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Don’t Fear the "Russian" Military, the country is in no position to wage a real conflict.

Re: Don’t Fear the "Russian" Military, the country is in no position to wage a real conflict.

FreedomFromAll said:
I was waiting for your argument on 'getting our ass handed to us' Guess that isnt coming anytime soon right?

I never claimed anything other than we defintely did not get our ass handed to us. I never said a damn thing about success dude. But that probably will not stop you from continuing your strawman crap, so talk to you later perhaps?
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We had our asses handed to us before we got there by our own government, and a JV team wearing sandals.

It's people like you who are living in a alternate reality if you think the USA gained anything over there.

Almost 7,000 dead and 900,000 young men and women injured.....for nothing.

The only possible success the USA will have from these two invasions is to use them both as examples for every war hawk and politician in the future...……………… showing them what happens when you go to war using bad judgement.
 
Re: Don’t Fear the "Russian" Military, the country is in no position to wage a real conflict.

Litwin said:
Muscovy (cooperative Ozero) has nothing to with commie project USSR , so stop your nonsense

do they look like commies to you? its a crime cartel

2f2766fb7d5da7e6231d9ac592175eb3.jpg
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Litwin:

It's a criminal cartel which has about 20,000 tanks and about 7,000 thermonuclear weapons, many mounted on ICBMs. Many states behave like criminal cartels, but that does not make them less dangerous.

Cheers.
Evilroddy.
 
Re: Don’t Fear the "Russian" Military, the country is in no position to wage a real conflict.

Evilroddy said:
Litwin:

It's a criminal cartel which has about 20,000 tanks and about 7,000 thermonuclear weapons, many mounted on ICBMs. Many states behave like criminal cartels, but that does not make them less dangerous.

Cheers.
Evilroddy.
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made in USSR , right, 30 years old, right?
ps made in "russia"
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"During the demonstration of Russia’s newest military equipment, foreign guests for the first time seen the modernized tanks, infantry fighting vehicle and also newest Russian-made 16×16 wheeled chassis, which is can be used to carry the mobile intercontinental ballistic missile.

According to Russia’s media, the K-7850 16×16 special wheeled platform is designed to replace the MZKT-79221 developed by the MZKT in Belarus. The new chassis with a lifting capacity of 85 t is equipped with diesel-electric drivetrain with electromotors embedded in center bosses.

But during the large-scale demonstrations, a video footage (broadcast by Zvezda TV) show the K-7850 encountering what looks like unexpected mechanical trouble.
During the demonstration, there was a failure in the onboard electronics of the new chassis, which led to the fact that a number of wheels turned in the opposite direction.

The video footage clearly shows what happens to the wheels of the 3rd and 4th axes"

https://defence-blog.com/army/moder...echanical-trouble-during-a-demonstration.html
 
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Re: Don’t Fear the "Russian" Military, the country is in no position to wage a real conflict.

Evilroddy said:
Rogue Valley:

The Soviet Union could not afford to fight the Great Patriotic War, but they did at tremendous cost in blood and treasure; and they won that war which they couldn't afford to fight. I would not be so certain that Russians will let economics stop them from winning (or at least drawing in mutual thermonuclear annihilation) the next great war they find themselves in.
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They're already raising the retirement ages to finance Ukraine and Syria.

Now tell us about that vaunted Russian military logistics command.
 
Re: Don’t Fear the "Russian" Military, the country is in no position to wage a real conflict.

Back to the OP...

We have a real conflict, but it in no way resembles traditional war.
 
Re: Don’t Fear the "Russian" Military, the country is in no position to wage a real conflict.

RetiredUSN said:
We had our asses handed to us before we got there by our own government, and a JV team wearing sandals.

It's people like you who are living in a alternate reality if you think the USA gained anything over there.

Almost 7,000 dead and 900,000 young men and women injured.....for nothing.

The only possible success the USA will have from these two invasions is to use them both as examples for every war hawk and politician in the future...……………… showing them what happens when you go to war using bad judgement.
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As Predicted strawman crap...

You should probably find that person that you are having an argument with, since I am not him. I mean I agree that both wars were pretty much useless and the commander in chiefs involved were all idiots (including the current one). But none of that supports your claim that Saddam or the Taliban handed our asses to us. We completely destroyed Iraq and Afghanistan; we handed their asses to them. Beyond that there was no real plan at all to deal with the inevitable consequences. And that is where most of those numbers that you are flashing came from. In other words there is a definite difference between war, occupation and assisting the new governments. And as cold as reality sounds, our numbers are greatly smaller than the enemies.

I never supported either war but I am sure that doesnt matter to someone who says "people like you". Yea we gave fought wars against people with that type of bigotry before.
 
Re: Don’t Fear the "Russian" Military, the country is in no position to wage a real conflict.

late said:
Back to the OP...

We have a real conflict, but it in no way resembles traditional war.
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Well it has a name: Its called cold war.
 
Re: Don’t Fear the "Russian" Military, the country is in no position to wage a real conflict.

FreedomFromAll said:
Well it has a name: Its called cold war.
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I think they will give it a new name, perhaps cyber war.
 
Re: Don’t Fear the "Russian" Military, the country is in no position to wage a real conflict.

late said:
I think they will give it a new name, perhaps cyber war.
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No they will not, since cyber warfare is already a thing. Cyber warfare is just a part of the overall picture which is cold war. It coincides with other obvious cold war activities like flying bombers close to our airspace's or boasting about nuclear capabilities. In the past cyber warfare tactics didnt get included since it wasnt a thing yet. But there were similar activities going on. Back then though it required a much more hands on approach, that the digital world makes it much easier now.

But the media has already tried to rename cold war 2.0: cyber war; but I think that it is just sensationalism and fails to cover the entire scope of current conditions with Russia and US relations. The progress of technology hasn't changed anything in respect of how you categorize conflicts.
 
Re: Don’t Fear the "Russian" Military, the country is in no position to wage a real conflict.

Actually, it's called hybrid-warfare of which cyber is but one facet.
 
Re: Don’t Fear the "Russian" Military, the country is in no position to wage a real conflict.

FreedomFromAll said:
No they will not, since cyber warfare is already a thing. Cyber warfare is just a part of the overall picture which is cold war. It coincides with other obvious cold war activities like flying bombers close to our airspace's or boasting about nuclear capabilities. In the past cyber warfare tactics didnt get included since it wasnt a thing yet. But there were similar activities going on. Back then though it required a much more hands on approach, that the digital world makes it much easier now.

But the media has already tried to rename cold war 2.0: cyber war; but I think that it is just sensationalism and fails to cover the entire scope of current conditions with Russia and US relations. The progress of technology hasn't changed anything in respect of how you categorize conflicts.
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Asymmetric warfare, which supports one of your positions, but not the other.
 
Re: Don’t Fear the "Russian" Military, the country is in no position to wage a real conflict.

FreedomFromAll said:
I did and was wanted you to say it instead of me jumping to conclusions for you.
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I think Cold War will be used to describe the past-WW2 struggle, that ended with the fall of the USSR. We may stick with cyber war, but the weaponisation of social media is new. It's an interesting, if not important, question as to what we will wind up calling it. Maybe Info War?

Doesn't matter. One thing's for sure, we need to do a lot better job of dealing with it.
 
Re: Don’t Fear the "Russian" Military, the country is in no position to wage a real conflict.

late said:
I think Cold War will be used to describe the past-WW2 struggle, that ended with the fall of the USSR. We may stick with cyber war, but the weaponisation of social media is new. It's an interesting, if not important, question as to what we will wind up calling it. Maybe Info War?

Doesn't matter. One thing's for sure, we need to do a lot better job of dealing with it.
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Cyber warfare/info if you like, are just parts of the overall picture. Think of organized crime syndicates using cyber means to steal money, its a new'ish technique but that does not rename what it is. Or terrorist group using cyber warfare, that doesnt change them from being who they were to start out with. Cyber warfare is just a another tool that is being used.

Historically the term Cold War was used for the biggest example: USSR and USA state of aggression that were not categorized as all out war. That does not mean that the term cold war is pigeon hold into just describing that one example. Two countries that are not the USA or the Soviet Union could have a cold war of their own. No need to invent new terms for no real reason other than ignorance.

I agree that not nearly enough is being done.
 
Re: Don’t Fear the "Russian" Military, the country is in no position to wage a real conflict.

FreedomFromAll said:
Cyber warfare/info if you like, are just parts of the overall picture. Think of organized crime syndicates using cyber means to steal money, its a new'ish technique but that does not rename what it is. Or terrorist group using cyber warfare, that doesnt change them from being who they were to start out with. Cyber warfare is just a another tool that is being used.

Historically the term Cold War was used for the biggest example: USSR and USA state of aggression that were not categorized as all out war. That does not mean that the term cold war is pigeon hold into just describing that one example. Two countries that are not the USA or the Soviet Union could have a cold war of their own. No need to invent new terms for no real reason other than ignorance.

I agree that not nearly enough is being done.
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I like your answer on a cold war, a cold war is a war with no direct fighting, but with nonstop conflict with things like arms races, proxy wars, political interferance etc, while a hot war is a direct conflict. Cold wars have happened numerous times throughout history, with the soviet union vs the united states being the largest example in history.

A current example of a cold war today is saudi arabia and iran, neither have fought eachother, but both have made alliances, supported and armed proxy wars and have been in a race for power and influence over the region.
 
Re: Don’t Fear the "Russian" Military, the country is in no position to wage a real conflict.

We've seen some extreme and foolish arrogance in this thread.

But that's okay. You under-estimate your enemy. In Russian military school we learn never to do that because it's fatal.

Russia is not a threat to anyone, unless it is attacked. In which case whoever attacks us will die, including the US. But hey, believe in your own invincibility if you wish.
 
Re: Don’t Fear the "Russian" Military, the country is in no position to wage a real conflict.

Westphalian said:
We've seen some extreme and foolish arrogance in this thread.

But that's okay. You under-estimate your enemy. In Russian military school we learn never to do that because it's fatal.

Russia is not a threat to anyone, unless it is attacked. In which case whoever attacks us will die, including the US. But hey, believe in your own invincibility if you wish.
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Did Ukraine attack Russia? I must have missed it.
 
Re: Don’t Fear the "Russian" Military, the country is in no position to wage a real conflict.

Fledermaus said:
How about Permafrost war?
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Fledermaus is getting close to the correct answer. Remove the word "frost" and substitute 'forever, in place of "perma" and you're there.

Forever-war.

Militarism and militarists have somehow successfully convinced too many of us that any act by a foreign person, organisation or state which inconveniences our elites like offering effective economic competition or attempting to influence world opinion or not harmonising their property laws with ours or even offering economic development opportunities in less developed parts of the world which we declare to be off-limits to them can be interpreted as a hostile act and thus can be considered an act of near-war or an actual act of war. We as civilian-citizens swallow this polarising crap and then allow our sons and daughters to lose their lives, their health, thier minds and their souls while fighting covertly or overtly in the service of this forever-war.

But who does this constant state of war benefit? Very likely not you, and certainly not me. It paupers tax coffers by spending more of our ever increasing tax burden on the pursuit of destruction and misery rather than the pursuit of happiness. It balloons national debt, mortgaging our children's' and grandchildrens' futures for more bang today. It starves domestic spending on necessary and socially positive projects. It polarises and poisons international relations thus fostering more conflict. It allows the expansion of a domestic security and surveillance state which in turn progressively extinguishes our personal liberties, freedoms and rights at home. It also poisons our minds and warps our understanding of reality, with both foreign and domestic propaganda, as our brains become just another battlefield on which the forever-war is being waged ad infinitum. Our skulls and their content are the new high-ground in the battle to keep us loyal to the cost, destruction, misery and ruin which our tax dollars are being spent on.

Transnational militarism is a self-reinforcing feed-back loop and it is the real enemy today, both foreign and domestic. It can be successfully fought by not buying into militarists' Manechean world-view of only us vs. them, unnuanced good vs. bad and the progressive proliferation of militarising the interpretation of all acts by foreign persons, organisations and states as hostile. Don't believe them, argue against them, discredit their arguments and show them up for the shills they are. Starve their backers of the tax dollars and corporate profits which allow them to wage war without our permission inside our own heads.

To borrow a term from a past popular science-fiction show, forever-war is "fracked" and so are we if we go along with the enabling thinking that permits it to continue 24/7/365 every year. Free your minds, reject the militarist party-line and non-violently struggle for peace by organising and voting to deny militarists the monies and political mandates which they need to keep the very profitable fighting, destruction and reconstruction going. Culture-jam their poisonous and divisive rhetoric and do not now before their authority. They work for you, not the other way around.

Cheers.
Evilroddy.
 
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Re: Don’t Fear the "Russian" Military, the country is in no position to wage a real conflict.

Errr. The second to last sentence should read,"Culture-jam their poisonous and divisive rhetoric and do not bow before their authority." I can't type to save my life.

Cheers.
Evilroddy.
 
Re: Don’t Fear the "Russian" Military, the country is in no position to wage a real conflict.

Evilroddy said:
Errr. The second to last sentence should read,"Culture-jam their poisonous and divisive rhetoric and do not bow before their authority." I can't type to save my life.

Cheers.
Evilroddy.
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What is worse is that at first glance I read it as "Culture Club"...
 
Re: Don’t Fear the "Russian" Military, the country is in no position to wage a real conflict.

RetiredUSN said:
How did Vietnam work out?
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The US won that war. In 1973 North Vietnam was forced to the peace table, their military and economic powers crippled or destroyed. As part of the peace treaty, the US withdrew and they promised to never again attack South Vietnam.

Then 2 years later, they broke that agreement and attacked again.

There are 2 lessons learned form this.

1. Simple fact, the US did not loose the war. It won, it shoved a peace treaty down the throat of North Vietnam. With the very real threat that they would continue to bomb them into the stone age unless they agreed to stop attacking. It also did not hurt that their attempt to sway the negotiations in their favor (the Easter Offensive) was a complete disaster. They lost almost all of their armor and air capability in the offensive, and the US response (Operation Linebacker) destroyed much of their infrastructure, airports and bases, prevented the use of their ports because of mines, and largely reduced their capabilities to that of the 19th century.

2. Never trust Communists. They will readily say one thing, like agree to a peace treaty, or abandon a nuclear weapon and missile program. Then turn right around and do it anyways, as soon as they felt free to tear up the agreement made in the first place.

I know revisionists try to claim that the US lost the Vietnam War, but this is a fantasy they keep wanting everybody to believe. The US withdrew in 1973, the Second Vietnam War was in 1975. 2 years later.

Imagine a guy and his brother get into a fight, and their uncle breaks them up. Then later in the day they get into another fight, but blaming the uncle for not stopping it even though he was not there anymore. Myself, I think the biggest mistake in that entire war was not jumping back in with both feet the moment North Vietnam violated the peace treaty.
 
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