What Would Denuclearization Look Like in North Korea?

Fearandloathing said:

We don't stop to consider that majority may just support their government

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They don't have any other frame of reference, so of course they support their government.

Casper said:

Wrong.

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nope im right
just look at all the countries the United States has invaded and how they dealt without nukes

Fledermaus said:

According to whom?

And why didn't this happen before NK had nukes?

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Ummm according to the history of the USA's aggression and invasions. Do you think libya would have been invaded as easy if they had nukes?
Most likely the new leader (Kim jun un) enacted a policy that the USA didnt like and now they are mad at NK

ALTOY459 said:

nope im right
just look at all the countries the United States has invaded and how they dealt without nukes

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What are you talking about, the only country we ever invaded that supposedly had to do with WMD was Iraq and that was only part of the reasoning and the main issue was chemical WDMs. NK on the other hand already have nukes and there is no doubt they would use them. Oh and if we invade they have major power right there that says if we attack first they would intervene. No, we are not going​ to invade NK, it would result in Millions of deaths and no one is pushing for it and the South would not support it. Not Gonna Happen.

ALTOY459 said:

Ummm according to the history of the USA's aggression and invasions. Do you think libya would have been invaded as easy if they had nukes?
Most likely the new leader (Kim jun un) enacted a policy that the USA didnt like and now they are mad at NK

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I get the feeling that you really do not know you history or the Korean history or situation. Do some reading then get back to us.

Casper said:

What are you talking about, the only country we ever invaded that supposedly had to do with WMD was Iraq and that was only part of the reasoning and the main issue was chemical WDMs. NK on the other hand already have nukes and there is no doubt they would use them. Oh and if we invade they have major power right there that says if we attack first they would intervene. No, we are not going​ to invade NK, it would result in Millions of deaths and no one is pushing for it and the South would not support it. Not Gonna Happen.

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I didnt say that these regimes had nukes i was saying they DIDNT have nukes but if they had them they probably wouldnt have gotten invaded so quickly. The United States would Definitely invade first if the North wasn't doing what we asked. I wonder why you think the United States or any other empire like this doesn't have a problem with killing millions when it has done so in the past. The North is simply responding to the threats of the West and their allies.

ALTOY459 said:

Ummm according to the history of the USA's aggression and invasions. Do you think libya would have been invaded as easy if they had nukes?
Most likely the new leader (Kim jun un) enacted a policy that the USA didnt like and now they are mad at NK

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So, according to no one...

And who "invaded" Libya?

Why was NK not invaded prior to their recent nuke capability? North Korea is doing what North Korea has done for over 50 years....

You might want to educate yourself about that region.

Hawkeye10 said:

I know how shocking it would be to go to a summit without a deal mostly done before hand, but Trump is willing to give it a go.

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Well, remember one of the most historic summits in history.

At the 1986 Iceland Summit, President Reagan by proposing to eliminate all Intermediate Range Nuclear Weapons, as well as eliminating all ballistic missiles within 10 years. This shocked and stunned the Soviet delegation, and the proposal was scraped by them.

In the last several decades, far to many people have come to expect that summits always result in agreements and treaties. And while many of them ultimately do (the 1986 Summit resulted in the INF treaty 2 years later). But most of the time when it comes to North Korea, nothing results.

In 2000 we had the first Summit between North and South Korea since the war. NK was actually paid $500 million to attend, and ultimately nothing happened, even though both pledged at the time to end the war.

Then it was repeated in 2007. This is pretty much just a repeat of the 2000 Summit, and nothing changed.

We then saw this repeated yet again in April 2018. Where once again, promises the war was over, nothing else changed.

So do I expect much from this one? No, not really.

But it is really impossible to go into this with a deal in hand for many reasons. For one, NK has a history of not making deals without a huge payout first. Then secondly, they also have this history of breaking pretty much every deal they have made in the past with the US.

And I do not give much faith in either a freeze to their nuclear or missile programs. Way back in 1994 North Korea and the US signed the "Agreed Framework". In exchange for money, fuel, and 2 nuclear plants. However, the US kept up their end of the bargain. Sending half a million tons of fuel oil to North Korea every year was happening, as per the agreement. But NK only shuttered their uranium enrichment sites. And by 1998 they were again enriching uranium at the plants.

By 2002 they pretty much admitted that they had been ignoring the 1994 treaty for years, and would continue to do so, as was their right as a "sovereign nation".

Myself, I no longer have any trust or faith in any treaties with North Korea. They seem to feel absolutely no need to agree to anything, and even if they do only for so long as it is convenient for them.

ALTOY459 said:

I didnt say that these regimes had nukes i was saying they DIDNT have nukes but if they had them they probably wouldnt have gotten invaded so quickly. The United States would Definitely invade first if the North wasn't doing what we asked. I wonder why you think the United States or any other empire like this doesn't have a problem with killing millions when it has done so in the past. The North is simply responding to the threats of the West and their allies.

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I don't think the US would/will invade anytime soon. I think they would much rather use the south as proxies and provide air/sea support with maybe a limited rapid response smaller force

For the rest of your post I fully agree

Empires don't mind the mass deaths of people so long as they see a sustenance/furtherance of their interests

Much talk about those wishing to acquire develop nuclear weapons but who can really blame them ?

The rogue states of the " civilised world " ( sic ) are forcing any that wish to steer an independent course for their nation/people into a position where possession of such weapons is the only meaningful deterrent

ALTOY459 said:

The United States would Definitely invade first if the North wasn't doing what we asked.

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Uh-huh.

And then why was that not done in 2002 after they admitted that they had started up their nuclear program before the ink was barely dry on the 1994 agreement, and that they had been getting millions of tons of fuel from the US even though they had long broken the agreement?

Rogue Valley said:

What Would Denuclearization Look Like in North Korea?

The US and NK have vastly different understandings of the term denuclearization and the time-frame for full compliance.

Another related challenge is implementing a freeze on NK missile/rocket research and tests.

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Nonexistent

anyone in the conversation that believes NoKo is gonna give up their nukes has been drinking TrumpAide ...........

cuban smokes said:

anyone in the conversation that believes NoKo is gonna give up their nukes has been drinking TrumpAide ...........

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Oh, I actually have little doubt they might give up their nukes.

Which is not the same thing as saying they will not build new ones in the future. They once turned over all nuclear material and shuttered all their nuclear material production facilities as well, and we saw what happened after that.

If there is one thing I have learned over the decades, is that North Korea has absolutely no problem making an agreement. Their problem is in keeping agreements afterwards.

ALTOY459 said:

I didnt say that these regimes had nukes i was saying they DIDNT have nukes but if they had them they probably wouldnt have gotten invaded so quickly. The United States would Definitely invade first if the North wasn't doing what we asked. I wonder why you think the United States or any other empire like this doesn't have a problem with killing millions when it has done so in the past. The North is simply responding to the threats of the West and their allies.

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There will be no invasion, deal or no deal. China already put an end to that idea.