Will iran ever finish their stealth jet

Iran has for a while been developing a stealth jet, this could be a game changer in the region especially if they export it. However many have called it a hoax, israel has admitted it is a very flyable design and very stealthy design, however there to date has been no flight tests other than scaled down models with rc sized prop and jet engines. Given their design and how small the engine area openings are I doubt they designed a flyable plane and modified it for stealth, but rather designed a highly stealthy and flyable design but lack any engine to fill that design.

So far they have done taxi tests running the jet under it's own power but have not flown it. This jet could be a game changer if it is ever built tested and exported however my guess is that they have serious issues making engines small enough with enough power to run the aircraft.

beerftw said:

Iran has for a while been developing a stealth jet, this could be a game changer in the region especially if they export it. However many have called it a hoax, israel has admitted it is a very flyable design and very stealthy design, however there to date has been no flight tests other than scaled down models with rc sized prop and jet engines. Given their design and how small the engine area openings are I doubt they designed a flyable plane and modified it for stealth, but rather designed a highly stealthy and flyable design but lack any engine to fill that design.

So far they have done taxi tests running the jet under it's own power but have not flown it. This jet could be a game changer if it is ever built tested and exported however my guess is that they have serious issues making engines small enough with enough power to run the aircraft.

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This is a joke, right? Iran and tech are far from synonymous. Building top flight equipment is even a bigger fantasy. I'm willing to bet, that think and their best pilot loses against any of our pilots in a P-51 Mustang.

lefty louie said:

This is a joke, right? Iran and tech are far from synonymous. Building top flight equipment is even a bigger fantasy. I'm willing to bet, that think and their best pilot loses against any of our pilots in a P-51 Mustang.

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It actually looks like they made a flyable and high stealth jet but at the same time screwed up horribly, The size of engine that would typically fit in that space is not enough for it to even be a subsonic jet, they are likely scrambling to save the design since they seem to have designed the jet first and decided on how to put a jet engine in afterwards. That and even being as light and as small as it is, I doubt the range of it will be very great.

That thing will make a nice pile of rubble art in the desert. Likely due to its own failure to perform basic flight/maneuvers.

will the US ever stop ****ing with Iran??????????? ................ prolly not .............

It is a complete joke.

Remember, Iran really has no aircraft industry. Literally all they have is a factory that assembles Russian AN-140 turboprops. They did not design them, they do not make them. They onloy assemble the parts that they are sent.

And the Qaher-313? A complete and utter joke.

It has never been seen flying, the cockpit in the ground taxi tests seems to be of standard Plexiglas. And the images released of the cockpit?



Now take a look at that thing. The controls are literally off the shelf controls made for small commercial aircraft, like the Cessna.

A leather boot around the joystick, like you would find around a car gear shift?

For goodness sakes, there are off the shelf mounting bolts used to latch the cockpit closed.

And finally, look at the opposite side. That is clearly the backside of a simple single thin fiberglass panel that makes up the side of the airplane.

No, this thing is a complete joke, and nobody is taking it seriously at all. It is not real, and will never be real.

beerftw said:

It actually looks like they made a flyable and high stealth jet but at the same time screwed up horribly, The size of engine that would typically fit in that space is not enough for it to even be a subsonic jet, they are likely scrambling to save the design since they seem to have designed the jet first and decided on how to put a jet engine in afterwards. That and even being as light and as small as it is, I doubt the range of it will be very great.

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I think you fell for some rather absurd propaganda from a country that has along history of making extremely silly claims about their military designs. You should probably be a bit more skeptical of the nonsense that comes from Iran.

Oozlefinch said:

It is a complete joke.

Remember, Iran really has no aircraft industry. Literally all they have is a factory that assembles Russian AN-140 turboprops. They did not design them, they do not make them. They onloy assemble the parts that they are sent.

And the Qaher-313? A complete and utter joke.

It has never been seen flying, the cockpit in the ground taxi tests seems to be of standard Plexiglas. And the images released of the cockpit?

Now take a look at that thing. The controls are literally off the shelf controls made for small commercial aircraft, like the Cessna.

A leather boot around the joystick, like you would find around a car gear shift?

For goodness sakes, there are off the shelf mounting bolts used to latch the cockpit closed.

And finally, look at the opposite side. That is clearly the backside of a simple single thin fiberglass panel that makes up the side of the airplane.

No, this thing is a complete joke, and nobody is taking it seriously at all. It is not real, and will never be real.

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That is not completely true that iran has no avionics industry, they have made drones for decades, and they currently build fighter jets inhouse, A more true statement would be iran's avionics industry outside of drones is made up of reverse engineered f-5 and f-4 american jets. After their f-5 and f-4 jets started becoming harder to service, and their f14's nearly impossible they started reverse engineering and cloning f-5's to eliminate foreign supply chain, and the f-14's are still mostly serviceable for them despite being the only country left that still uses them, and likely they either reverse engineered and copied parts, or engineered a way to replace failing parts with russian or chinese parts, I would really not be surprised if we shot down one of their f-14's and found them to be half mig parts crammed in any way they could to keep them running.


Another thing to think about is those pictures are the first release, which was nothing more than a model, them flying it was a hoax they admitted to because what they flew in 2013 was a scaled down rc model in order to test it's flyability. The current pictures show a more realistic cockpit, irst, and twin engines instead of single engines, which the engines were admitted to being general electric engines or atleast copies of, which meant they could not design a new engine in house atleast in that time frame. Plus the scale size has shown it can move under it's own power, if we invaded iran we would have to watch out for f-313's intercepting our humvees on convoys cuz hey we know for sure they can move on ground:lamo

Truthfully I think it is more than a hoax for them and more of an experiment, if they could get it flying the knowledge would be a gamechanger for the region since it would allow they to understand and combat stealth fighters, and the bigger issue is iran is only copying and upgrading antique american jets, this keeps them in service but even with upgrades over vietnam era function, they are still outdated, and irans supply line to the outside world right now is limited, they need to be able to build their own jets at this point, even if it fails to come close to what they promised, it would be their first design almost from the ground up(save the engines) and would give them experience for future jets, which might be good since the f-14 and the mig 19 are their most advanced jets, and both are cold war relics.

Will iran ever finish their stealth jet

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The rumor is that Iran cannot get any more plastic/styrene adhesive under the previous sanctions.......They have requested technical assistance from Revell , Tamiya, and Testors Manufacturing

Polar Bum said:

The rumor is that Iran cannot get any more plastic/styrene adhesive under the previous sanctions.......They have requested technical assistance from Revell , Tamiya, and Testors Manufacturing

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Oh please iran can get all of that they produce enough oil for petroleum byproducts, should rephrase it as american manufacturors will not sell iran the equipment to reverse engineer and copy to produce plastic/styrene for the jets!

beerftw said:

Oh please iran can get all of that they produce enough oil for petroleum byproducts, should rephrase it as american manufacturors will not sell iran the equipment to reverse engineer and copy to produce plastic/styrene for the jets!

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Maybe the Iranians should talk to Japan about outsourcing construction.....

https://hlj.com/product/FXNA041

Polar Bum said:

Maybe the Iranians should talk to Japan about outsourcing construction.....

https://hlj.com/product/FXNA041

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Japanese prastic, me no rikey!!!!!

Reminds me of their drone attempt. Looks like shopping cart wheels and what is that hanging from the bottom? A large Crock Pot?

beerftw said:

It actually looks like they made a flyable and high stealth jet but at the same time screwed up horribly, The size of engine that would typically fit in that space is not enough for it to even be a subsonic jet, they are likely scrambling to save the design since they seem to have designed the jet first and decided on how to put a jet engine in afterwards. That and even being as light and as small as it is, I doubt the range of it will be very great.

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So they forgot to put an engine in it? It's a stealth engine. :lol:

Rogue Valley said:

Reminds me of their drone attempt. Looks like shopping cart wheels and what is that hanging from the bottom? A large Crock Pot?

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Got the idea from the Boston Bomber.

American said:

So they forgot to put an engine in it? It's a stealth engine. :lol:

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No engine equals no heat signature= instant stealth. Plus with all the off the shelf cessna parts our aircraft with confuse them for cropdusters driving down the highway.

Rogue Valley said:

Reminds me of their drone attempt. Looks like shopping cart wheels and what is that hanging from the bottom? A large Crock Pot?

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Their drones though are one of the things they design well in house, they have used drones extensively since the iran iraq war of the 80's, since they lacked proper spy planes, and the one within their grasp was the mig-25, which their main spy target then iraq had, meaning any spy jets they could buy would be intercepted by iraqui migs, but good luck finding and shooting down a tiny rc controlled drone, or the most difficult to stop spy planes, pidgins with cameras attached to them.

beerftw said:

That is not completely true that iran has no avionics industry, they have made drones for decades, and they currently build fighter jets inhouse,

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There is a huge difference between a drone and an aircraft. Heck, I can buy a drone for under $100 from the local department store.

And no, they do not build fighter jets. The extent of their aviation industry for the last 40 years has been assembling pre-built Russian aircraft. Specifically the An-140 as the Iran 140.

And they are in talks now to do the same thing with several other Tupolev aircraft, such as the Tu-204 and Tu-214. But once again, they will not be manufacturing them. Simply assembling them from parts supplied from Russia.

The closest it has to it's own "Fighter Aircraft" is the HESA Saeqeh. However, this is not really an aircraft they build themselves. They simply updated their existing F-5 Tiger II fighters with more modern avionics and giving it a new name. These are essentially just complete overhauls of an existing fighter, not a new fighter. And the Iranian inventory of F-5 fighters has decreased at the same rate that their inventory of the Saegeh has increased.

Rebuilding a 60 year old fighter and giving it a new name is not the same as building a fighter themselves.

Oozlefinch said:

There is a huge difference between a drone and an aircraft. Heck, I can buy a drone for under $100 from the local department store.

And no, they do not build fighter jets. The extent of their aviation industry for the last 40 years has been assembling pre-built Russian aircraft. Specifically the An-140 as the Iran 140.

And they are in talks now to do the same thing with several other Tupolev aircraft, such as the Tu-204 and Tu-214. But once again, they will not be manufacturing them. Simply assembling them from parts supplied from Russia.

The closest it has to it's own "Fighter Aircraft" is the HESA Saeqeh. However, this is not really an aircraft they build themselves. They simply updated their existing F-5 Tiger II fighters with more modern avionics and giving it a new name. These are essentially just complete overhauls of an existing fighter, not a new fighter. And the Iranian inventory of F-5 fighters has decreased at the same rate that their inventory of the Saegeh has increased.

Rebuilding a 60 year old fighter and giving it a new name is not the same as building a fighter themselves.

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I read the saqheh was converted f-5 aircraft, however I could not find mention for their other aircraft being converted and just listed home produced, and given their identical nature to f-4 and f-5 jets it is obvious they were reverse engineered. This is nothing new, their current in house built engine looks and functions the same as a j85 general electric turbo jet engine, and nearly everyone who has seen it believes all they did is reverse engineer the general electric engine they had access to, and reproduce it with some upgrades.

his is not the same as saying they have no avionics industry, theirs is fairly new, however the soviet union built jets that were superior to american jets post ww2- korea, and none of their jets were homebrew design, they took nazi germany's jet fighter and russianized it. However that copy kickstarted their adventure into jet powered aircraft, and today russia is one of the best in the world in jet engine production, so I would not scoff anyways at some country copying an older design, as it could be the start to much more advanced ones.

beerftw said:

I read the saqheh was converted f-5 aircraft, however I could not find mention for their other aircraft being converted and just listed home produced, and given their identical nature to f-4 and f-5 jets it is obvious they were reverse engineered.

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It is not even reverse-engineered, to all appearances these are simply rebuilt F-5s. Several F-5s that had been in boneyards in Iran disappeared a few years before these were unveiled, and the number of aircraft almost matches the number of hulks that vanished.

And even more interesting is the Saeqeh-2. A 2 seat variant that Iran claims to have made. Interestingly, they claim to have 13 of these, and will have 18 when the program is complete. Almost the number (24) of F-5B trainer variants that Iran possesses.

And if a country was really going to make it's own fighter aircraft, why would it replicate the cockpit of a 60 year old fighter, with a 60 year old engine? The only aircraft the US military still uses with the J-85 engine is the T-38 Talon jet trainer.

So the question is, if this really was a home "built" aircraft, why the antiquated cockpit, engine, and airframe design? Surely they could have modernized all 3 of those if it really was designed and built from the ground up as they are claiming. In fact, their earliest claims was that the Saequh was going to be powered by the Russian RD-33 engine (the same one used in the MiG-29, MiG-35, and JF-17 fighters. But when it was shown to the public that was proven to be untrue, because none of the dimensions of the RD-33 could fit in that body. And the claims of home-made J-85 engines makes sense, because that of course is the engine from the F-5.

As for converting other aircraft, that is a different subject. The largest segment of the IRIAF is the F-4, but most of those are configured and operated more as a bomber than as a tactical fighter. And the same is true with their J-7 aircraft (Chinese made MiG-21), they are used for air to ground operations. Their only other attack fighters are the Su-24 and MiG-29. Of all these aircraft, the F-5 is the oldest one, so it makes sense that the platform used for major upgrades would be that one.

If they truly wanted to make a new fighter from scratch, what would be most logical for them would be to create a copy of the F-14, Su-22, or Su-24. Iran always loved the VSW fighters, and the Tomcat was the best performing aircraft in the Iran-Iraq War. And they possess examples of all 3 of those aircraft. But none in the numbers like they do with the F-5.

Oozlefinch said:

It is not even reverse-engineered, to all appearances these are simply rebuilt F-5s. Several F-5s that had been in boneyards in Iran disappeared a few years before these were unveiled, and the number of aircraft almost matches the number of hulks that vanished.

And even more interesting is the Saeqeh-2. A 2 seat variant that Iran claims to have made. Interestingly, they claim to have 13 of these, and will have 18 when the program is complete. Almost the number (24) of F-5B trainer variants that Iran possesses.

And if a country was really going to make it's own fighter aircraft, why would it replicate the cockpit of a 60 year old fighter, with a 60 year old engine? The only aircraft the US military still uses with the J-85 engine is the T-38 Talon jet trainer.

So the question is, if this really was a home "built" aircraft, why the antiquated cockpit, engine, and airframe design? Surely they could have modernized all 3 of those if it really was designed and built from the ground up as they are claiming. In fact, their earliest claims was that the Saequh was going to be powered by the Russian RD-33 engine (the same one used in the MiG-29, MiG-35, and JF-17 fighters. But when it was shown to the public that was proven to be untrue, because none of the dimensions of the RD-33 could fit in that body. And the claims of home-made J-85 engines makes sense, because that of course is the engine from the F-5.

As for converting other aircraft, that is a different subject. The largest segment of the IRIAF is the F-4, but most of those are configured and operated more as a bomber than as a tactical fighter. And the same is true with their J-7 aircraft (Chinese made MiG-21), they are used for air to ground operations. Their only other attack fighters are the Su-24 and MiG-29. Of all these aircraft, the F-5 is the oldest one, so it makes sense that the platform used for major upgrades would be that one.

If they truly wanted to make a new fighter from scratch, what would be most logical for them would be to create a copy of the F-14, Su-22, or Su-24. Iran always loved the VSW fighters, and the Tomcat was the best performing aircraft in the Iran-Iraq War. And they possess examples of all 3 of those aircraft. But none in the numbers like they do with the F-5.

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Why would the try and make repro's of antique aircraft? My guess is that they are likely more simple to copy, and the f-5 and f-5 are also simpler to make parts for when supply runs out. Also the f-14 is a nightmare to keep in the air, which is why iran is the only country left operating them. Odds are the complexity of copying combined with high repair costs and limited funds probably pushes them to the f-5 category, like I said earlier they have kept them running without any foreign assistance on original parts, but that raises the question if their current f-14's are are stuffed with mig and sukhoi parts.


The tomcat was the best performing during the war, however in close range dogfights their current mig-29's would perform better, with the downside of very short range, which may be why iran is not pushing for more mig-29's. They have dassault jets as well, and france seems to sell to everyone, I am surprised too they have not tried to reverse engineer french jets. But on the su-22 and 24, both of those are bombers not fighters, they would be better off with su-27 platform, but those are good enough russia has kept them going as their main jet, but they are pricey.

What I am relly surprised is that iran has not tried to aquire mig-17 jets copy and mass produce them, heck they are old enough russia might sell them the plans and the rights to built them, them upgrade them. Seriously they would be cheap to build and keep, and given how small their airforce is they might do better with numbers than with having a tiny number of jets.

beerftw said:

What I am relly surprised is that iran has not tried to aquire mig-17 jets copy and mass produce them, heck they are old enough russia might sell them the plans and the rights to built them, them upgrade them. Seriously they would be cheap to build and keep, and given how small their airforce is they might do better with numbers than with having a tiny number of jets.

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Well, they are not trying to copy and produce small commercial aircraft. They lack the infrastructure to do so, that is why they are buying premade aircraft in the crate and simply assembling them.

And really, the MiG-17? An aircraft almost 70 years old, which even the upgraded version that China made was retired over 25 years ago? Even Sudan stopped using this crate, and everybody has either retired them, converted them into training aircraft, or turned them into suicide drones.

Well, other than North Korea. They still have them on the books, but only a couple are believed to still be in airworthy condition.

And their Air Force is not exactly small. 166 fighters, and another 29 trainers that could be converted back into fighters. That is over twice the number of combat aircraft that Iraq has. And their military doctrine is not configured for a large air force. It is based upon having multiple composite units, composed of fighters, bombers, recon and other aircraft all combined into a kind of "combined arms" unit, that can be moved in a day from one air field to another. They are purposefully small units that are quick to move from location to location.

In short, they no longer even have the infrastructure needed to support a large air force. Especially one made up of long obsolete aircraft.

Oozlefinch said:

Well, they are not trying to copy and produce small commercial aircraft. They lack the infrastructure to do so, that is why they are buying premade aircraft in the crate and simply assembling them.

And really, the MiG-17? An aircraft almost 70 years old, which even the upgraded version that China made was retired over 25 years ago? Even Sudan stopped using this crate, and everybody has either retired them, converted them into training aircraft, or turned them into suicide drones.

Well, other than North Korea. They still have them on the books, but only a couple are believed to still be in airworthy condition.

And their Air Force is not exactly small. 166 fighters, and another 29 trainers that could be converted back into fighters. That is over twice the number of combat aircraft that Iraq has. And their military doctrine is not configured for a large air force. It is based upon having multiple composite units, composed of fighters, bombers, recon and other aircraft all combined into a kind of "combined arms" unit, that can be moved in a day from one air field to another. They are purposefully small units that are quick to move from location to location.

In short, they no longer even have the infrastructure needed to support a large air force. Especially one made up of long obsolete aircraft.

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You can mock the mig 17 but it at one point(and I think still is) the most produced fighter jet in the world. It is horribly outdated, but it flies very well and is cheap to produce and maintain. With some modern engineering they could make them viable in numbers, mig 19 and 21's as well. I would not go back as far as the 15 though, they were superior to the saber yet got a worse kill ratio, partly due to russia using newbs to aid korea for training while america used ww2 aces, the other part the dive, a mig 15 could not dive and many wins were just tricking them into following a sabre into a dive.

Compared to the us or israeli air forces, yes they are small, you must compare them to the force they will likely encounter. Oh an iraq is still a shell of it's former self so not a very good comparison, Iraq had one of the most powerful armies in the region and the 5th largest air force in the world during the gulf war. Due to their war with iran many pilots were vastly more experienced there than american pilots who fought them during the gulf war, this combined with the recent knowledge of the mig 29 from east germany led americans to not underestimate the iraqui airforce but overestimate it, we actually had to use a very sizeable force in the air to maintain the superiority we did, not something we do with every country.

In the end the us air superiority campaign going balls to the wall proved effective, we fought an enemy with an active and highly experienced airforce and used numbers and doctrine to defeat them almost unscathed. After the first gulf war their air force went into disrepair, The iraqui airforce during the second gulf war was pretty much non existent even though many of their aircraft were intact, and their current airforce is far better than during the second gulf war, but not close to first gulf war levels.


They have the infrastructure to support those aircraft, but they need to build them inhouse, not buying kits and parts. Those obsolete aircraft are becoming a burden to them, those f-14's are a nightmare to keep going especially when you are the only country using them and no one will sell you parts, the f-4 and f-5s are pretty dry on the parts market, some countries still use them besides iran but their use is extremely limited, so they are stuck engineering parts to keep those going s well. In my opinion iran would be wise either investing in modern fighters or going with bulk like mass producing older russian fighters with upgrades, since other roles are not as needed with iran as much, they do not invade other countries, they do not need to supply an army thousands of miles away, they main need would be keeping air superiority in the airspace, preventing hostile forces from using it to begin with.


On iranian military doctrine you also forgot to bring up proxy warfare, they love using proxy militias to tie down other countries militaries and create barriers between them and iran.

beerftw said:

You can mock the mig 17 but it at one point(and I think still is) the most produced fighter jet in the world.

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And who exactly are they going to use it against?

The US? Saudi Arabia? Israel? Pakistan? Turkey?

Even the modern Iraqi Air Force uses the Su-25 and F-16, fighters that would have little problem defeating the MiG-17.

Yea, the MiG-17 might be a good platform, if their only possible enemy was Somalia (which has 4 C-27s and 5 helicopters) or Armenia (which has only 11 Su-25s). Even Yemen would have little problem going against Iran with the 17.

They would have to put together and operate an air force on a huge scale in order to make that fossil pay off. To where they would have a 5 or 7 to 1 advantage against any possible enemies. Maybe. Against more advanced enemies like Saudi Arabia, they had better go in with at least a 10 to 1 advantage.

Might as well say that Kyle Petty is going to return to NASCAR with the Super Roadrunner. Sure, an incredible car for it's time, but a fossil today.