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Presidents/civilians and saluting

apdst said:
I was told that Congress critters do, but never looked it up. The advice I got as a private was, "when in doubt, whip it out". I met exactly zero civilians that rated salutes in 13 years...lol
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Hell...in basic, E1s are trained to salute cars.


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My dad, even as a 23 year Air Force vet, never saluted after he got out of the service.

Today, when the flag goes off and I'm in civilians, we're told to just stand at attention. It feels a little weird not doing anything so sometimes I'll put my hand over my heart, sometimes not.

Since Commander-in-Chief is a position not a rank, I'm not sure what is within protocol for Trump to do. But I don't think it's wrong of him to salute if he wants to. I would if I were President.
 
BrewerBob said:
So I noticed during the military review Trump was saluting the Flag as opposed to placing his hand over his heart, as Pence did. I had never seen that. Generally the only people who salute the Flag are military or other uniformed people like police, but only in uniform.

Generally you only see the President salute when returning a salute. So after I saw Trump do that I did some googling. Apparently Presidents saluting at all is a recent tradition that appears to have begun with Reagan. Reagan was the first to return the salutes. Later Presidents continued the tradition. So I guess if Trump wants to start the tradition of Presidents saluting the Flag then that is his prerogative. But it just feels a little weird to me. Maybe because I served in the Army 20 years and am set in my ways.

And on a related note, it has never been clear cut which civilians should be saluted by military members. When I was in the Army the regs said the only civilian you were required to salute was the Presidents. But when googling I found an order from the Secretary of the Air Force ordering all Airmen to salute the President, VP, SECDEF, and Service Secretaries as well.

And when I worked in embassies the Marine Security Guards would often salute the Ambassador when he or she first entered the embassy that day.

I don't want this thread to become politicized. I just thought it would be fun to discuss everyone's different opinions and interpretations on who should be saluting whom.
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Interesting note for this thread which has two parts.

1 In 1952 some southern Congressman got a bill through congress which is still in force that states that in a time of emergency civilian employees of the government CAN have their civilian ranks (pay grades) converted to military ranks. Many states quickly adopted this. For those of you who understand it works something like this.

Federal only

GS - 12 Major
GS - 11 Captain
GS - 9 1st Lt. (10's are rare in the government)
GS - 7 2nd Lt (8's are also rare)

2. By a federal act of Congress (not sure when) DOD regulators, inspectors and some enforcement people while in the performance of their duties have a "simulated" (not sure the exact wording) of Captain.

How do I know this I was a DOD regulator for 8 years and every time I went to a base the MP/SP or whatever at the gate had to salute me. I was not allowed to use the PX or officers club. It was sometimes fun to watch the MP/SP facial reaction to have to salute a civilian.

I don't give a **** whether you believe this second part or not.
 
BrewerBob said:
So I noticed during the military review Trump was saluting the Flag as opposed to placing his hand over his heart, as Pence did. I had never seen that. Generally the only people who salute the Flag are military or other uniformed people like police, but only in uniform.

Generally you only see the President salute when returning a salute. So after I saw Trump do that I did some googling. Apparently Presidents saluting at all is a recent tradition that appears to have begun with Reagan. Reagan was the first to return the salutes. Later Presidents continued the tradition. So I guess if Trump wants to start the tradition of Presidents saluting the Flag then that is his prerogative. But it just feels a little weird to me. Maybe because I served in the Army 20 years and am set in my ways.

And on a related note, it has never been clear cut which civilians should be saluted by military members. When I was in the Army the regs said the only civilian you were required to salute was the Presidents. But when googling I found an order from the Secretary of the Air Force ordering all Airmen to salute the President, VP, SECDEF, and Service Secretaries as well.

And when I worked in embassies the Marine Security Guards would often salute the Ambassador when he or she first entered the embassy that day.

I don't want this thread to become politicized. I just thought it would be fun to discuss everyone's different opinions and interpretations on who should be saluting whom.
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I wouldn't put it past Trump to show up one day in a uniform he designed for himself with all of the ribbons and ornaments that other tin-pot dictators, like Kadafi and others, have created for themselves. It really wouldn't surprise me at all.
 
BrewerBob said:
I was at the airfield coordinating aircraft services for the arrival of SECSTATE Colin Powell. After he was greeted by the Ambassador he headed toward the awaiting motorcade. I saluted him when he approached because he will always be General Powell to me. He returned my salute and came straight to me and began talking to me. I was just an E-5 at the time. Pissed the State Department GS-13s and 14s off that were there who then had to wait on lil' ol' me. :)
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I don't think anything wrong with saluting a former general. And I was a GS-13, and it wouldn't have bothered me.

And don't forget to salute anyone wearing the MoH, whether civie or military.
 
BrewerBob said:
So I noticed during the military review Trump was saluting the Flag as opposed to placing his hand over his heart, as Pence did. I had never seen that. Generally the only people who salute the Flag are military or other uniformed people like police, but only in uniform.

Generally you only see the President salute when returning a salute. So after I saw Trump do that I did some googling. Apparently Presidents saluting at all is a recent tradition that appears to have begun with Reagan. Reagan was the first to return the salutes. Later Presidents continued the tradition. So I guess if Trump wants to start the tradition of Presidents saluting the Flag then that is his prerogative. But it just feels a little weird to me. Maybe because I served in the Army 20 years and am set in my ways.

And on a related note, it has never been clear cut which civilians should be saluted by military members. When I was in the Army the regs said the only civilian you were required to salute was the Presidents. But when googling I found an order from the Secretary of the Air Force ordering all Airmen to salute the President, VP, SECDEF, and Service Secretaries as well.

And when I worked in embassies the Marine Security Guards would often salute the Ambassador when he or she first entered the embassy that day.

I don't want this thread to become politicized. I just thought it would be fun to discuss everyone's different opinions and interpretations on who should be saluting whom.
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Retired military and active duty can now salute the flag whether in uniform or not. Whom to salute, From basic on I was taught, when in doubt, salute. Of course basic for me was 1966 and there's been a ton of water pass under that bridge. Perhaps the Ambassador gets saluted because he is the commander of that post or Embassy in this case. I don't know. Or maybe the Commandant of the Marine Corps issued an order that all Ambassadors would be saluted.

I had heard it was Reagan who began the presidential salute. Why not, he was a veteran of WWII although he served in the states. As for presidents saluting, again why not. After all they are the CINC of all the armed forces.
 
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