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How the Pentagon is Preparing for a Tank War With Russia

Exquisitor said:
No, sanctions work a lot better.
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i don't really agree. if Europe really wants Crimea to be part of Ukraine / Europe, then Europe can build a super kickass military and have a dick measuring standoff with Russia. we need to stay out of that one. we have our own country to fix.
 
The Ukraine has always been part of Russia and is none of America's or Europe's business, but if your silly enough to create what you have done in the Middle East, then go for it and destroy the world, as you continue to do, as Russia will not be the push over you think it will be
 
good, i'd much rather my tax dollars go to this than to feeding Tanisha's 12th illegitimate child.
 
AFM said:
The Ukraine has always been part of Russia and is none of America's or Europe's business, but if you're silly enough to create what you have done in the Middle East, then go for it and destroy the world, as you continue to do, as Russia will not be the push over you think it will be.
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I do not believe that anyone at The Pentagon gives a rats arse about Ukraine.

But the other nations who have already joined NATO they DO care about.

If there is going to be war it will start conventionally with fighter/bombers, tanks, artillery and infantry.

The first American forces on the ground will come from the sea, into Poland, our Navy and Marines. This will probably become a stalemate really fast as the two air powers, US Naval and Russian aviation, collide.

Then our airborne light infantry with all kinds of anti tank missiles will arrive and the battlefield will become even more gridlocked and stalemated.

Finally the big Russian tanks and the big US Army tanks will arrive, with more mechanized infantry.

They will all probably just sit there.

There will not be any nuclear war because Russians love their children as much as Americans love theirs.
 
Helix said:
i don't really agree. if Europe really wants Crimea to be part of Ukraine / Europe, then Europe can build a super kickass military and have a dick measuring standoff with Russia. we need to stay out of that one. we have our own country to fix.
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Exactly!

Which will never happen simply because all the aggressive genes were killed off in Europe in WW1 and WW2 and now only wimp DNA material floats around Europe to reproduce there.
 
Gee I love you naivety, as Putin is a gambler (You can see it in the Middle East) and will use whatever weapons he has at his disposal, and a tactical nuclear weapon on invading forces will be deplored and then all hell will break loose, the US hiding behind Nato will use their nukes, firstly a small one and then a larger one and then what the heck, in for a penny in for a pound
 
Riveroaks said:
I do not believe that anyone at The Pentagon gives a rats arse about Ukraine.

But the other nations who have already joined NATO they DO care about.

If there is going to be war it will start conventionally with fighter/bombers, tanks, artillery and infantry.

The first American forces on the ground will come from the sea, into Poland, our Navy and Marines. This will probably become a stalemate really fast as the two air powers, US Naval and Russian aviation, collide.

Then our airborne light infantry with all kinds of anti tank missiles will arrive and the battlefield will become even more gridlocked and stalemated.

Finally the big Russian tanks and the big US Army tanks will arrive, with more mechanized infantry.

They will all probably just sit there.

There will not be any nuclear war because Russians love their children as much as Americans love theirs.
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Gee I love you naivety, as Putin is a gambler (You can see it in the Middle East) and will use whatever weapons he has at his disposal, and a tactical nuclear weapon on invading forces will be deplored and then all hell will break loose, the US hiding behind Nato will use their nukes, firstly a small one and then a larger one and then what the heck, in for a penny in for a pound
 
Exquisitor said:
Those who think, "I will be dead by then," will be in hell by then.
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I don't care about you, you can be here watching your skin peeling off, but in fifteen years I'll be gone and you can all enjoy your nuclear war or what's left
 
Helix said:
FFS, what do they think this looks like, the invasion of Berlin? like it's going to be predominantly a tank war, or an even a remotely winnable one if it ever happens. vote out warmongers now, before their **** measuring contests destroy our country and who knows how much of the rest of humanity and the planet. it's time to evolve.
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Can I put this in my signature? This statement pretty much sums up the stupidity of modern warfare better than any other... in my opinion.
 
Abbazorkzog said:
Can I put this in my signature? This statement pretty much sums up the stupidity of modern warfare better than any other... in my opinion.
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i don't have a problem with it.
 
joG said:
A tank war with Russia would best not be fought with tanks on our side.
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Not that it is directly germane but keeping the warthog in the air while the Ari Force decides if the F35 can kill tanks as effectively speaks to this loudly.
I am not sure.. I know the Pentagon is holding A10 vs F35 test currently
 
Simpleχity;1065891223 said:
Found another article re: a tank war and Russia...

US Army Studies Russian-Ukraine War for revolution in tank and drone warfare for modern close combat war lessons

It seems the US/NATO are gaming this scenario again due to Moscow's aggressive European posture.
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Russia really isn't as big of a threat as people think they are. NATO would roflstomp Russia, and Russia knows this.
This is scaremongering by the military-industrial complex, trying to bill Russia as some sort of 'ultimate adversary' of the 21st Century. "Terrorists first! Now RUSSIAAAAAA!!!! BLAAARRGHHHHH!!!!" Putin may be evil, but he is not stupid. He knows how foolish it would be to risk an all-out war with the entire NATO bloc spearheaded by the United States. It would quite literally be suicide and could result in an extinction-level event.
 
Abbazorkzog said:
Russia really isn't as big of a threat as people think they are. NATO would roflstomp Russia, and Russia knows this.
This is scaremongering by the military-industrial complex, trying to bill Russia as some sort of 'ultimate adversary' of the 21st Century. "Terrorists first! Now RUSSIAAAAAA!!!! BLAAARRGHHHHH!!!!" Putin may be evil, but he is not stupid. He knows how foolish it would be to risk an all-out war with the entire NATO bloc spearheaded by the United States. It would quite literally be suicide and could result in an extinction-level event.
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Eh......maybe. This isn't Iraq we're talking here, whose military was big but was mainly a paper tiger. The Russians have been steadily improving every since things fell apart in the early 1990s. The US contingent would be operating on the end of a very long supply line, and the European militaries are still pretty much untested conventionally.

My guess would be a draw.
 
Tigerace117 said:
Eh......maybe. This isn't Iraq we're talking here, whose military was big but was mainly a paper tiger. The Russians have been steadily improving every since things fell apart in the early 1990s. The US contingent would be operating on the end of a very long supply line, and the European militaries are still pretty much untested conventionally.

My guess would be a draw.
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The Russian military has just over 3 million soldiers, 15,000 tanks, 3,547 air craft, 350 naval ships and an aircraft carrier...

NATO and its allies (Including the US and likely backed by India, Egypt, Israel and Japan) have over 8 million soldiers, 30,000 tanks, 23,500 air craft, 1,837 ships, and 31 air craft carriers. (including the aforementioned 4 nations)...

Russia would get mollywhopped.
 
It is foolish to think that because two countries have nuclear weapons that conflict is: (1) Impossible and/or (2) That such a conflict must be nuclear. It is imperative to consider the possibility and capability of fighting a conventional engagement with another nuclear power for the purposes of both deterrence and practical necessity.
 
Sherman123 said:
It is foolish to think that because two countries have nuclear weapons that conflict is: (1) Impossible and/or (2) That such a conflict must be nuclear. It is imperative to consider the possibility and capability of fighting a conventional engagement with another nuclear power for the purposes of both deterrence and practical necessity.
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But I do not think, we should wage a land war in Asia. Or do you see Obama, Clinton or Trump leading anything more grand than the charge of the light brigade?
 
Abbazorkzog said:
The Russian military has just over 3 million soldiers, 15,000 tanks, 3,547 air craft, 350 naval ships and an aircraft carrier...

NATO and its allies (Including the US and likely backed by India, Egypt, Israel and Japan) have over 8 million soldiers, 30,000 tanks, 23,500 air craft, 1,837 ships, and 31 air craft carriers. (including the aforementioned 4 nations)...

Russia would get mollywhopped.
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Why would Japan get involved? Hell, using Japan would likely tip China and maybe even South Korea over into neutrality, or, in China's case, hostility to the west. Your also talking about a country which has a large portion of its populace who are deeply uncomfortable with having the military forces they do have. Unless Russia directly attacked them.....

India is fairly friendly with Russia, and will remain so as long as we back Pakistan. The Israelis aren't going to go out of their own neighborhood to mess with Russia--they have their hands full as it is. Same with Egypt.

NATO states and the United States have lots of equipment, it's true.... But not all of it is in Europe. Unless you totally pull out of every other theater, completely stripping the bases in the Pacific and Med clean you still can't concentrate all those forces in one battlespace. And Russia has a number of ways of causing problems for the West in their own backyard. When you factor in countries like China and Iran which would draw off even more troops.....
 
Tigerace117 said:
Why would Japan get involved? Hell, using Japan would likely tip China and maybe even South Korea over into neutrality, or, in China's case, hostility to the west. Your also talking about a country which has a large portion of its populace who are deeply uncomfortable with having the military forces they do have. Unless Russia directly attacked them.....

India is fairly friendly with Russia, and will remain so as long as we back Pakistan. The Israelis aren't going to go out of their own neighborhood to mess with Russia--they have their hands full as it is. Same with Egypt.

NATO states and the United States have lots of equipment, it's true.... But not all of it is in Europe. Unless you totally pull out of every other theater, completely stripping the bases in the Pacific and Med clean you still can't concentrate all those forces in one battlespace. And Russia has a number of ways of causing problems for the West in their own backyard. When you factor in countries like China and Iran which would draw off even more troops.....
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You're right about Pakistan. It would more than likely be Pakistan instead of India, but neither India nor China would back Russia if it was stupid enough to take on all of NATO and her allies. Egypt (unless the military junta in power further gapes the divide between Egypt and the U.S.) will remain committed to the pro-NATO Saudi-U.S.-Arab power nexus in the Middle-East. Israel is one of America's closest allies, there is no scenario where Israel will endanger the U.S. in anyway and vice-versa.

And nobody would be 'using' Japan. Japan loves America. America is committed to Japan. Japan hates Russia. Japan will join in on the pounding of Russia. As much as the scaremongerers would like us to believe, Russia is a withered shell of the Soviet Union, and will never be as powerful or threatening as the USSR was. We will never face another adversary as powerful as the USSR was at even one of its lowest levels of power.
 
Abbazorkzog said:
You're right about Pakistan. It would more than likely be Pakistan instead of India, but neither India nor China would back Russia if it was stupid enough to take on all of NATO and her allies. Egypt (unless the military junta in power further gapes the divide between Egypt and the U.S.) will remain committed to the pro-NATO Saudi-U.S.-Arab power nexus in the Middle-East. Israel is one of America's closest allies, there is no scenario where Israel will endanger the U.S. in anyway and vice-versa.

And nobody would be 'using' Japan. Japan loves America. America is committed to Japan. Japan hates Russia. Japan will join in on the pounding of Russia. As much as the scaremongerers would like us to believe, Russia is a withered shell of the Soviet Union, and will never be as powerful or threatening as the USSR was. We will never face another adversary as powerful as the USSR was at even one of its lowest levels of power.
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Japan might----might---send rear echelon/second line support troops, and probably would allow America use of itself as a base, but their all about defense. Look at the names---Naval Self Defense Force, etc. These are strictly defensive formations. They aren't going to suddenly invade Vladiovostok, which is about the only thing of real importance out there anyway.

Pakistan's quality is negligible---they've lost all three wars they fought with India. Add the fact that the ISI is essentially an independent state and more likely then not you get caught with an Islamist guerilla war in Pakistan tying down US troops.

China is going to be very unhappy with any US/Russia War, but they could easily make a play for the Spratleys if the US is sufficiently distracted.

The Israelis might contribute Mossad and or Sayeret troops, but they're much more interested in going after Iran. Egypt certainly can't afford to send large portions of the military on what would be perceived as an idiotic foreign adventure, especially seeing as Russians make up a big part of Egypt's tourism package.

The Eastern European states don't like Russia, but I could see countries like Hungary staying out of the war if Putin contained it to seizing the Baltic States or the rest of the Ukraine. The problem is that it would burn all remaining bridges with the West, which is why it'll never happen. But it's fun to speculate.
 
Tigerace117 said:
Japan might----might---send rear echelon/second line support troops, and probably would allow America use of itself as a base, but their all about defense. Look at the names---Naval Self Defense Force, etc. These are strictly defensive formations. They aren't going to suddenly invade Vladiovostok, which is about the only thing of real importance out there anyway.

Pakistan's quality is negligible---they've lost all three wars they fought with India. Add the fact that the ISI is essentially an independent state and more likely then not you get caught with an Islamist guerilla war in Pakistan tying down US troops.

China is going to be very unhappy with any US/Russia War, but they could easily make a play for the Spratleys if the US is sufficiently distracted.

The Israelis might contribute Mossad and or Sayeret troops, but they're much more interested in going after Iran. Egypt certainly can't afford to send large portions of the military on what would be perceived as an idiotic foreign adventure, especially seeing as Russians make up a big part of Egypt's tourism package.

The Eastern European states don't like Russia, but I could see countries like Hungary staying out of the war if Putin contained it to seizing the Baltic States or the rest of the Ukraine. The problem is that it would burn all remaining bridges with the West, which is why it'll never happen. But it's fun to speculate.
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I still think that Egypt and Israel would be fairly committed to backing NATO en masse. And Pakistan has the 13th most-powerful military on Earth...that is far from negligible (considering the fact all the war's they've lost with India... have truly been wars fought with the 4th most powerful military on our planet).

Either way, Russia would be isolated and heavily outmanned, outgunned, and overpowered in every scenario (unless NATO was the oppressor, in which case Russia would still lose but hold out longer than expected if it had the homefield advantage).
 
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