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The Air Force Is Starting to Think About Its Next Strike Aircraft

Rogue Valley

Rogue Valley

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The Air Force Is Starting to Think About Its Next Strike Aircraft


Service leaders are laying groundwork for a new strike capability — even as they work to unground their F-35s....


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Simpleχity;1066355187 said:
The Air Force Is Starting to Think About Its Next Strike Aircraft


Service leaders are laying groundwork for a new strike capability — even as they work to unground their F-35s....
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Of course - that's the way the military must work in a world of relentless technological progress. The Navy's been doing the same thing as far back as the end of WWI, trying to ascertain what kind of force structure and capabilities will be needed twenty, thirty, even forty years in the future...and then taking that information and deciding what can be built and when, while at the same time keeping an eye on projected financial and technological resources.
 
I try not to be too cynical, but no other military in the world has had anything close to parity with the U.S in decades.

This is about making sure the MIC's trough stays full.
 
joG said:
Somehow I had thought the next generation would be unmanned and fly in swarms.
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A lot of people would be against that. There are many reasons but a major one is that machines can't make assessments and instant changes based on those assessments. Essentially, a machine can't make up for good old fashioned human intuition. ;)
 
WillyPete said:
I try not to be too cynical, but no other military in the world has had anything close to parity with the U.S in decades.

This is about making sure the MIC's trough stays full.
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Here's a fun question: which country has the largest diversity in 5th Generation Airframes either in-service or coming into service over the next 5-10 years?
 
cpwill said:
Here's a fun question: which country has the largest diversity in 5th Generation Airframes either in-service or coming into service over the next 5-10 years?
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I'm sure the answer will be shocking.

I'll also wager we have more of just about any given frame than that nation does of all frames combined.
 
cpwill said:
Here's a fun question: which country has the largest diversity in 5th Generation Airframes either in-service or coming into service over the next 5-10 years?
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If I am not mistaken, that would be China with a potential of 3 gen 5 planes.

Russia has 1.5 under development. A domestic one and a two seat version of the same being developed with India
 
Lord Tammerlain said:
If I am not mistaken, that would be China with a potential of 3 gen 5 planes.

Russia has 1.5 under development. A domestic one and a two seat version of the same being developed with India
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Winner Winner, Chicken Dinner. ;)

WillyPete said:
I'm sure the answer will be shocking.

I'll also wager we have more of just about any given frame than that nation does of all frames combined.
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As someone who spent three years of their life tracking (among other things) Chinese Order of Battle developments, I would be thrilled to take that wager. How much would you like to lose wager? :)
 
Simpleχity;1066355187 said:
The Air Force Is Starting to Think About Its Next Strike Aircraft


Service leaders are laying groundwork for a new strike capability — even as they work to unground their F-35s....


defense-large.jpg
Click to expand...

How about building a heavily armored, aircraft capable of carrying a wide array of weapons platforms that can hang in a fight for an expended period of time, putting a lot of firepower into a tightly controlled area that's affordable to build and maintain? I wonder where we could ever find an aircraft like that....
 
faithful_servant said:
How about building a heavily armored, aircraft capable of carrying a wide array of weapons platforms that can hang in a fight for an expended period of time, putting a lot of firepower into a tightly controlled area that's affordable to build and maintain? I wonder where we could ever find an aircraft like that....
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One area the AF has looked into is using heavy air craft as a long loiter craft with multiple long range weapons equipped to provide support to strike craft further in enemy territory.

Ie a wing if F22's identifies enemy aircraft, The B52 for example is notified (network comm) and launch's AA missiles from 200 miles out allowing the F 22 to remain stealthy.
 
cpwill said:
As someone who spent three years of their life tracking (among other things) Chinese Order of Battle developments, I would be thrilled to take that wager. How much would you like to lose wager? :)
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You're clearly easily thrilled. I did an informal count, and you're right. Be sure to congratulate yourself.

You'd have to add up our top three jet warplanes to match their entire post-1980 jet arsenal. Naturally a 1 for 1 one match isn't a fair comparison, and there are the planned 1700+ F35s, but who knows when that'll be.

You're the expert. Should we be loading up our pants for fear of the Chinese, or could we ease off the spending just a wee bit without endangering the free world?
 
WillyPete said:
You're clearly easily thrilled. I did an informal count, and you're right. Be sure to congratulate yourself.

You'd have to add up our top three jet warplanes to match their entire post-1980 jet arsenal. Naturally a 1 for 1 one match isn't a fair comparison
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Sort of. Chinese airframes are integrated into an Anti-Access-Area-Denial Strategy that is a real bear.

, and there are the planned 1700+ F35s, but who knows when that'll be.
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Yup. Government sure is super-duper competent.

You're the expert. Should we be loading up our pants for fear of the Chinese, or could we ease off the spending just a wee bit without endangering the free world?
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Already the status of the world is degrading, not least because we have failed to invest properly in maintaining and developing the military side of superpower status. Sure, we spend a lot of money under "Defense" - what people forget, however, is that we are paying a helluva lot more for our people. Salary in the US Armed Forces is significantly higher than in the Chinese armed forces. So are the costs of health and other side benefits.
 
Kal'Stang said:
A lot of people would be against that. There are many reasons but a major one is that machines can't make assessments and instant changes based on those assessments. Essentially, a machine can't make up for good old fashioned human intuition. ;)
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They don't have to lack pilots, they can just be flown by an enlisted man in Nevada in an office instead of a higher paid officer in the cockpit
 
EMNofSeattle said:
They don't have to lack pilots, they can just be flown by an enlisted man in Nevada in an office instead of a higher paid officer in the cockpit
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Small problem with that scenario. Its called decision lag. IE the time it takes to make and execute a decision. The longer the distance a drone is controlled the longer the lag in the decision loop.
 
PirateMk1 said:
Small problem with that scenario. Its called decision lag. IE the time it takes to make and execute a decision. The longer the distance a drone is controlled the longer the lag in the decision loop.
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Not to mention the fact that even a third rate military like Iran was able to hack into and force land one of our most secret drones a few years back. I could just see how great that would be in a shooting war with armed drones. No need to shoot down are planes just hack them and threat over.
 
WillyPete said:
You're clearly easily thrilled. I did an informal count, and you're right. Be sure to congratulate yourself.

You'd have to add up our top three jet warplanes to match their entire post-1980 jet arsenal. Naturally a 1 for 1 one match isn't a fair comparison, and there are the planned 1700+ F35s, but who knows when that'll be.

You're the expert. Should we be loading up our pants for fear of the Chinese, or could we ease off the spending just a wee bit without endangering the free world?
Click to expand...

Seeing as the timeline for designing testing and producing planes is measured in decades any Air Force that waits till it needs a new plane to start thinking about what comes next is already hopelessly out classed and its service members will pay for it with their lives if war does come. Some folks are ok with that. Others less so.
 
Kal'Stang said:
A lot of people would be against that. There are many reasons but a major one is that machines can't make assessments and instant changes based on those assessments. Essentially, a machine can't make up for good old fashioned human intuition. ;)
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AI is not far enough. You are probably right. In the interim we could use fighters directed by people siting in a command center, I guess. Sort of like drone control. As a matter of fact, they would be fighter drones. ;)
 
faithful_servant said:
How about building a heavily armored, aircraft capable of carrying a wide array of weapons platforms that can hang in a fight for an expended period of time, putting a lot of firepower into a tightly controlled area that's affordable to build and maintain? I wonder where we could ever find an aircraft like that....
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Heavy is bad and missiles tend to make armor meaningless.

What we really need is something that stands up well to small arms. Maybe with engines positioned so as to be protected from ground fire.
 
Personally, I think you're ALL wrong. VTOL is the way to go...lets be honest, the next war won't be like WW2, wars are now more like insurgencies. Even a big throw down with China and Russia will us fighting mainly in urban areas. Jets need runways. Well, except for harriers. And it seems to me that we could surely improve upon something developed in the 50s.
 
Kal'Stang said:
A lot of people would be against that. There are many reasons but a major one is that machines can't make assessments and instant changes based on those assessments. Essentially, a machine can't make up for good old fashioned human intuition. ;)
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Machines can make up for that deficiency in a number of ways. One would be numbers, the greater of which if networked combining each individuals sensors gives a far greater sight picture than could be achieved by a singular manned aircraft or even a few. This alone improves the quality of a machines decisions. Or they could go the old fashioned route which I myself prefer and that is to unleash a lot of drones in a defined AOR and let them kill anything that moves. I am taking intuition out of the equation that case. Drones remember can be utilized in tandem with human warfighters as well. In which case the intuition can be utilized and magnified.

I would propose instead of using pilots in newer CAS aircraft I would utilize drones and empower the FAC's on the ground that need them to direct the drones. I would embed trained FAC's in almost every war fighting unit which might need air support with trained FAC's and supply the unit with their own dedicated CAS and recon drones to be used as they see fit, with limited access to more sophisticated and capable units as required.
 
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