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As Jewish enclaves spring up around NYC, so does intolerance

OldFatGuy said:
It is currently estimated that more than 7.5 million Jews live in the US. It is currently estimated that slightly less than 400k Haredi Jews live in the US, divided into almost a dozen sub-sects. Despite their huge birthrate, not believing in birth control or abortion, the population of Haredi Jews has not increased as expected from predictions of a decade ago. The main reason, emigration to other locales, most specifically South America as well as in the Caribbean , particularly Brazil and Argentina where land is cheap, and sophisticated cities offer commercial opportunities. These migrations have been spear headed by the Chabad Lubavitch, seeking conversion returns to Judaism from the conversos and marranos. Others have followed.

It should also be noted, that among the count of the Haredi, are the Modern Orthodox, who neither dress nor behave as other Haredi, and are almost indistinguishable from the general population. They account for more than half of the Haredi. They keep Shabbos, keep the laws of Kasruth, but their women do not wear wigs for modesty, and the men work in every possible profession, craft, and so on. They do not wear the black.

I live in Kew Gardens Queens, which has a small population of Haredi. Approximately 200k Haredi live in Brooklyn, 40k in Queens, approximately another 60k throughout the greater Metropolitan area including the population at Kiryas Joel of about 30k and about 15k in the 5 Towns of Nassau County. The second largest concentration of Haredi population is in California, the rest in pockets in southern cities including Philadelphia. Keep in mind Sephardic Haredi also do not wear the black. The largest concentration of Sephardic Haredi live in Israel. Sephardic Haredi are generally not opposed to the State of Israel, and have voluntarily served their duty in the IDF.

My numbers come from studies done under the auspices of the UJA. Feel free to verify them. They have been confirmed through similar studies done by the AJHS (American Jewish Historical Society) and The World Jewish Congress.
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Do you have any links to your numbers? Because I see quite a number of issues with what you've posted, as well as quite different numbers than what I've seen. I would link to my sources, but I am on my phone at the moment.

First of all, there are many more than a dozen sub-sects and dynasties under umbrella of "Haredi", including all the Hasidic dynasties.

Modern Orthodox is certainly not counted as Haredi - the term specifically refers to the "ultra-orthodox" - although that term is somewhat pejorative.
 
TheDoctorWasIn said:
Do you have any links to your numbers? Because I see quite a number of issues with what you've posted, as well as quite different numbers than what I've seen. I would link to my sources, but I am on my phone at the moment.

First of all, there are many more than a dozen sub-sects and dynasties under umbrella of "Haredi", including all the Hasidic dynasties.

Modern Orthodox is certainly not counted as Haredi - the term specifically refers to the "ultra-orthodox" - although that term is somewhat pejorative.
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I well know there are more than a dozen sub-sects of Haredi. Not all the Hasidic dynasties are ultra orthodox. Even the Hassidic movement dates from the late 18th century at the earliest. It arrived in many colors. I am not the one who defines who is Haredi and who is not. I never maintain links more than a day with exception of links I use often, too much of a chore. I read all this for other reasons long before this conversation. I've also read other numbers, but when seeking to confirm them they almost all came back to self promoting sources in the Orthodox communities.

Regardless, the Haredi are a relative small representation of American Jews. Perhaps not so small in Israel, but here a caricature target for antisemites, let alone for claiming they are all antivaxers.
 
OldFatGuy said:
I well know there are more than a dozen sub-sects of Haredi. Not all the Hasidic dynasties are ultra orthodox. Even the Hassidic movement dates from the late 18th century at the earliest. It arrived in many colors. I am not the one who defines who is Haredi and who is not. I never maintain links more than a day with exception of links I use often, too much of a chore. I read all this for other reasons long before this conversation. I've also read other numbers, but when seeking to confirm them they almost all came back to self promoting sources in the Orthodox communities.

Regardless, the Haredi are a relative small representation of American Jews. Perhaps not so small in Israel, but here a caricature target for antisemites, let alone for claiming they are all antivaxers.
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The Hasidic movement was started in the early 18th century, by the Baal Shem Tov. Every Hasidic dynasty can be traced back to him.

All Hasdim are Haredi.

Haredi are the fastest growing segment of the American Jewish population, and (statistically projected) will represent a majority of American Jews by 2050 or so.

They are not the tiny minority you believe. I suspect your population numbers are significantly out of date.
 
Don't really get the flare ups. I live next to a YUGE Jewish community. Hasids, Orthodox, Reform, Conservative -- has them all. Yeshivas, Congregations, Chabad centers, schools, ...all of it. Great people. The Hasids and Orthodox keep completely to themselves. The others, they're all friendly as can be.

They're great to have as a neighboring community...I get a nice selection of kosher goods, ever have kosher pizza? fogettaboutit....Deli?....Matzo ball soup? my god, a world without Babka? C'mon...
 
TheDoctorWasIn said:
The Hasidic movement was started in the early 18th century, by the Baal Shem Tov. Every Hasidic dynasty can be traced back to him.

All Hasdim are Haredi.

Haredi are the fastest growing segment of the American Jewish population, and (statistically projected) will represent a majority of American Jews by 2050 or so.

They are not the tiny minority you believe. I suspect your population numbers are significantly out of date.
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I'm not going to continue past this post. My numbers were from surveys in 2018. Not all Haredi are Hasidim. Projections often fail, we have only the here and now.
 
ChezC3 said:
Don't really get the flare ups. I live next to a YUGE Jewish community. Hasids, Orthodox, Reform, Conservative -- has them all. Yeshivas, Congregations, Chabad centers, schools, ...all of it. Great people. The Hasids and Orthodox keep completely to themselves. The others, they're all friendly as can be.

They're great to have as a neighboring community...I get a nice selection of kosher goods, ever have kosher pizza? fogettaboutit....Deli?....Matzo ball soup? my god, a world without Babka? C'mon...
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Surprisingly, Trader Joe's carries a relatively inexpensive but high quality chocolate bobka.
 
Felis Leo said:
That is kind of like saying that attacks on Muslims are a result some of the members of the Islamic community's stance on Female Genital Mutilation. It is purely a pretext for hatred and murder, not the actual reason. The kinds of people who want to go around attacking Muslims do not care one fig about FGM. And I doubt the people who are attacking openly-religious Jews are the kinds of folk who care about their various stances on vaccination.
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The attacks have nothing to do with vaccinations, and everything to do with the fact that black people in these communities feel like they're getting a raw deal, and being forced to move out of the places where they were born and raised. Jews certainly aren't the only people who are targeted for violence because of gentrification. The idea that this is an 'epidemic' now that it's happening to orthodox Jews is highly entertaining. It was happening to white hipsters in Bedford Stuyvesant 10 years ago, and no one gave much concern. It's happening now to white professionals who are gentrifying downtown Los Angeles.
 
OldFatGuy said:
Surprisingly, Trader Joe's carries a relatively inexpensive but high quality chocolate bobka.
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It actually wouldn't surprise me, TJ's comes out with some real gems from time to time.... Had an Apple Crumb babka from Whole Foods that wasn't bad....

Luckily for me though, I've got a good half dozen or so Kosher bakeries to get the good stuff. (cinnamon is my personal fav...)
 
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