• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!
  • Welcome to our archives. No new posts are allowed here.

Obamacare Repeal Might Have Just Died Tonight

azgreg

azgreg

Chicks dig the long ball
DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 28, 2012
Messages
25,240
Reaction score
24,034
Location
Phoenix, AZ
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
Obamacare Repeal Might Have Just Died Tonight

The stated goal of the dissenters is mild: They merely want to take a little more time to clarify what comes next. “You would think after six years we would have a pretty good sense of what we would like to do,” explains Corker. Of course, they don’t have a good sense of what to do. They have some vague concepts without agreement. And any Republican plan, when fleshed out, turns out to be extremely risky. Conservatives hate Obamacare because it redistributes too much money from the rich and healthy to the poor and sick. But they don’t publicly attack the law on that basis. Instead they attack it for high premiums, high deductibles, and narrow choice of doctors and hospitals — all flaws that any Republican plan would have in much higher doses. Republicans have yet to unify around a single, concrete, scorable plan because it is conceptually impossible to design a health-care plan that meets conservative ideological goals and is also acceptable to the broader public.
Click to expand...

While the author of this piece is clearly left leaning he makes some good points. My belief on the GOP's struggle here was that they didn't believe that Trump would win and they felt that they really didn't have to come up with a replacement that they told their constituents about and after Trump did win they find themselves scrambling to fulfill campaign promises. There's also a small part of me that believes that they really didn't want to repeal the ACA in the first place.
 
The reason you cant repeal Obamacare is because it is an entitlement now. The time to kill it was before it was born. Its simply too late now. Were stuck with it.
 
I agree the Republicans didn't believe Trump would win but they have been attacking a Obamacare since well before Trump announced his candidacy. Did they think no Republican had a chance to win? There is no excuse for them not having had a plan for awhile now.
 
azgreg said:
Obamacare Repeal Might Have Just Died Tonight



While the author of this piece is clearly left leaning he makes some good points. My belief on the GOP's struggle here was that they didn't believe that Trump would win and they felt that they really didn't have to come up with a replacement that they told their constituents about and after Trump did win they find themselves scrambling to fulfill campaign promises. There's also a small part of me that believes that they really didn't want to repeal the ACA in the first place.
Click to expand...
I do not agree with the last statement (yours) but the rest seems dead on. It is easy to play the critic when it came to ACA but when all of sudden the country turns to you and says, ok You do better, it becomes a whole lot more complicated. This is going to be real interesting and eye opening for some.
 
Fletch said:
The reason you cant repeal Obamacare is because it is an entitlement now. The time to kill it was before it was born. Its simply too late now. Were stuck with it.
Click to expand...

Or some form of it that has been Re-branded.
 
Fletch said:
The reason you cant repeal Obamacare is because it is an entitlement now. The time to kill it was before it was born. Its simply too late now. Were stuck with it.
Click to expand...

Sorry, but if the Republicans actually had a plan that would provide more people with more affordable healthcare they would have been shouting it from the rooftops. As of right now all they have is "competition" and "buying across state lines". They have no solutions and haven't worried about it for the past 8 years.
 
azgreg said:
Obamacare Repeal Might Have Just Died Tonight



While the author of this piece is clearly left leaning he makes some good points. My belief on the GOP's struggle here was that they didn't believe that Trump would win and they felt that they really didn't have to come up with a replacement that they told their constituents about and after Trump did win they find themselves scrambling to fulfill campaign promises. There's also a small part of me that believes that they really didn't want to repeal the ACA in the first place.
Click to expand...

It is important to understand that ACA is a lousy law in size and complexity. It needs to be removed from the books in its present form.

But it does make sense to have every citizen insured for a minimal coverage and the guarantee that they will not receive more treatment with no exception.

Sorily we have a badly constructed system social protection, so that a decision must be made on a case by case basis, how to pay for the destitute.

There must be a discussion about how much the basic health insurance must include and how high the maximum cost of treatment of an individual may be.
 
Casper said:
Or some form of it that has been Re-branded.
Click to expand...

There are only two ways to 'fix' the heath care system. The first is to scrap the entire thing and go to a market based system. The other is to throw up our hands and turn the whole thing over to the state. It is the latter that will ultimately happen, not the former. So republicans will tinker with it. Democrats will obstruct and demagogue. And the public will see costs continue to rise.
 
Fletch said:
The reason you cant repeal Obamacare is because it is an entitlement now. The time to kill it was before it was born. Its simply too late now. Were stuck with it.
Click to expand...

I agree. It should never have happened. The Republicans tried to repeal. Reid never sent a bill to committee.

Outright and immediate repeal is unlikely at this point, but OCare can be gradually scaled back and replaced/repealed a little at a time.

But again I ask, where is the Democrat fix OCare bill?
 
Fletch said:
There are only two ways to 'fix' the heath care system. The first is to scrap the entire thing and go to a market based system. The other is to throw up our hands and turn the whole thing over to the state. It is the latter that will ultimately happen, not the former. So republicans will tinker with it. Democrats will obstruct and demagogue. And the public will see costs continue to rise.
Click to expand...

Correct. Personally I believe ACA was only to drive us to a single payer plan and was the plan all along. I only hope that when it does come that we get something that actually works, but given the governments track record I am not confident of that happening.
 
azgreg said:
Obamacare Repeal Might Have Just Died Tonight



While the author of this piece is clearly left leaning he makes some good points. My belief on the GOP's struggle here was that they didn't believe that Trump would win and they felt that they really didn't have to come up with a replacement that they told their constituents about and after Trump did win they find themselves scrambling to fulfill campaign promises. There's also a small part of me that believes that they really didn't want to repeal the ACA in the first place.
Click to expand...

I don't know why people say the GOP has no plan:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...its-costs-are-unclear/?utm_term=.57f74a209119

They are going to have to find a way to make Obamacare work. The current cost trajectory is not sustainable when it starts gutting middle class budgets. We are also paying 100% of the premiums of most of the U6 unemployed who should be working. That is a huge expense.

The whole asshat scheme was to insure the uninsured who were winding up in emergency rooms. Remember them? Well, they are still there. What has changed is $5000 a year premiums, and $5000 deductibles for mom and dad and three kids making $80K a year. Something has to give and the mandate has been passed on to the Republicans.

For more background:

Even With Obamacare, 29 Million People Are Uninsured: Here’s Why | The Fiscal Times

FYI: Medicaid is welfare.
 
azgreg said:
Obamacare Repeal Might Have Just Died Tonight



While the author of this piece is clearly left leaning he makes some good points. My belief on the GOP's struggle here was that they didn't believe that Trump would win and they felt that they really didn't have to come up with a replacement that they told their constituents about and after Trump did win they find themselves scrambling to fulfill campaign promises. There's also a small part of me that believes that they really didn't want to repeal the ACA in the first place.
Click to expand...

I stand by my original assessment: repealing Obamacare was more about political posturing than something they were actually wiling to do.


Interesting thing my wife brought up yesterday, if true, it points to the stupidity of it all. When asked if people liked Obamacare, they said no. When same people were asked if they liked the Affordable Healthcare Act, they said yes.
 
Casper said:
I do not agree with the last statement (yours) but the rest seems dead on. It is easy to play the critic when it came to ACA but when all of sudden the country turns to you and says, ok You do better, it becomes a whole lot more complicated. This is going to be real interesting and eye opening for some.
Click to expand...

Fair enough. I still feel that as a whole GOP members really don't want to repeal the law and would be just fine in trying to fix it if possible.

Casper said:
Or some form of it that has been Re-branded.
Click to expand...

TrumpCare

Fletch said:
There are only two ways to 'fix' the heath care system. The first is to scrap the entire thing and go to a market based system. The other is to throw up our hands and turn the whole thing over to the state. It is the latter that will ultimately happen, not the former. So republicans will tinker with it. Democrats will obstruct and demagogue. And the public will see costs continue to rise.
Click to expand...

By state do you mean at the state level or fed?

chuckiechan said:
I don't know why people say the GOP has no plan:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...its-costs-are-unclear/?utm_term=.57f74a209119

They are going to have to find a way to make Obamacare work. The current cost trajectory is not sustainable when it starts gutting middle class budgets. We are also paying 100% of the premiums of most of the U6 unemployed who should be working. That is a huge expense.

The whole asshat scheme was to insure the uninsured who were winding up in emergency rooms. Remember them? Well, they are still there. What has changed is $5000 a year premiums, and $5000 deductibles for mom and dad and three kids making $80K a year. Something has to give and the mandate has been passed on to the Republicans.

For more background:

Even With Obamacare, 29 Million People Are Uninsured: Here’s Why | The Fiscal Times

FYI: Medicaid is welfare.
Click to expand...

Fair enough. Not no plan, but rather not much of one.

calamity said:
I stand by my original assessment: repealing Obamacare was more about political posturing than something they were actually wiling to do.


Interesting thing my wife brought up yesterday, if true, it points to the stupidity of it all. When asked if people liked Obamacare, they said no. When same people were asked if they liked the Affordable Healthcare Act, they said yes.
Click to expand...

I find that as well. Rarely do people outside of political junkie circles like here know they are the same thing.
 
azgreg said:
Fair enough. I still feel that as a whole GOP members really don't want to repeal the law and would be just fine in trying to fix it if possible.



TrumpCare



By state do you mean at the state level or fed?



Fair enough. Not no plan, but rather not much of one.



I find that as well. Rarely do people outside of political junkie circles like here know they are the same thing.
Click to expand...

Well I sure hope they do fix it but not sure how that would work out since the main problems are ones that would bring down the entire program if removed or fixed or are simply not within the control of the government. Such as: the mandatory portion with fines if not covered and the huge deductibles, and the pre-existing clause cannot be removed and it cannot come with the usual triple rates to get coverage.

Why put it on Trump, it will be the Congress that does the reform, I would prefer RepubCare, that way the people will know who to thank or burn at the stake, whichever is appropriate.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom