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To be, or not to be

grip

Slow 🅖 Hand
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This famous question from Shakespeare has a particular meaning to me. I'll explain mine, then please explain it's meaning to you?

We struggle all our lives for purpose, meaning, hope and love. The most enduring being hope and love and whether we will care enough to fight for it or give up. The worst deception one can make is to themselves about what's important. Life is bigger than just ourselves and if we can live that way keeping our egos in check, I believe we're happier. It's no easy task though in sharing your existence.

Why some have it seemingly so different and more or less difficult than others is probably circumstantial. Naturally, as the poem suggests we fear death if nothing else for being the ultimate unknown and possibly worse than the hardships of our current life. But being a part of the wonder of it all isn't always enough and we need the fear to keep us. Life makes us a promise in our youth that one day it will fulfill again, "you'll learn to forgive and trust me."


William Shakespeare - To be, or not to be (from Hamlet 3/1)

To be, or not to be, that is the question:
Whether 'tis Nobler in the mind to suffer
The Slings and Arrows of outrageous Fortune,
Or to take Arms against a Sea of troubles,
And by opposing end them: to die, to sleep
No more; and by a sleep, to say we end
The Heart-ache, and the thousand Natural shocks
That Flesh is heir to? 'Tis a consummation
Devoutly to be wished. To die to sleep,
To sleep, perchance to Dream; Aye, there's the rub,
For in that sleep of death, what dreams may come,
When we have shuffled off this mortal coil,
Must give us pause. There's the respect
That makes Calamity of so long life:
For who would bear the Whips and Scorns of time,
The Oppressor's wrong, the proud man's Contumely,
The pangs of disprized Love, the Law’s delay,
The insolence of Office, and the Spurns
That patient merit of the unworthy takes,
When he himself might his Quietus make
With a bare Bodkin? Who would Fardels bear,
To grunt and sweat under a weary life,
But that the dread of something after death,
The undiscovered Country, from whose bourn
No Traveller returns, Puzzles the will,
And makes us rather bear those ills we have,
Than fly to others that we know not of.
Thus Conscience does make Cowards of us all,
And thus the Native hue of Resolution
Is sicklied o'er, with the pale cast of Thought,
And enterprises of great pith and moment,
With this regard their Currents turn awry,
And lose the name of Action. Soft you now,
The fair Ophelia? Nymph, in thy Orisons
Be all my sins remembered.
 
“We must be willing to let go of the life we planned so as to have the life that is waiting for us.”
― Joseph Campbell

“The cave you fear to enter holds the treasure you seek.”
― Joseph Campbell
 
“We must be willing to let go of the life we planned so as to have the life that is waiting for us.”
― Joseph Campbell

“The cave you fear to enter holds the treasure you seek.”
― Joseph Campbell

Very succinct and poignant sangha. :)
 
“We must be willing to let go of the life we planned so as to have the life that is waiting for us.”
― Joseph Campbell

The life I planned has been so very different from the life I have had, thus my adopting one of CG Jung's descriptions of God as pretty much the way it seems to be.

(see my sig)
 
The life I planned has been so very different from the life I have had, thus my adopting one of CG Jung's descriptions of God as pretty much the way it seems to be.

(see my sig)

My life is so NOT what I ever thought it would be. Not completely worse in every way just definitely different.

It reminds me of a joke, "want to make God laugh, tell Him about your plans."
 
The life I planned has been so very different from the life I have had, thus my adopting one of CG Jung's descriptions of God as pretty much the way it seems to be.

(see my sig)



Nietzche was the one who did the job for me. At a certain moment in his life, the idea came to him of what he called "the love of your fate." Whatever your fate is, whatever the hell happens, you say, "This is what I need." It may look like a wreck, but go at it as though it were an opportunity, a challenge. If you bring love to that moment — not discouragement — you will find the strength is there. Any disaster you can survive is an improvement in your character, your stature, and your life. What a privilege! This is when the spontaneity of your own nature will have a chance to flow.

Then when looking back at your life, you will see that the moments which seemed to be great failures followed by wreckage were the incidents that shaped the life you have now. You'll see that this is really true. Nothing can happen to you that is not positive. Even though it looks and feels at the moment like a negative crisis, it is not. The crisis throws you back, and when you are required to exhibit strength, it comes.


Joseph Campbell
 
My life is so NOT what I ever thought it would be. Not completely worse in every way just definitely different.

It reminds me of a joke, "want to make God laugh, tell Him about your plans."

I just seem to keep losing all the key people who taught me how to love, and when they are gone, it's like I have all this unexpended energy, and like my heart has been amputated. I guess that's the price one pays for loving another. There are times when it takes everything I have, not to just fold up on myself. A life lived where you extend yourself, is sometimes a painful existence. If it's not, you may be doing something wrong. ;)
 
Nietzche was the one who did the job for me. At a certain moment in his life, the idea came to him of what he called "the love of your fate." Whatever your fate is, whatever the hell happens, you say, "This is what I need." It may look like a wreck, but go at it as though it were an opportunity, a challenge. If you bring love to that moment — not discouragement — you will find the strength is there. Any disaster you can survive is an improvement in your character, your stature, and your life. What a privilege! This is when the spontaneity of your own nature will have a chance to flow.

Then when looking back at your life, you will see that the moments which seemed to be great failures followed by wreckage were the incidents that shaped the life you have now. You'll see that this is really true. Nothing can happen to you that is not positive. Even though it looks and feels at the moment like a negative crisis, it is not. The crisis throws you back, and when you are required to exhibit strength, it comes.


Joseph Campbell

I was about to say "damn sangha you should write a book" before I saw the quote...lol

Before my father passed he gave me one of the greatest compliments and insights into life I ever heard. I told him how much I regretted all the bad decisions and mistakes I made and he said, "I don't or you wouldn't be the person you've become."
 
Nietzche was the one who did the job for me. At a certain moment in his life, the idea came to him of what he called "the love of your fate." Whatever your fate is, whatever the hell happens, you say, "This is what I need." It may look like a wreck, but go at it as though it were an opportunity, a challenge. If you bring love to that moment — not discouragement — you will find the strength is there. Any disaster you can survive is an improvement in your character, your stature, and your life. What a privilege! This is when the spontaneity of your own nature will have a chance to flow.

For some reason, I have never read Nietzche, but I'm thinking that it is in my future. Thanks. :)
 
I just seem to keep losing all the key people who taught me how to love, and when they are gone, it's like I have all this unexpended energy, and like my heart has been amputated. I guess that's the price one pays for loving another. There are times when it takes everything I have, not to just fold up on myself. A life lived where you extend yourself, is sometimes a painful existence. If it's not, you may be doing something wrong. ;)


Oh sweetheart, I just lost my mom 6 months ago after losing my dad 7 years before that. They were my best friends and the center of my life. It's hurt me more than anything I could have imagined but somehow I know it's better that they're not suffering anymore. It's the selfish part of me that weeps for myself not them. I try to thank God for the time I had with them. But like you said nothing worth so much is going to hurt. In time we'll heal and hopefully one day be reunited. It's all I can do just to put one foot in front of the other but that's what I'll keep doing the best I can. :mrgreen:


I understand J. Geils Band hit song "Love Stinks".
 
Oh sweetheart, I just lost my mom 6 months ago after losing my dad 7 years before that. They were my best friends and the center of my life. It's hurt me more than anything I could have imagined but somehow I know it's better that they're not suffering anymore. It's the selfish part of me that weeps for myself not them. I try to thank God for the time I had with them. But like you said nothing worth so much is going to hurt. In time we'll heal and hopefully one day be reunited. It's all I can do just to put one foot in front of the other but that's what I'll keep doing the best I can. :mrgreen:


I understand J. Geils Band hit song "Love Stinks".

Words of wisdom from lizzie: Grieving is a bitch. :)
 
I just seem to keep losing all the key people who taught me how to love, and when they are gone, it's like I have all this unexpended energy, and like my heart has been amputated. I guess that's the price one pays for loving another. There are times when it takes everything I have, not to just fold up on myself. A life lived where you extend yourself, is sometimes a painful existence. If it's not, you may be doing something wrong. ;)



It is by going down into the abyss that we recover the treasures of life. Where you stumble, there lies your treasure.



Joseph Campbell

The greatest times in my life were the hardest ones. They weren't the most fun times, but they were the greatest

“Life has no meaning. Each of us has meaning and we bring it to life. It is a waste to be asking the question when you are the answer.”
― Joseph Campbell

There are people who live for no one but themselves. Their selfishness is the meaning of their life.

You have loved, and suffered for giving that love. That giving is the meaning of your life
 
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The greatest times in my life were the hardest ones. They weren't the most fun times, but they were the greatest

In reality, it's the same here. It's just that once in awhile, I have to whine like a puppy. :lol:
 
I remember after my father passed, I tried to give up on life and it was actually harder than trying to live. Man was I shocked. :shock:

It literally takes more energy and effort to be sad and defeated than to fire it up and say "bring it".
 
I remember after my father passed, I tried to give up on life and it was actually harder than trying to live. Man was I shocked. :shock:

It literally takes more energy and effort to be sad and defeated than to fire it up and say "bring it".

Yes, we often don't really know what it is that we want. Lots of things get in the way of knowing ourselves. Our plans, our expectations and our beliefs about who we are and who we should be have us clinging to notions instead of living life. It's when we're faced with hardship that we learn our strengths and who we are.

"All life is suffering" according to The Buddha. I believe that is because suffering is needed in order to truly live one's own life.

“If you can see your path laid out in front of you step by step, you know it's not your path. Your own path you make with every step you take. That's why it's your path.”
― Joseph Campbell

“We're so engaged in doing things to achieve purposes of outer value that we forget the inner value, the rapture that is associated with being alive, is what it is all about.”
― Joseph Campbell

“People say that what we’re all seeking is a meaning for life. I don’t think that’s what we’re really seeking. I think that what we’re seeking is an experience of being alive, so that our life experiences on the purely physical plane will have resonances without own innermost being and reality, so that we actually feel the rapture of being alive.”
― Joseph Campbell
 
Yes, we often don't really know what it is that we want. Lots of things get in the way of knowing ourselves. Our plans, our expectations and our beliefs about who we are and who we should be have us clinging to notions instead of living life. It's when we're faced with hardship that we learn our strengths and who we are.

"All life is suffering" according to The Buddha. I believe that is because suffering is needed in order to truly live one's own life.

Wow, I'm really digging what this JC guy says. It's resonating with me big time in my current situation. Trying to find meaning again with no family or career left and a bunch of health issues. We're so inner focused on what we think we should be doing that we forget to open our senses to the here and now and just enjoy living the moment, like when we were kids. Hell, I didn't think beyond the next thing to do when I was growing up.
 
Wow, I'm really digging what this JC guy says. It's resonating with me big time in my current situation. Trying to find meaning again with no family or career left and a bunch of health issues. We're so inner focused on what we think we should be doing that we forget to open our senses to the here and now and just enjoy living the moment, like when we were kids. Hell, I didn't think beyond the next thing to do when I was growing up.

off topic: I have quite a few of his books, and would be happy to wrap them up, and ship them to you, if you'd like. He was a quite impressive man, and his insight was interesting.
 
off topic: I have quite a few of his books, and would be happy to wrap them up, and ship them to you, if you'd like. He was a quite impressive man, and his insight was interesting.

I really appreciate the offer but I'm a little ADHD and struggle to focus long enough to even read a chapter. I haven't read a whole book in 30 years. :3oops:

I'm too old and a know it all to learn anymore anyway....lol
 
Wow, I'm really digging what this JC guy says. It's resonating with me big time in my current situation. Trying to find meaning again with no family or career left and a bunch of health issues. We're so inner focused on what we think we should be doing that we forget to open our senses to the here and now and just enjoy living the moment, like when we were kids. Hell, I didn't think beyond the next thing to do when I was growing up.

Joseph Campbell is the guy who coined the phrase "Follow your bliss"

During his later years, when some students took him to be encouraging hedonism, Campbell is reported to have grumbled, "I should have said, 'Follow your blisters"

Here's a bit about him on Wiki

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Campbell

He was a cultural anthropologist who specialized in the study of myths from all over the world and throughout history. Though an atheist, he came to see myths as metaphors that help us unlock inner truths about our state of being.

"God is a metaphor for a mystery that absolutely transcends all human categories of thought, even the categories of being and non-being. Those are categories of thought. I mean it's as simple as that. So it depends on how much you want to think about it. Whether it's doing you any good. Whether it is putting you in touch with the mystery that's the ground of your own being. If it isn't, well, it's a lie. So half the people in the world are religious people who think that their metaphors are facts. Those are what we call theists. The other half are people who know that the metaphors are not facts. And so, they're lies. Those are the atheists."
 
Joseph Campbell is the guy who coined the phrase "Follow your bliss"



Here's a bit about him on Wiki

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Campbell

He was a cultural anthropologist who specialized in the study of myths from all over the world and throughout history. Though an atheist, he came to see myths as metaphors that help us unlock inner truths about our state of being.


I remember that saying. Around the same time as the book "Your Okay, I'm Okay"? A lot of deep thinkers came out of the 60's hippy movement. It was a time when West meets East philosophy was melding. I remember when our generation was encouraged to strive into the arts, classics and things of culture. Our parents pushed us to endeavor, whereas the last couple of generations are science literate but superficial on a social level.
 
I remember that saying. Around the same time as the book "Your Okay, I'm Okay"? A lot of deep thinkers came out of the 60's hippy movement. It was a time when West meets East philosophy was melding. I remember when our generation was encouraged to strive into the arts, classics and things of culture. Our parents pushed us to endeavor, whereas the last couple of generations are science literate but superficial on a social level.

If I remember correctly, the guy who wrote "The Road Less Traveled" said, in one of his books, that it should actually have been "You're not okay. I'm not okay. But it's Okay". :lol:
 
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