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Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go[W:74]

Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

We may never know but it would not surprise me that Skulkin heard about the VA meeting only moments before. Then Trump casually asks him if he is going? And then asks if he knew about the meeting. What could Skulkin say, "Yeah, the bastards told me about it an hour ago but, yeah, I know about your meeting. Why would you plan a meeting about the VA and not discuss it and an agenda and my schedule with me before hand, you moron? Or is it you forgot or that you never intended for me to go? And why would you continue with the meeting I can't attend and wasn't informed of under just a while ago? And where are the heads of the American Legion and the DAV, why aren't they going? But, yeah, since you are casually asking me in front of the press if I know about your goddam meeting, I'll say yes, but under the circumstances there's no way in hell I am going."

All of that sounds great, if he in fact was not invited to the meeting. But we only think we wasn't invited based on him saying he wasn't going. So, this is a self-fulfilling narrative. It's circular reasoning.

There is no evidence we wasn't invited to the Saturday non-meeting, that happened to take place after the Friday official meeting that he was at!
 
Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

All of that sounds great, if he in fact was not invited to the meeting. But we only think we wasn't invited based on him saying he wasn't going. So, this is a self-fulfilling narrative. It's circular reasoning.

There is no evidence we wasn't invited to the Saturday non-meeting, that happened to take place after the Friday official meeting that he was at!

One last time. We do not know the circumstances or the timing. You don't know that he was invited or when. We do know the non- meeting that was going to happen was cancelled, was never on Trump's schedule, but was later reported as having happened with Sec. Commerce and billionaire of Marvel, Perlmut, attending. Skulkin did not attend the "major meeting" that was not scheduled, but was then cancelled, but later is reported to have happened.

And yes both the Hill and the NYT reported it.

I've got at 16 lb beef brisket I'm getting ready to put in a smoker. I'm finished playing divert the thread with you.
 
Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

One last time. We do not know the circumstances or the timing.

Right. See how that makes "was not invited" nothing more than conjecture?

You don't know that he was invited or when.

Correct. And you don't know when the meeting was scheduled. Or if it was convenient for Shulkin or not. I'm glad we agree on this point.

But DailyKos made the claim that he was positively not invited to this meeting. DailyKos relied on a hard edit to make it sound like he was just hearing about the meeting for the first time right then. See the problem?

We do know the non- meeting that was going to happen was cancelled, was never on Trump's schedule, but was later reported as having happened with Sec. Commerce and billionaire of Marvel, Perlmut, attending. Skulkin did not attend the "major meeting" that was not scheduled, but was then cancelled, but later is reported to have happened.

We also know that there was an actual "major meeting" with all of the appropriate people that took place on Friday, in Washington, with Shulkin among them. But DailyKos is reporting on this secondary meeting as if it is the only one that counts - that it is all Trump is going to do for veterans - and Shulkin is not going to be there. And then DailyKos doubled down and claimed it was because Shulkin was not invited, with no evidence that that is the case! So now, instead of Trump having a listening session with the necessary officials, which actually happened, the story is now that he is whisking off to Florida to play golf with billionaires.

Do you see a problem with that?

And yes both the Hill and the NYT reported it.

Then they have since pulled it, because google is turning up nothing on this non-story beyond the hyperpartisan liberal blogosphere. You know, those sites that we all hope people have the good sense to stay away from if they care about objectivity or facts.
 
Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

Full stop.

I don't see the story carried in the New York Times and The Hill. I googled "New York Times Shulkin" and "New York Times Shulkin not invited" and the last mention of Shulkin was in February. Same with The Hill.



Like Palm Report. And Boing Boing.

...Military Times? Oh, wait, the Military Times reported about the meeting Friday with Trump, Pence, Shulkin, and "top officials from 10 veterans groups". Trump meets with veteran leaders, promises VA reforms

But you want to talk about the non-story of the non-meeting the next day that Shulkin wasn't not-invited to.

At least you are now making an argument far more reasonable than before - Shulkin knew about the meeting and that means he was invited. Kudos

However, this is not about Fridays meeting. This is about how, after Fridays meeting, Trump appeared before the press and touted a major meeting about VA issues - a meeting his VA Secy is not attending.
 
Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

At least you are now making an argument far more reasonable than before - Shulkin knew about the meeting and that means he was invited. Kudos

However, this is not about Fridays meeting. This is about how, after Fridays meeting, Trump appeared before the press and touted a major meeting about VA issues - a meeting his VA Secy is not attending.

Of course it's not about Friday's meeting. The media can't be seen showing Trump in the act of governing, which is what Friday's meeting was about.

So the hyperpartisan blogosphere pushes a non-story about a non-meeting that didn't take place the next day and OH MY GOD THE RIGHT PEOPLE WERE TOLD TO STAY HOME AND COLOR! ARRRRGGGG!

You know, I really, really dislike Trump. But every time a non-story like this pops up, it just makes me think I might have been wrong about him from the get-go. I mean, any of us only knows what we're told, right?
 
Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

Of course it's not about Friday's meeting. The media can't be seen showing Trump in the act of governing, which is what Friday's meeting was about.

Now you are regressing back to an inane argument. Saturdays meeting is just as much an act of governing as Fridays meeting.

So the hyperpartisan blogosphere pushes a non-story about a non-meeting that didn't take place the next day and OH MY GOD THE RIGHT PEOPLE WERE TOLD TO STAY HOME AND COLOR! ARRRRGGGG!

Umm, it was Trump who touted Saturdays meeting as a Major Meeting. Do you really want to argue that the media should not have reported about Saturdays meeting because Trump lied when he called it a Major Meeting when it was really a non-meeting?

This is Trumps fault. Is it really unreasonable to expect a President to speak realistically about mundane matters. If this was actually a rather routine meeting with some of the people whose advice he values, why does he have to bill it as a major meeting? Why cant he just tell the truth about such a small non-meeting and say he will spend part of his weekend consulting with some of his trusted advisors instead of lying about even the smallest of details?

The media does not make Trump lie constantly - even about small matters. It is Trump who can not describe anything he does in a non-sensational manner. If you are upset at sensationalization, you should be livid at Trump. He is the one who over-sensationalizes *everything* he does
 
Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

Now you are regressing back to an inane argument. Saturdays meeting is just as much an act of governing as Fridays meeting.



Umm, it was Trump who touted Saturdays meeting as a Major Meeting. Do you really want to argue that the media should not have reported about Saturdays meeting because Trump lied when he called it a Major Meeting when it was really a non-meeting?

This is Trumps fault. Is it really unreasonable to expect a President to speak realistically about mundane matters. If this was actually a rather routine meeting with some of the people whose advice he values, why does he have to bill it as a major meeting? Why cant he just tell the truth about such a small non-meeting and say he will spend part of his weekend consulting with some of his trusted advisors instead of lying about even the smallest of details?

The media does not make Trump lie constantly - even about small matters. It is Trump who can not describe anything he does in a non-sensational manner. If you are upset at sensationalization, you should be livid at Trump. He is the one who over-sensationalizes *everything* he does

And when the "media" (DailyKos) says that Shulkin wasn't invited to this secondary meeting, despite any evidence of this, and then selectively edits a clip to make it appear so... what do you call that? Journalistic integrity? Passion for the facts? Adherence to reality? I'm willing to bet you didn't even know about the Friday meeting until I brought it up in this thread.
 
Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

And when the "media" (DailyKos) says that Shulkin wasn't invited to this secondary meeting, despite any evidence of this, and then selectively edits a clip to make it appear so... what do you call that? Journalistic integrity? Passion for the facts? Adherence to reality? I'm willing to bet you didn't even know about the Friday meeting until I brought it up in this thread.

If DailyKos, which I never read, is a rag, it has no effect on me. What the President does affects me. So I do not care about DK. If you want to worry about some rage, be my guest but I am here to discuss substance.

And no, I had not heard of Fridays meeting *or* Saturdays until I read about them here. That is one of the reasons why I come here- to get info I would not hear about otherwise. But again, this thread is not about Fridays meeting. It is about Saturdays, which the President has described as a major meeting about veterans issues. But for some reason or another, even though Trump has made this out to be an important meeting, the VA Secy will not be attending. In fact, until the presser, Trump did even know whether the Secy would be there. Does that sound like good planning to you?

Oh wait!! I forgot that you have no interest in discussing a matter of import. You just want to opine about some internet news website.

Forget I asked.
 
Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

If DailyKos, which I never read, is a rag, it has no effect on me. What the President does affects me. So I do not care about DK. If you want to worry about some rage, be my guest but I am here to discuss substance.

And no, I had not heard of Fridays meeting *or* Saturdays until I read about them here. That is one of the reasons why I come here- to get info I would not hear about otherwise. But again, this thread is not about Fridays meeting. It is about Saturdays, which the President has described as a major meeting about veterans issues. But for some reason or another, even though Trump has made this out to be an important meeting, the VA Secy will not be attending. In fact, until the presser, Trump did even know whether the Secy would be there. Does that sound like good planning to you?

Oh wait!! I forgot that you have no interest in discussing a matter of import. You just want to opine about some internet news website.

Forget I asked.

From the very begining, it has been about the message. What is the message in the article and the OP that was built on it?

"Veteran's organization have requested meetings with Trump several times and received no response. Finally he responds and invites a billionaire to help address and resolve Veteran's issues. Trump did not invite VA Sec. Shulkin and then the meeting he announced never happened"

...but that's not the reality, now is it? Trump had that high level meeting on Friday, with Shulkin and high ranking officials from ten veterans organizations.

If one were to only read the DailyKos article, one could not come to any conclusion other than that Trump is doing nothing - nothing - but playing golf with billionaires. But that's simply not the truth. And if I hadn't taken umbrage with this absolute, pants-on-fire falsehood perpetrated by the DailyKos, then you very likely wouldn't know about the Friday meeting that looks suspiciously like real, actual governance.

And that's the entire problem, in a nutshell. You still want to talk about the non-issue Saturday thing, because admitting Trump did a presidential thing the day before is the ultimate sin for those who wish to remain ignorant and further propagate said ignorance.
 
Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

From the very begining, it has been about the message. What is the message in the article and the OP that was built on it?

"Veteran's organization have requested meetings with Trump several times and received no response. Finally he responds and invites a billionaire to help address and resolve Veteran's issues. Trump did not invite VA Sec. Shulkin and then the meeting he announced never happened"

...but that's not the reality, now is it? Trump had that high level meeting on Friday, with Shulkin and high ranking officials from ten veterans organizations.

If one were to only read the DailyKos article, one could not come to any conclusion other than that Trump is doing nothing - nothing - but playing golf with billionaires. But that's simply not the truth. And if I hadn't taken umbrage with this absolute, pants-on-fire falsehood perpetrated by the DailyKos, then you very likely wouldn't know about the Friday meeting that looks suspiciously like real, actual governance.

And that's the entire problem, in a nutshell. You still want to talk about the non-issue Saturday thing, because admitting Trump did a presidential thing the day before is the ultimate sin for those who wish to remain ignorant and further propagate said ignorance.

No, that is not the message. Read the title of the thread

Trump touted that he was going to have a major meeting on Sat. It turned out to be not so major (in your words, a non-meeting) and he did not require (or even know if) his VA Secy to attend.

You are free to have a nervous breakdown because someone on an internet website wrote something that is not true, but I am more interested in what the President is doing.
 
Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

No, that is not the message. Read the title of the thread

Trump touted that he was going to have a major meeting on Sat. It turned out to be not so major (in your words, a non-meeting) and he did not require (or even know if) his VA Secy to attend.

You are free to have a nervous breakdown because someone on an internet website wrote something that is not true, but I am more interested in what the President is doing.

I literally just quoted the first paragraph in this thread.

...do you not read beyond the headlines? By George, I think we just solved the mystery!
 
Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

I literally just quoted the first paragraph in this thread.

You literally did nothing of the kind.

The mystery really has been solved. Your obtuseness is due to your inability to read either the title or the actual opening post, in which the thread starter made it clear that the subject is the meeting Trump was touting as a major meeting

Here, I will even re-quote the thread starters comments in the OP

Veteran's organization have requested meetings with Trump several times and received no response. Finally he responds and invites a billionaire to help address and resolve Veteran's issues. Trump did not invite VA Sec. Shulkin and then the meeting he announced never happened.

This swamp draining is pissing off a lot of veterans. **** the Vets, right? America first my pink veteran ass!

Again, if you want to obsess and have a nervous breakdown over an invitation, be my guest. I guess you will never get around to discussing the substantive issue, which is what the President says and does because that would require that a non-Trump defender like you take a critical look at Trump. Much better to deflect by obsessing over the word invite
 
Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

You literally did nothing of the kind.

The mystery really has been solved. Your obtuseness is due to your inability to read either the title or the actual opening post, in which the thread starter made it clear that the subject is the meeting Trump was touting as a major meeting

Here, I will even re-quote the thread starters comments in the OP



Again, if you want to obsess and have a nervous breakdown over an invitation, be my guest. I guess you will never get around to discussing the substantive issue, which is what the President says and does because that would require that a non-Trump defender like you take a critical look at Trump. Much better to deflect by obsessing over the word invite

It's ok, little bird, I'll help you through this one.

So, these are quotes: " "

When you put them around things, they denote something someone else said. For example, my grandfather was very fond of pie and often said, "I like pie." You see, by using those little marks, I'm attributing those words to my grandfather. They aren't words that I said myself. Do you follow?

Ok, so back in post #34, I quoted the opening post (sometimes abbreviated OP, which could also mean "opening poster" <---quotes can also be used for clarity). My claim in post #36 that I quoted the first paragraph of the thread is accurate, so you are wrong when you say I didn't do that. Look for the "quotes". (See what I did there? Grammar is fun!)

The purpose of the article, and this thread, is to show that Trump doesn't care about veterans. The explicit claim in the OP is that he has not met with veterans organizations and only met with a billionaire about it. This is false. Further, it is (on the part of the DailyKos) a blatant falsehood, intentionally crafted to mislead in order to sway opinion. Unfortunately, the the OP fell for it. It's ok, though, as the gamesmanship of political lying is an established institution with high payoff, so the people who do it are good at it, and the average joe/voter doesn't have much defense against it.

Pointing put this fact does not make me a Trump supporter. Forcing the dichotomy that it must, however, sounds suspiciously like a former president who once said you are either with us, or.... how did that go again? Help me out here.
 
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Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

It's ok, little bird, I'll help you through this one.

So, these are quotes: " "

When you put them around things, they denote something someone else said. For example, my grandfather was very fond of pie and often said, "I like pie." You see, by using those little marks, I'm attributing those words to my grandfather. They aren't words that I said myself. Do you follow?

Ok, so back in post #3, I quoted the opening post (sometimes abbreviated OP, which could also mean "opening poster" <---quotes can also be used for clarity). My claim in post #36 that I quoted the first paragraph of the thread is accurate, so you are wrong when you say I didn't do that. Look for the "quotes". (See what I did there? Grammar is fun!)

The purpose of the article, and this thread, is to show that Trump doesn't care about veterans. The explicit claim in the OP is that he has not met with veterans organizations and only met with a billionaire about it. This is false. Further, it is (on the part of the DailyKos) a blatant falsehood, intentionally crafted to mislead in order to sway opinion. Unfortunately, the the OP fell for it. It's ok, though, as the gamesmanship of political lying is an established institution with high payoff, so the people who do it are good at it, and the average joe/voter doesn't have much defense against it.

Pointing put this fact does not make me a Trump supporter. Forcing the dichotomy that it must, however, sounds suspiciously like a former president who once said you are either with us, or.... how did that go again? Help me out here.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You are not a Trump defender

Even you know there is no defense for what Trump says
 
Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You are not a Trump defender

Even you know there is no defense for what Trump says

Hmmm... why should anyone listen to you, when you are clearly so bad at this?

The OP said:
Veteran's organization have requested meetings with Trump several times and received no response. Finally he responds and invites a billionaire to help address and resolve Veteran's issues. Trump did not invite VA Sec
Me said:
From the very begining, it has been about the message. What is the message in the article and the OP that was built on it?

"Veteran's organization have requested meetings with Trump several times and received no response. Finally he responds and invites a billionaire to help address and resolve Veteran's issues. Trump did not invite VA Sec. Shulkin and then the meeting he announced never happened"

...but that's not the reality, now is it? Trump had that high level meeting on Friday, with Shulkin and high ranking officials from ten veterans organizations.
You said:
No, that is not the message. Read the title of the thread.
Me said:
I literally just quoted the first paragraph in this thread.
You said:
You literally did nothing of the kind.

I mean, are you just really worked up about something that you didn't take your time to digest the material presented? It's all right there. Denying it is lying to yourself.
 
Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

Hmmm... why should anyone listen to you, when you are clearly so bad at this?







I mean, are you just really worked up about something that you didn't take your time to digest the material presented? It's all right there. Denying it is lying to yourself.

I see you still are running away from adressing the subject (which is what Trump said and did) by talking about everyone except Trump
 
Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

I see you still are running away from adressing the subject (which is what Trump said and did) by talking about everyone except Trump

You mean how Trump met with the key players from ten vet organizations AND Shulkin?

No, I believe I have mentioned that. Saying I'm not talking about Trump is lying. Again. Or at best, just failing really hard.
 
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Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

You mean how Trump met with the key players from ten vet organizations AND Shulkin?

No, I believe I have mentioned that. Saying I'm not talking about Trump is lying. Again. Or at best, just failing really hard.

Yes, Trump was touting an upcoming meeting that happened the day before!! :lamo

I see you have moved from ignoring the subtance to lying about it. The fact is, Trump was touting a meeting he was going to have ON SATURDAY. He said he was going to have a major meeting ON SATURDAY.

The fact that he had a meeting ON FRIDAY does not change the fact that he was talking about a meeting he was going to have ON SATURDAY

Let me know when you want to talk about what Trump actually said about the meeting ON SATURDAY and what actually happened
 
Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

Yes, Trump was touting an upcoming meeting that happened the day before!! :lamo

I see you have moved from ignoring the subtance to lying about it. The fact is, Trump was touting a meeting he was going to have ON SATURDAY. He said he was going to have a major meeting ON SATURDAY.

The fact that he had a meeting ON FRIDAY does not change the fact that he was talking about a meeting he was going to have ON SATURDAY

Let me know when you want to talk about what Trump actually said about the meeting ON SATURDAY and what actually happened

Here's the problem. The DailyKos piece, and this thread, made the claim that Trump ignored vets in spite of their repeated cries, deciding instead to talk to a billionaire about it, cutting out the VA Secretary even.

And it's not true. Trump did have a high level meeting, with veterans' representatives including the VA Secretary. The substance of the claim - that vets were left out of the important talks - is materially false. Important talks happened, prior to the reported-on meeting, and vets were included.

Why can't you admit that simple, plainly visible fact? Why do you instead try to defend the DailyKos? Honest question: is it a reading comprehension problem? I'm not trying to be a dick or troll you or anything. I just watched you say I didn't do a thing that I clearly did, and then not even bother to backpedal but instead launch into some ill conceived offensive. Do you truly not understand what's going on, or are you intentionally being obtuse about it?
 
Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

Here's the problem. The DailyKos piece, and this thread, made the claim that Trump ignored vets in spite of their repeated cries, deciding instead to talk to a billionaire about it, cutting out the VA Secretary even.

Honest question: Is it too upsetting for you to discuss Trumps describing a meeting he was going to have on Saturday as a major meeting even though neither his VA Secy wouldnt be there (and Trump did not know that until he asked) nor any veterans orgs were going to attend?
 
Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

Honest question: Is it too upsetting for you to discuss Trumps describing a meeting he was going to have on Saturday as a major meeting even though neither his VA Secy wouldnt be there (and Trump did not know that until he asked) nor any veterans orgs were going to attend?

Talking about the Saturday meeting in the context provided by the lying article - the one that ignores the world of a Friday meeting - is dishonest. Trying to bend and force the issue into that context is dishonest. Relying on that dishonest context as your argument is... well, it's weak.

Refusing to acknowledge the obvious and simple truth that Trump has NOT ignored vets is displaying your commitment to the dishonesty in play.

Why lie? It destroys credibility and ultimately damages your cause.
 
Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

Talking about the Saturday meeting in the context provided by the lying article - the one that ignores the world of a Friday meeting - is dishonest.

So why dont you talk about the Saurday meeting and how Trump described it without any referene to Fridays meeting?

Or will that cause you to stroke out?
 
Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

So why dont you talk about the Saurday meeting and how Trump described it without any referene to Fridays meeting?

Or will that cause you to stroke out?

Because the reference to the Saturday meeting - without the VA Secretary - is meaningless when you realize they met on Friday. The outrage you feel is misplaced, because it's built on a lie.

I'm sorry you fell for it so hard that you can't back out now and still save face.
 
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Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

Because the reference to the Saturday meeting - without the VA Secretary - is meaningless when you realize they met on Friday. The outrage you feel is misplaced, because it's built on a lie.

There is no lie. Just the fact that Trump touted a Saturday meeting that never happened. For some odd reason, you believe it is OK for Trump to lie about a future meeting dishonestly because he had a meeting in the past.

But hey, I am not going to make you say anything bad about Trump. I would not want to cause you to stroke out
 
Re: Trump Touts Meeting to Address VA Issues, Sec. of VA not invited. Meeting No Go.

There is no lie. Just the fact that Trump touted a Saturday meeting that never happened. For some odd reason, you believe it is OK for Trump to lie about a future meeting dishonestly because he had a meeting in the past.

But hey, I am not going to make you say anything bad about Trump. I would not want to cause you to stroke out

This thread, the DailyKos article, and your religious clinging to the frighteningly obvious lie that Trump skipped the vets and went right to the billionaires instead is beyond scary.

If someone can delude themselves so throughly.... what kind of atrocity are they capable of? If someone so blindly follows their chosen bias, what can those purveyors of that bias make someone believe? Can you be made to believe that some people are inferior? Can you be made to believe that some people don't deserve their rights?

Your continuing defense of the blatant DailyKos lie here is truly terrifying.
 
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