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North Carolina is no longer classified as a democracy

PIPEWRENCH said:
No. A democracy is a government where the people vote on everything. We have a constitutional republic. The only thing we vote on is the representatives. Even the president is an electoral college. Our supreme court are appointed and approved by our representatives. We have a representative government or a republic.
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:doh How incredibly ignorant. A democracy where the people "vote on everything" is called a direct democracy. Do you seriously not realize that there are different kinds of democracies?
 
TheDemSocialist said:
:doh How incredibly ignorant. A democracy where the people "vote on everything" is called a direct democracy. Do you seriously not realize that there are different kinds of democracies?
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I was just going by what is written in the constitution.

Article. IV.
Section. 4.

The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened), against domestic Violence.

Why do we pledge allegiance to the republic if we are not a republic?

"I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."
 
TheDemSocialist said:
What does this have anything to do with democracy?
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Because President Hussein is trying to impede the governance of the duly elected incoming President Trump.
 
SDET said:
Because President Hussein is trying to impede the governance of the duly elected incoming President Trump.
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Saddam Hussein has been dead for close to 11 years now.
 
digsbe said:
Honestly I think that award should go to Maryland

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Everything about Maryland's districts is pretty much designed to minimize Republicans from winning House seats. I'm surprised it's not talked about more often. But then again it's done to favor Democrats...
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100% of the Eastren Shore coul vote Republican and still a Democrat would be voted in for what ever office, save our representative in the state legislature.
 
PIPEWRENCH said:
I was just going by what is written in the constitution.

Article. IV.
Section. 4.

The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened), against domestic Violence.

Why do we pledge allegiance to the republic if we are not a republic?

"I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."
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Democracy and a republic form of government are not mutually exclusive.
 
PIPEWRENCH said:
I was just going by what is written in the constitution.

Article. IV.
Section. 4.

The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened), against domestic Violence.

Why do we pledge allegiance to the republic if we are not a republic?

"I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."
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a republic of the founders is a mixed government of divided power, meaning it has no dominate entity, a good and stable government

a democracy would be a government of no division of power, power is concentrated in one dominate entity...the people, which is an unstable government.
 
TheDemSocialist said:
Democracy and a republic form of government are not mutually exclusive.
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I figured out the downside of a democracy the first local meeting I went to of the city I live in. The city wanted to put up a giant billboard on city property behind my house. All the homeowners affected by the light and buzzing of the sign were called to a meeting. 90% of us went to the meeting and unanimously voted against the sign. It would light up my yard like daytime. But the 200+ homeowners that were affected by the sign were out voted by the thousands of people unaffected by the sign who wanted the revenues. That was my first introduction to mob rule or a democracy. They did this section by section all across the city pitting the thousands unaffected against the people affected putting up billboards. I will stick with my constitutional republic that protects the rights of the minority as well as the individual.

After they put up enough of these billboards we got together with all the people affected and had them removed at great expense of the city. There forcing their rule on us cost us millions in debt. So now we need to raise taxes.
 
PIPEWRENCH said:
I figured out the downside of a democracy the first local meeting I went to of the city I live in. The city wanted to put up a giant billboard on city property behind my house. All the homeowners affected by the light and buzzing of the sign were called to a meeting. 90% of us went to the meeting and unanimously voted against the sign. It would light up my yard like daytime. But the 200+ homeowners that were affected by the sign were out voted by the thousands of people unaffected by the sign who wanted the revenues. That was my first introduction to mob rule or a democracy. They did this section by section all across the city pitting the thousands unaffected against the people affected putting up billboards. I will stick with my constitutional republic that protects the rights of the minority as well as the individual.

After they put up enough of these billboards we got together with all the people affected and had them removed at great expense of the city. There forcing their rule on us cost us millions in debt. So now we need to raise taxes.
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Again, just because you did not get what you want at a city council meeting does not mean that a republican form of government and a democracy are not mutually exclusive... So again, I tell you a a republic and a democracy are not mutually exclusive. What do you think happens when we elected our representatives and senators? We go to a voting place and cast our vote. They then will represent us in Congress. AKA Representative Democracy.
 
maquiscat said:
100% of the Eastren Shore coul vote Republican and still a Democrat would be voted in for what ever office, save our representative in the state legislature.
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Eastern Shore is the ONLY district where a Republican is in the House. I guess they figure they won't be able to dilute out those more conservative votes so they wall them in and don't tamper with that district (notice it's shape and geographic area is fairly uniform and more natural looking compared to the contortions of all the others). The gerrymandering is so blatant I laugh at how obvious it is. They go way out of their way to clump rural conservative areas and tie their votes into urban Democrat areas around DC and Baltimore. Hell, looking at Baltimore with all the skinny districts flowing through it is obvious. They use Montgomery County near DC to dilute conservative votes from the surrounding counties. Please, like the people in Mid-South MoCo are going to be similar than those in Westminster or rural Frederick :roll: I do find it extremely silly how NC gets all this publicity when you have Democrat strongholds like Maryland playing the game far worse. I hope Larry Hogan stays around to fix this nonsense. If NC isn't a democracy with 3 of their 13 reps being Dem then what's that make MD with only 1 of their 8 being GOP?
 
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Master PO said:
a republic of the founders is a mixed government of divided power, meaning it has no dominate entity, a good and stable government

a democracy would be a government of no division of power, power is concentrated in one dominate entity...the people, which is an unstable government.
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The federal government is clearly a representative government. At the state and local level it is more of a democratic government. Our representatives are elected in a democratic process.

I have never looked into it but I am not sure if the senate or the congress has to be elected according to federal law. I don't think federal law cares how each state determines its representatives as long as their are only 2 senators per state and so many congressmen per population. It would be interesting to find out for sure.
 
PIPEWRENCH said:
The federal government is clearly a representative government. At the state and local level it is more of a democratic government. Our representatives are elected in a democratic process.

I have never looked into it but I am not sure if the senate or the congress has to be elected according to federal law. I don't think federal law cares how each state determines its representatives as long as their are only 2 senators per state and so many congressmen per population. It would be interesting to find out for sure.
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true. true today, but at one time in America during our mixed government period it was not on a federal level during our mixed government period, the only democratic process the House, and the electors chosen by the people via district making up half of the EC

the senate before the 17th and the direct election of the president is not democratic
 
Master PO said:
true. true today, but at one time in America during our mixed government period it was not on a federal level during our mixed government period, the only democratic process the House, and the electors chosen by the people via district making up half of the EC

the senate before the 17th and the direct election of the president is not democratic
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But was it by federal law or just state choice on how the representatives were determined back then and for that matter even today. Another words does the federal government dictate the process by which we get our state representatives and senate.
 
PIPEWRENCH said:
But was it by federal law or just state choice on how the representatives were determined back then and for that matter even today. Another words does the federal government dictate the process by which we get our state representatives and senate.
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from the time of the founding until after the civil war only white males who met the Qualifications requisite set by the states governments could vote in state elections, the house of representatives and for electors based on the state districts of the EC, the senate and electors representing the states themselves were not elected by the people.

since women and other races were excluded from that process, that is hardly democratic, part of the reasoning for this is because many people of that time did not have a formable education and the government was not direct taxing people forcing them to pay for government.

those who voted were required to own property and pay the taxes on it in order to vote, the founders believed that those who voted must have a stake in government.

it must also me remembered in the times of the founders voting is not a right, its a privilege.
 
Master PO said:
from the time of the founding until after the civil war only white males who met the Qualifications requisite set by the states governments could vote in state elections, the house of representatives and for electors based on the state districts of the EC, the senate and electors representing the states themselves were not elected by the people.

since women and other races were excluded from that process, that is hardly democratic, part of the reasoning for this is because many people of that time did not have a formable education and the government was not direct taxing people forcing them to pay for government.

those who voted were required to own property and pay the taxes on it in order to vote, the founders believed that those who voted must have a stake in government.

it must also me remembered in the times of the founders voting is not a right, its a privilege.
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I did not know that. It makes sense to some degree that if you don't pay for government you should not have a say in government.

Wow. That would destroy the democratic party in this country. Look at all the people on welfare that would not have a vote.

Not good for the stay at home parent either unless there was a provision that gave them a vote do to the fact that they had children and a head of house hold who did pay taxes for both.

Lots of problems with only taxpayers getting to vote.
 
PIPEWRENCH said:
I did not know that. It makes sense to some degree that if you don't pay for government you should not have a say in government.

Wow. That would destroy the democratic party in this country. Look at all the people on welfare that would not have a vote.

Not good for the stay at home parent either unless there was a provision that gave them a vote do to the fact that they had children and a head of house hold who did pay taxes for both.

Lots of problems with only taxpayers getting to vote.
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The founders thinking was from the past experinace of history , if people have no stake in goverment [have nothing] but can vote they will use their power of the vote to take from those that do.

Remember that there was no direct tax on the people to support goverment
 
Absentglare said:
Um, no, women's rights do not qualify as "leftist, pseudo feminist bull****."

If you don't think women should be able to have control over their own bodies, perhaps you should visit Saudi Arabia.
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Geez, More "you are so backwards thinking because you believe babies have rights too" liberal rhetoric. Nearly no one agrees with your statement as an absolute. An ultrasound before an abortion isn't removing a woman's autonomy.
 
Phoenix said:
Geez, More "you are so backwards thinking because you believe babies have rights too" liberal rhetoric. Nearly no one agrees with your statement as an absolute. An ultrasound before an abortion isn't removing a woman's autonomy.
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It's an obvious attempt to make the act of abortion more psychologically taxing.

No amount of dishonesty can change that.
 
Phoenix said:
So was the Charlotte bathroom ordinance.
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No, that law secured freedom. You seem to have difficulty identifying this concept.

If an individual can use either bathroom, they have more freedom.

I an individual is restricted from limiting which bathroom can be used, that actually secures freedom by restricting the authoritarian social engineering.
 
Absentglare said:
No, that law secured freedom. You seem to have difficulty identifying this concept.

If an individual can use either bathroom, they have more freedom.

I an individual is restricted from limiting which bathroom can be used, that actually secures freedom by restricting the authoritarian social engineering.
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I don't have a difficulty understanding any ****ing thing. It was to force an agenda down the throats of people. Removing the ability to have mens and womens restrooms and lockers is an invasion of people's privacy. Who really thought this was a good idea, people would accept? We could use the same bathrooms already if we wanted. It was a statement. it was answered. Check your package and use the appropriate restroom.
 
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