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Life without god

Gathomas88 said:
Strange that the worst offenders in this regard have always been secular.

Only because our religiously influenced views of morality and social relationships have rendered them as such.
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Been there, done that, bought the ****ing t-shirt. Get some experience in debating this topic, then get back to me on this cliched argument with no factual backing.

Have you visted a nursing home recently? There are a lot of selfish people out there who more or less summarily abandon the sick and elderly members of their family when they cease to be convenient.

I have absolutely no doubt that many of these same people would be perfectly happy to get rid of their burdensome family members entirely if they felt that they had the moral license to do so.
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And those evil vultures must all be atheists, right?

Frankly, it would appear that you are better off without one in today's world. It would especially seem to be the case if it truly turns out that God does not exist.

Psychopathy and the CEO: Top executives have four times the incidence of psychopathy as the rest of us

Professions with 'most psychopaths' revealed: Lawyers, journalists

The Sociopathic Politician

Monsters rule the world, I'm afraid. They pretty much always have.
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You are aware that "psychopath" is an archaic umbrella term regarding people with dissociative and perceptive disorders, right? Everything from schizophrenia to type 1 bipolar disorder. You are awarded no points.



Really now?

He's wealthy, he's successful, he's charming, he's physically attractive, and he is very good at his job. He arguably contributes far more to society at large than you or I do.

Why should he care what the rest of the "herd" thinks about his hobbies so long as he manages to keep his activities discrete?
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Sounds like you want to blow him or something. He's a serial killer. Serial killers are of no use to society.
 
Surtr said:
Been there, done that, bought the ****ing t-shirt. Get some experience in debating this topic, then get back to me on this cliched argument with no factual backing.
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Nazi Germany, the USSR, Communist China, North Korea, Cambodia, and the rest of the Eastern Bloc nations have a greater combined body count than all of the violent religious movements in human history combined.

You were saying?

And those evil vultures must all be atheists, right?
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What sort of people primarily support Pro-Choice viewpoints?

By and large, the kinds of people that want to favor personal convenience over abstract notions concerning the "value of life" are going to be secular.

You are aware that "psychopath" is an archaic umbrella term regarding people with dissociative and perceptive disorders, right? Everything from schizophrenia to type 1 bipolar disorder. You are awarded no points.
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This hardly alters the point I was trying to make.

The simple fact of the matter is that the people who most often tend to gain positions of high power and authority in society also tend to be the ones who possess rather warped and/or flexible views of morality.

In a world truly without God (and therefore, higher morality), it could easily be argued that these kinds of people are actually superior to the rest of us, as they are clearly better adapted to turn the social conventions which keep most peoples' ambitions in check to their advantage. After all, there is probably a reason why these seemingly negative traits seem to get passed along through the gene pool generation after generation rather than simply being bred out.

Sounds like you want to blow him or something. He's a serial killer. Serial killers are of no use to society.
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To the contrary, as I have just pointed out, he probably contributes more to society than you or I do through his work in the financial sector.

If there is no God, why should it matter how he chooses to get his rocks off on the side?
 
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Gathomas88 said:
Nazi Germany, the USSR, Communist China, North Korea, Cambodia, and the rest of the Eastern Bloc nations have a greater combined body count than all of the violent religious movements in human history combined.

You were saying?
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The Oatmeal sums it up perfectly:

1.png

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What sort of people primarily support Pro-Choice viewpoints?

By and large, the kinds of people that want to favor personal convenience over abstract notions concerning the "value of life" are going to be secular.
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Damn, you not only changed the goal posts, you changed the stadium, the team, and the crowd by switching from nursing homes to abortion. Favoring convenience is an issue of laziness, not religion.


This hardly alters the point I was trying to make.
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It demonstrates that you have no idea what you're talking about.

In a world truly without God (and therefore, higher morality), it could easily be argued that these kinds of people are actually superior to the rest of us
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You don't know what superiority is.

To the contrary, as I have just pointed out, he probably contributes more to society than you or I do through his work in the financial sector.

If there is no God, why should it matter how he chooses to get his rocks off on the side?
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So basically, if you didn't fear some cosmic force from the heavens, you would be a conscienceless serial killer who stomps old people and babies simply because they inconvenience you. That says a lot more about you than me, buddy.
 
Surtr said:
The Oatmeal sums it up perfectly:

*snip*
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Regardless, it still absolutely disproves your argument that religion and theocracy are somehow the major driving forces behind genocide.

I would also point out that, while atheism (and yes, Hitler was an atheist, or at least agnostic) might not have been the primary cause for the atrocities which took place under Fascist and Communist regimes, the lack of religious morality inherent to them certainly did play a role in opening the door for belief systems which were far worse to take hold over the societies in question.

Damn, you not only changed the goal posts, you changed the stadium, the team, and the crowd by switching from nursing homes to abortion. Favoring convenience is an issue of laziness, not religion.
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They are basically the same issue as far as I am concerned. I have absolutely no doubt that the same kinds of people who currently support "Pro-Choice" positions would also support on demand euthenasia for the family members of the sick and elderly if society were to remove the moral stigma attached to it.

The only difference here is that you can actually see the life being taken.

It demonstrates that you have no idea what you're talking about.


You don't know what superiority is.
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So far you've thrown up a cartoon and a bunch of evasive non-arguments. Keep up the good work bud! :roll:

So basically, if you didn't fear some cosmic force from the heavens, you would be a conscienceless serial killer who stomps old people and babies simply because they inconvenience you. That says a lot more about you than me, buddy.
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If there was no God, I would hope to be a conscienceless sociopath because it frankly seems to be a more efficient state of affairs than "normalcy" from an objective materialist standpoint.

I fail to see how this is a hard concept.
 
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Yes, that's correct OP.
 
Gathomas88 said:
Regardless, it still absolutely disproves your argument that religion and theocracy are somehow the major driving forces behind genocide.
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It doesn't disprove anything, you're only looking at one century out of the entire history of mankind.

I would also point out that, while atheism (and yes, Hitler was an atheist, or at least agnostic)
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He was actually a Catholic. It's well documented.


They are basically the same issue as far as I am concerned.
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Then you fail, because they're entirely different issues.



So far you've thrown up a cartoon and a bunch of evasive non-arguments. Keep up the good work bud! :roll:
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And all you've done is state the same baseless stereotypical nonsense that has been done to death time and time again for at least 20 years, but keep on blindly perpetuating the big lies.


If there was no God, I would hope to be a conscienceless sociopath because it frankly seems to be a more efficient state of affairs than "normalcy" from an objective materialist standpoint.

I fail to see how this is a hard concept.
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It's a stupid concept because it has no basis in reality.
 
Surtr said:
It doesn't disprove anything, you're only looking at one century out of the entire history of mankind.
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The single most destructive and anti-religious century in human history. Your point?

He was actually a Catholic. It's well documented.
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Just because he was raised Catholic, doesn't mean that he remained one. Hitler was quite open in his distain for Christianity on general principle due to its supposedly "Jewish" roots.

His regime also cooked up several plots to have the Pope assassinated over the course of the Second World War.

Then you fail, because they're entirely different issues.
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Murder of the innocent for convenience's sake is murder of the innocent for convenience's sake.

It's a stupid concept because it has no basis in reality.
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Given the fact that many of the wealthiest and most powerful men in the world also happen to be psycho or sociopaths, it would appear that you are the one whose view point has "no basis in reality" here, not I.
 
If God does not exists, then life is objectively meaningless.
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Life is objectively meaningless. It's the subjective which projects meaning. Objectively all the meaning one can find in life is that it is. Life is self-motivating within the system of nature.

If there is no God, then objective right and wrong do not exist.
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Objectively right and wrong do not exist. Society along with its mores and habitual sentiments move and grow as one.

If there is no God, what awaits at the end of the line is death. Extinction. Then life has no purpose. We just pretend and make up things to give it some purpose.
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I am very sorry if you need to affirm life with death. Everything must end. It is the antecedent of all other sobering truth. Also it is not necessary for there to be a singular Anthropomorphic god (or any conceptualization of god) for there to be some form of afterlife.
 
tosca1 said:
If God does not exists, then life is objectively meaningless.
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I'm not sure why you think like that. In your opinion, why is life necessarily connected to religion in you mind?

Are you a very religious person?

Or what?
 
I feel like being an atheist gives my life more meaning. Because of my belief I feel like I value my life more and rather than living for death I live to enjoy my life.
 
“Life has no meaning. Each of us has meaning and we bring it to life. It is a waste to be asking the question when you are the answer.”
― Joseph Campbell
 
tosca1 said:
If God does not exists, then life is objectively meaningless.
If there is no God, then objective right and wrong do not exist.
If there is no God, what awaits at the end of the line is death. Extinction. Then life has no purpose. We just pretend and make up things to give it some purpose.
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Which God?
Besides the fact there is almost certainly No god, but conceding for argument there is...
what if You are worshipping the Wrong one and living by the Wrong precepts?

Is life 'meaningless' for non-Christian Indian Hindus? Asian Buddhists? Many other cultures?
How Myopic the God-ists are. When they talk about god the mean only Their god.
 
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mbig said:
Which God?
Besides the fact there is almost certainly No god, but conceding for argument there is...
what if You are worshipping the Wrong one and living by the Wrong precepts?

Is life 'meaningless' for non-Christian Indian Hindus? Asian Buddhists? Many other cultures?
How Myopic the God-ists are. When they talk about god the mean only Their god.
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For Buddhists the meaning of life is to end suffering.
 
mbig said:
Which God?
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In this context, the God who created the heavens and the earth.

Of course for us Christians, it will be our God. Muslims will no doubt think it's their god. Etc..,
 
tosca1 said:
In this context, the God who created the heavens and the earth.

Of course for us Christians, it will be our God. Muslims will no doubt think it's their god. Etc..,
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That answer is false.
Of course you truncated most of my post mention Precepts and other religions.
But at least you put up a mockery of an answer to this one, as you oft just ignore the tough ones and youtube/kwazy-link away.
Your tactics are clownish and you are unable to discuss anything seriously.

And of course, your answer is ridiculous, since if god merely created the heavens and earth and vanished, life would still be 'meaningless'.. for/to You that is.
 
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