New Evidence on how BAD the NAVY is NOW

The two US Navy destroyers involved in deadly collisions in the Pacific this summer both had lengthy records of failure to fulfill key training requirements, according to Government Accountability Office data provided to Congress and obtained by CNN.

The USS Fitzgerald had expired training certification for 10 out of 10 key warfare mission areas in June, and the USS John S. McCain had let its certifications lapse in six out of the 10 mission areas, the data show.
The dismal training record for the two ships sheds new light on one factor that may have contributed to the two collisions with commercial ships in June and August, which killed 17 sailors.

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Hawkeye10 said:

My argument that Obama and Congress left the military and in particular the Navy a wreck keeps getting stronger. We spend almost a $Trillion a year on defense, and this is what we get. We get humongous incompetence and lack of caring. And lack of honesty, this has built over years. Our "Leaders" say everything is fine. The "Experts" say nothing.

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notquiteright said:

And those who never served speak out their 4th point of contact... :doh

This has nothing to do with the civilian side of the 'leaders' apart from accepting what the 'professionals' tell them (which the never served rail should ALWAYS get to tell the civilian leadership what to do)

I'd opine this is far more about the brass heavy, cyoa military corporate style management the military has adopted.

Obama didn't tell the Navy to waiver more and more critical certifications.

Congress didn't tell the Admirals to allow more and more waivers.

No one told the Admirals to not rotate ships from forward leaning fleets to CONUS based ones so training could be conducted.

The 'Don't Make Waves' mantra within the senior Navy ranks did that.

Now the Trillions that get spent on 'defense' has a bring home the bacon boost for Congress critters- even simple munitions are farmed out to a dozen states so ending one weapon system can have a dozen Senators up in arms, so to speak...

But the never served 'ex-spurts' don't really care about facts- just like whipping their favorite dead horse... eace

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Rogue Valley said:

I know a young man in the Navy who serves aboard ship in the Pacific theater. He tells me that the operational pace is unrelenting. He gets maybe five hours of sleep a day on active duty. There's not enough time for proper training. And a lot of time that was dedicated to traditional training is now being used for social training. How to interact with females on board. Racial cohesiveness. Stuff like that. Less and less time is devoted to learning ... seamanship.

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Hawkeye10 said:

Both told them to do more with less, training time was taken away to go on missions because our leaders did not want to match missions with resources...they decided to let the Navy rot from over use instead. They both hatched and carried out the plan of decimating the military by their failure to correctly perform budgeting. You need to lose the tude if you want to talk to me.

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notquiteright said:

And those who never served speak out their 4th point of contact... :doh

This has nothing to do with the civilian side of the 'leaders' apart from accepting what the 'professionals' tell them (which the never served rail should ALWAYS get to tell the civilian leadership what to do)

I'd opine this is far more about the brass heavy, cyoa military corporate style management the military has adopted.

Obama didn't tell the Navy to waiver more and more critical certifications.

Congress didn't tell the Admirals to allow more and more waivers.

No one told the Admirals to not rotate ships from forward leaning fleets to CONUS based ones so training could be conducted.

The 'Don't Make Waves' mantra within the senior Navy ranks did that.

Now the Trillions that get spent on 'defense' has a bring home the bacon boost for Congress critters- even simple munitions are farmed out to a dozen states so ending one weapon system can have a dozen Senators up in arms, so to speak...

But the never served 'ex-spurts' don't really care about facts- just like whipping their favorite dead horse... eace

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notquiteright said:

More with less isn't treason. Failing to rotate ships so training can be conducted is on the Admirals. You have ZERO experience, and proof anyone wants the Navy to rot. You'd complain if the Civilian leadership ended many weapons programs the military wanted and pushed for more training. You just want to bitch about your favorite whipping boy.

You need to lose the 'tude, ignorance and talk of treason... eace

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Fishking said:

Depends on the op-tempo of what is being demanded of them by said civilian leadership. Are you fully informed on what has been required of them? There were all kinds of waivers given out in the Army from about 2003 until around 2013 due to deployment rotations.

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notquiteright said:

Seems Trump wants some op-tempo as well, but no blame for him from the never served folks... :roll:

The Navy wasn't decimated, the budget wasn't rigged to collapse training. Admirals made choices and forgot ships are as much human as highly advanced technological marvels. Apparently The President doesn't have to sign off on a waiver and that's all we need to know to shoot down an armchair ex-spurt claim Obama did it... :doh

Soooo what does the Army's readiness status during two shooting wars have to do with the Navy during peace time???? eace

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He said the Navy dispatched the USS Iwo Jima, USS New York and the aircraft carrier Abraham Lincoln to help with search and rescue and other relief efforts.

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Fishking said:

I gave you a first-hand example of what happens when things are demanded by the civilian leadership, having served for 16 years and counting, I've seen it myself. If you were truly as informed as you are acting, you'd know that to call current times as "peace time" is significantly naive. We are at some of the worst global security tensions we've had in a while and there is much being demanded of the Navy in to different theaters. Further, I know for a fact Obama hurt operations, significantly, with his own policies. One of the biggest was his artificial and forced draw-down of the force, which resulted in many people at around mid-career being booted the curb, with barely a thank you.

Trump seems to be keeping up the trend but you don't get to this status in just a few months and for the past 8 years, there was a different CiC at the helm. Keep up with the emojis, it's totally giving you credibility.

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notquiteright said:

Seems Trump wants some op-tempo as well, but no blame for him from the never served folks... :roll:

The Navy wasn't decimated, the budget wasn't rigged to collapse training. Admirals made choices and forgot ships are as much human as highly advanced technological marvels. Apparently The President doesn't have to sign off on a waiver and that's all we need to know to shoot down an armchair ex-spurt claim Obama did it... :doh

Soooo what does the Army's readiness status during two shooting wars have to do with the Navy during peace time???? eace

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GAO's analysis of Navy shipyard facilities data found that their overall physical condition remains poor,” reads the GAO report highlights.

“Navy data show that the cost of backlogged restoration and maintenance projects at the shipyards has grown by 41 percent over five years, to a Navy-estimated $4.86 billion, and will take at least 19 years (through fiscal year 2036) to clear. Similarly, a Navy analysis shows that the average age of shipyard capital equipment now exceeds its expected useful life.”

The poor condition of the shipyards has a direct operational impact on the fleet.

“Partly as a result of their poor condition, the shipyards have not been fully meeting the Navy's operational needs,” the report states.

“In fiscal years 2000 through 2016, inadequate facilities and equipment led to maintenance delays that contributed in part to more than 1,300 lost operational days—days when ships were unavailable for operations—for aircraft carriers and 12,500 lost operational days for submarines. The Navy estimates that it will be unable to conduct 73 of 218 maintenance periods over the next 23 fiscal years due to insufficient capacity and other deficiencies.”

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Hawkeye10 said:

Exclusive: US Navy ships in deadly collisions had dismal training records - CNNPolitics

My argument that Obama and Congress left the military and in particular the Navy a wreck keeps getting stronger.

We spend almost a $Trillion a year on defense, and this is what we get.

We get humongous incompetence and lack of caring.

And lack of honesty, this has built over years.

Our "Leaders" say everything is fine.

The "Experts" say nothing.

TREASONOUS

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Rogue Valley said:

I know a young man in the Navy who serves aboard ship in the Pacific theater. He tells me that the operational pace is unrelenting. He gets maybe five hours of sleep a day on active duty. There's not enough time for proper training. And a lot of time that was dedicated to traditional training is now being used for social training. How to interact with females on board. Racial cohesiveness. Stuff like that. Less and less time is devoted to learning ... seamanship.

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JANFU said:

I believe the IG, if that is the correct body, has stated for years the navy has been overwhelmed with missions, training cut, repairs shortened at home port, repairs completed at sea, that also cuts into training.
Congress has been aware of this for many years.

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Thoreau72 said:

Ain't it great, the War On Terror!!!

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