should be open to the idea that this existence could of been created. Otherwise we deal with infinite paradigms like those theories above. Ultimately, something came from nothing. We may of been created from a four space dimensional universe, but then what created that one?

Again, I think we should be open to that possibility. I'm not saying I know God exists, but I am open to the idea that the laws that govern us have been created. And I think science should take the same approach. Infaltionary theory was derived so there wouldn't be the "God Ratio". Physicists are troubled that the singularity of the big bang, out of all the violent ways it could of exploded, exploded the way it did. Why? Because there seems to be like there might be a Creator behind life as we know it. Science literally bans the idea of God, and will come up with alternate theories that eliminates that possibility. That to me should change. I believe no one knows for sure, so we should be open to that possibility. And God in this context doesn't have to be of the spiritual texts that we know of today. Those texts could be flat wrong. In fact, I am pretty certain they are, because the laws put forth in those texts make absolutely no sense. God wouldn't be that dumb.

To expand what I said earlier. I do not think it is possible, for even God, to initiate outside influence into the system and eliminate all negative effects while keeping the good ones. That is what I am trying to say. So if you were to talk about humanity for example, there are over 7 billion people on this Earth. If he initiates a change for a unit of people, it would inadvertently affect other people, because we are so interconnected. And while there maybe a gain for that group of people, it is quite possible that more pain would be experienced for others. He is constrained to the system that He created.
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