Should schools have dress codes?

As a (very) senior citizen, I feel more comfortable seeing people of all ages dress "appropriately."

I have just seen a TV report that posters on social media are forcing many schools to "change" (abolish?) their dress codes.

In this case, an elementary school male was turned away from the first day of school because he was wearing dreadlocks. I believe the school is a private one. His father took a video of the incident and called the school's action an example of "bias."


I also read today that one school is in deep trouble because female students were advised to "dress like a lady." Those four words created much outrage and were immediately deleted. The administrator humbly apologized.

TheParser said:

As a (very) senior citizen, I feel more comfortable seeing people of all ages dress "appropriately."

I have just seen a TV report that posters on social media are forcing many schools to "change" (abolish?) their dress codes.

In this case, an elementary school male was turned away from the first day of school because he was wearing dreadlocks. I believe the school is a private one. His father took a video of the incident and called the school's action an example of "bias."


I also read today that one school is in deep trouble because female students were advised to "dress like a lady." Those four words created much outrage and were immediately deleted. The administrator humbly apologized.

Click to expand...

Sure schools should have dress codes.It prepares them for when they become adults who have to get jobs, because a lot of jobs have a dress code.Many jobs don't let you wear I'm with stupid t-shirts, cut off shorts and a pair of flip flops.
It ensures kids aren't wearing gang clothing.Which was an issue when I was a kid.
It ensures kids are wearing t-shirts with sex or drug recreational messages on them.Which I have been guilty of doing when I was a teenager.
It ensures kids aren't wearing sexually provocative clothing.
Depending on the dress code and can school officials who belongs at the school and who doesn't. For example at the schools my nephew and nieces attended certain grades wore a specific color and type of shirt.
It also helps keep things politically neutral.
And for the liberal pc crowd out there it ensures kids are shamed for wearing poor kids clothing.

Absent the details on any of the stories listed by the OP, the issue is always the same with opinion on dressing "appropriately." There is not agreement on what that is, and since it is no longer the 1950's what we will not see is some return to social conservatism and modesty in that context.

School dress codes are more about what is and is not a distraction, and lesser about the social controls behind someone dressed appropriate. They may both have the same underline reasoning but overall we are seeing dress codes become outdated in today's social climate. The other issue is time and time again we see school policy, especially zero tolerance policy, end up being absent of reason policy. The more we lean on that type of thinking the more we end up with these stories questioning these impacts.

If we are going to have a dress code we need to be straight on the reasoning.

TheParser said:

As a (very) senior citizen, I feel more comfortable seeing people of all ages dress "appropriately."

I have just seen a TV report that posters on social media are forcing many schools to "change" (abolish?) their dress codes.

In this case, a young elementary school male was turned away from the first day of school because he was wearing dreadlocks. I believe the school is a private one. His father took a video of the incident and called the school's action an example of "bias."


I also read today that one school is in deep trouble because female students were advised to "dress like a lady." Those four words created much outrage and were immediately deleted. The administrator humbly apologized.

Click to expand...

State and Federal Courts have provided ample case precedents on the limits of School Dress Codes in public schools. Private Schools and Public Charter Schools can and tend to set far stricter codes.

In the late 1960s entering junior high school in the Orlando Florida area, male students who grew long hair became an issue. I wanted my parents to support my quest for long hair.... even if that meant a lawsuit. By the mid 1970s, most public schools no longer attempted to restrict long hair.

In the fall of 2000, one of my daughters entered a brand new Manatee County Florida pubic school as a 2nd grader. By the end of the school year, the School Advisory Council created a new mandatory uniform policy for the following year. My daughter told me she did not want to wear the uniform. That Council did not take kindly to me for letting my daughter opt out. The School Board knew I had Federal Case Law on my side.

That following school year I joined the School Advisory Council... only for the one school year. As a group, they did not welcome me. They tolerated me. No one ostracized my daughter. A few other parents opted out of the uniform policy. My daughter, very social and athletic, made many friends, liked the school and stayed there until transitioning to middle school.

I believe in showing students as much tolerance and giving them as much latitude as possible.

As a person who spent over 33 years teaching in a public school where there was no true dress code, and who also spent 12 years as a student in a Catholic school where we did have a dress code, I do have an opinion on this subject.

Outside of simple rules against things like profane messages on clothing or immodest clothing, I see no reason to regulate the clothing students wear. I see no educational or academic benefit to forcing students to wear uniforms.

As to hair styles and length, I have always taken the position that we as teachers should care far more about what is in the head of the student that what is on the head of a student. How one wears their hear is a personal decision that should not be taken away from a student.

Many decades ago a smart ass second grade longview, asked Sister Mary Terisa, why I could not ware
blue jeans and T shirts to school. Her reply is likely as true today as then.
"Boys who ware blue jeans and T-shirts , will act blue jeans and T-shirts."

longview said:

Many decades ago a smart ass second grade longview, asked Sister Mary Terisa, why I could not ware
blue jeans and T shirts to school. Her reply is likely as true today as then.
"Boys who ware blue jeans and T-shirts , will act blue jeans and T-shirts."

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I don't guess i get it.

haymarket said:

As a person who spent over 33 years teaching in a public school where there was no true dress code, and who also spent 12 years as a student in a Catholic school where we did have a dress code, I do have an opinion on this subject.

Outside of simple rules against things like profane messages on clothing or immodest clothing, I see no reason to regulate the clothing students wear. I see no educational or academic benefit to forcing students to wear uniforms.

As to hair styles and length, I have always taken the position that we as teachers should care far more about what is in the head of the student that what is on the head of a student. How one wears their hear is a personal decision that should not be taken away from a student.

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There are both advantages and disadvantages of school uniforms/dress codes. It is up to the school's governing body to make and justify such decisions. Personally, I would rather have uniforms than a dress code if the choice is between one or the other.

https://vittana.org/22-advantages-and-disadvantages-of-school-uniforms

CLAX1911 said:

I don't guess i get it.

Click to expand...

Her overall message was that boys dress a certain way when they are going out playing,
and the school wanted to establish that school was not play time, and so school uniforms
reinforced the demarcation between playtime and schooltime.

longview said:

Her overall message was that boys dress a certain way when they are going out playing,
and the school wanted to establish that school was not play time, and so school uniforms
reinforced the demarcation between playtime and schooltime.

Click to expand...

Oh, i see.

I grew up going to public school in the 90s nobody cared much Abbott what people wore.

jamesrage said:

Sure schools should have dress codes.It prepares them for when they become adults who have to get jobs, because a lot of jobs have a dress code.Many jobs don't let you wear I'm with stupid t-shirts, cut off shorts and a pair of flip flops.
It ensures kids aren't wearing gang clothing.Which was an issue when I was a kid.
It ensures kids are wearing t-shirts with sex or drug recreational messages on them.Which I have been guilty of doing when I was a teenager.
It ensures kids aren't wearing sexually provocative clothing.
Depending on the dress code and can school officials who belongs at the school and who doesn't. For example at the schools my nephew and nieces attended certain grades wore a specific color and type of shirt.
It also helps keep things politically neutral.
And for the liberal pc crowd out there it ensures kids are shamed for wearing poor kids clothing.

Click to expand...

That (bolded above) assertion depends on the cost of uniforms and who must pay it.

Only if they're fetching....8)

ttwtt78640 said:

That (bolded above) assertion depends on the cost of uniforms and who must pay it.

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Many of the schools that have a uniform dress code have parents buy a specific type and color of shirt that can be bought at any walmart and possibly thrift store.

jamesrage said:

Many of the schools that have a uniform dress code have parents buy a specific type and color of shirt that can be bought at any walmart and possibly thrift store.

Click to expand...

Yep, but does that 'type' of shirt cost more or less than a T-shirt? Polo or button shirts cost more than T-shirts do and are harder to find in thrift stores - especially if demand is increased by a local school dress code. When I worked for employers that required uniforms the employer (through a contractor service) provided the uniforms and repaired/cleaned them.

TheParser said:

Should schools have dress codes?...As a (very) senior citizen, I feel more comfortable seeing people of all ages dress "appropriately."

I have just seen a TV report that posters on social media are forcing many schools to "change" (abolish?) their dress codes.

In this case, an elementary school male was turned away from the first day of school because he was wearing dreadlocks. I believe the school is a private one. His father took a video of the incident and called the school's action an example of "bias."


I also read today that one school is in deep trouble because female students were advised to "dress like a lady." Those four words created much outrage and were immediately deleted. The administrator humbly apologized.

Click to expand...

Red:

1. Yes.
2. Schools do have dress codes.

Tan:
I don't know what it is that people act as though literally everything has been democratized, so to speak. They really should read the 1st Amendment. It says "Congress shall make no law ... abridging the freedom of speech ... or the right of the people peaceably to ... petition the government for a redress of grievances."

• While Congress (and, to an extent, by inference, the government) shall make no such law, the rest of society can and in many instances should just ignore many of these social media outbursts that attempt to politicize what really isn't a matter of politics, but rather a matter of managing a school, its students and its environment.
• Minors have only as much right to free expression as the adults in whose care they find themselves at any given moment are of a mind to grant.
  • If a minor doesn't like the lengths of or limits on his/her freedom of expression, he has one option: grin and bear it.
  • If a child's parent doesn't like the lengths of or limits on his/her child's freedom of expression in a school, the parent has several options: (1) grin and bear it, (2) send the child to a different school, or (3) home school the child.

I think social media is a wonderful thing, but I think too that it's given a voice to people who have every right to say what they want but who, frankly, don't deserve to be heard.

Blue:
Then the only people who have a say in the matter is the school's administration, alumni and trustees.


Pink:
I wish I could have seen the man in person so I could have burst into a guffaw before him.



It's a private school. That private schools have dress codes is not a novel notion, and they don't spring them on parents. In many instances, they're published online.

• E.g., Georgetown Prep --> "Hair is to be kept combed, neat, clean, and at a length and style judged appropriate by the Dean of Students [DoS]."
  • What does that mean? It means:
    • If one thinks one knows what the DoS will consider an appropriate "length and style," one can try whatever one wants and see what happens.
    • If one is in doubt, ask.
    • If one is in doubt and unwilling to ask, one can try whatever one wants and see what happens.
    • Whether one's hairstyle is of an appropriate length and style is solely at the DoS' discretion, not the parent's and not the child's.

That man's solution is simple: put the child in a different school. I mean, really. Think about the substance of what that man is doing/saying. "Dude," send your child to a school that has policies you agree with! Or get over it and STFU. It's a private school. Like all private schools, the school essentially says, as go all matters at the school, "This is how we do things here. If that works for you, apply for admission. If it doesn't, this isn't the school for you."

Private schools are allowed to be biased. Hell, they are so from the get go by din't of having selective admissions. Whoever thought a private school isn't biased? For Christ's sake, the reason most people send their kids to private schools is for one or another aspect of bias the school exhibits.

Trippy Trekker said:

State and Federal Courts have provided ample case precedents on the limits of School Dress Codes in public schools. Private Schools and Public Charter Schools can and tend to set far stricter codes.

In the late 1960s entering junior high school in the Orlando Florida area, male students who grew long hair became an issue. I wanted my parents to support my quest for long hair.... even if that meant a lawsuit. By the mid 1970s, most public schools no longer attempted to restrict long hair.

In the fall of 2000, one of my daughters entered a brand new Manatee County Florida pubic school as a 2nd grader. By the end of the school year, the School Advisory Council created a new mandatory uniform policy for the following year. My daughter told me she did not want to wear the uniform. That Council did not take kindly to me for letting my daughter opt out. The School Board knew I had Federal Case Law on my side.

That following school year I joined the School Advisory Council... only for the one school year. As a group, they did not welcome me. They tolerated me. No one ostracized my daughter. A few other parents opted out of the uniform policy. My daughter, very social and athletic, made many friends, liked the school and stayed there until transitioning to middle school.

I believe in showing students as much tolerance and giving them as much latitude as possible.

Click to expand...

As much as I agree with your concluding statement, as another user already stated: it is about preperation for the real world. A 2nd grader is one thing. But once kids get to middle school? They need to start learning that “you can’t always get what you want.” And that includes wearing Sandles and face piercings to office jobs. It also depends on the schools. Areas with gang problems should enforce uniforms. It has been proven effective in dealing with certain problems like “colors” and concealing of weapons.

But again, this is totally different than a 2nd grade girl. Life is tough. Life doesn’t give tolerance and latitude. It would be nice if it did. We need to stop shielding kids from that concept.

ttwtt78640 said:

Yep, but does that 'type' of shirt cost more or less than a T-shirt? Polo or button shirts cost more than T-shirts do and are harder to find in thrift stores - especially if demand is increased by a local school dress code. When I worked for employers that required uniforms the employer (through a contractor service) provided the uniforms and repaired/cleaned them.

Click to expand...

In the school district where my kids went they had uniforms in middle school (6th, 7th, and 8th grade),
basically dockers and polo shirts, (the girls could ware skirts, also).
The kids in that age range grow fast, so there was always plenty in thrift stores, and Walmart has the shirts even now for $6 each.

longview said:

In the school district where my kids went they had uniforms in middle school (6th, 7th, and 8th grade),
basically dockers and polo shirts, (the girls could ware skirts, also).
The kids in that age range grow fast, so there was always plenty in thrift stores, and Walmart has the shirts even now for $6 each.

Click to expand...

The point is that even $6, times how ever many (3 or 4 per kid?) shirts are needed, is not considered a minor expense for some folks. If it is considered a minor expense then just add that to the school's operating budget.

ttwtt78640 said:

The point is that even $6, times how ever many (3 or 4 per kid?) shirts are needed, is not considered a minor expense for some folks. If it is considered a minor expense then just add that to the school's operating budget.

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What I found was it was cheaper to buy uniforms than the pay for outfits of the kids choosing,
the uniforms actually saved money.

Schools should be privatized and voluntary. Such schools should be able to have whatever dress code they wish.

Anarchon said:

Schools should be privatized and voluntary. Such schools should be able to have whatever dress code they wish.

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WHoooo...Every school should be part of the military and students live in barracks, get uniforms, and get 3 squares.


Wait! Schools should be like prisons and we should lock up kids for 12 years....everyone gets a orange jumper.

I like brain storming with you...

TheParser said:

As a (very) senior citizen, I feel more comfortable seeing people of all ages dress "appropriately."

I have just seen a TV report that posters on social media are forcing many schools to "change" (abolish?) their dress codes.

In this case, an elementary school male was turned away from the first day of school because he was wearing dreadlocks. I believe the school is a private one. His father took a video of the incident and called the school's action an example of "bias."


I also read today that one school is in deep trouble because female students were advised to "dress like a lady." Those four words created much outrage and were immediately deleted. The administrator humbly apologized.

Click to expand...

I support a dress code that shows adult thinking in their dress. They should dress more like their parents. I do not want a universal dress code like they have at private catholic schools. Having a girl in a mini skirt showing off her legs is disturbing to me.

ttwtt78640 said:

Yep, but does that 'type' of shirt cost more or less than a T-shirt? Polo or button shirts cost more than T-shirts do and are harder to find in thrift stores - especially if demand is increased by a local school dress code. When I worked for employers that required uniforms the employer (through a contractor service) provided the uniforms and repaired/cleaned them.

Click to expand...

There are lay-a-ways and many stores if they know there is a demand for a particular item of clothing will keep them in stock.

Trippy Trekker said:

I believe in showing students as much tolerance and giving them as much latitude as possible.

Click to expand...

With such good committed parenting, I'm sure your daughter would have turned out just as well either way.

I do believe that respect for authority and following structure they dont necessarily like is good preparation for adulthood. Kids need to learn discipline, as it will shape their life.

Open debates and discussion over an issue like this...*in the school* are a good idea too. Even if the students dont win, they learn in the process. As a matter of fact, 'they learn the process.' That this is how adults examine things critically, weigh them, and sometimes do not have the final say on the decision.

Would probably be better for the school, get rid of distractions, controversy, and also level the playing field, for example, everybody has the same clothes on, poor kids won't be ostracized for not affording nice fashionable clothes. But I don't really have much of an opinion one way or another about making it happen

But for most jobs, the dress codes have been relaxed. My office allows (university) allows jeans. Business casual is the usual attire. People don't wear suits and ties anymore.

It was interesting watching a video of NYC 1912 where everybody was dressed up nicely walking about the city