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Israeli High Court Allows DNA Testing to Prove Judaism

truthatallcost

truthatallcost

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A panel of High Court justices rejected the petition filed by Avigdor Lieberman, Yisrael Beitenu and several private petitioners against the Chief Rabbinate and the rabbinical courts, ruling that DNA testing to prove one’s Judaism should be allowed.

The High Court of Justice also ruled that the petitioners did not prove that the rabbinate acted in a discriminatory manner in this matter. At the same time, the majority decision said the rabbinate must formulate written rules on the issue within a year.

The majority decision was written by Justice Neal Hendel, who noted that two important issues were raised in the petition: reexamination by the rabbinical court of the Judaism of someone who was already recognized and registered as a Jew, and conducting genetic tests to prove one’s Judaism.

Israeli High Court allows DNA testing to prove Judaism - Israel News - Haaretz.com
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Such strange practices are carried out by #1 Best Ally®. On the one hand, rabbinical courts in Israel conduct DNA testing in order to prove a religious affiliation of a person. Refusal to submit to DNA testing for Judaism can be seen taken as proof that a person is not a Jew. Meanwhile in the West, Jewish anthropologists like Franz Boas are credited with moving social sciences away from genetic determinism and toward environmental determinism.

The popular modern idea that 'race is a social construct' was spread by social scientists like Boas, many of them also Jewish, some Zionists, and the message has always been directed at non-Jewish white people. The implication of that theory is that white people shouldn't feel any special bond with other white people, or take collective pride in accomplishments of white civilizations. It's become fashionable for people to refer to themselves as 'mutts', if their ancestry is made up of several different European ethnicities.

EPY_R2WWsAAl5Cz


Yet the originators of the 'race is a social construct' theory view Judaism as measurable in hard scientific terms. They believe that Judaism can be seen under a microscope, but race can't be seen with our own eyes. It seems as though the USA has chosen as its allies the most bigoted, narcissistic people we could find when we abandoned Europe in favor of Israel, Saudi Arabia and China.
 
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Disaster in the making...
 
truthatallcost said:
Such strange practices are carried out by #1 Best Ally®. On the one hand, rabbinical courts in Israel conduct DNA testing in order to prove a religious affiliation of a person. Refusal to submit to DNA testing for Judaism can be seen taken as proof that a person is not a Jew. Meanwhile in the West, Jewish anthropologists like Franz Boas are credited with moving social sciences away from genetic determinism and toward environmental determinism.

The popular modern idea that 'race is a social construct' was spread by social scientists like Boas, many of them also Jewish, some Zionists, and the message has always been directed at non-Jewish white people. The implication of that theory is that white people shouldn't feel any special bond with other white people, or take collective pride in accomplishments of white civilizations. It's become fashionable for people to refer to themselves as 'mutts', if their ancestry is made up of several different European ethnicities.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EPY_R2WWsAAl5Cz?format=png&name=medium

Yet the originators of the 'race is a social construct' theory view Judaism as measurable in hard scientific terms. They believe that Judaism can be seen under a microscope, but race can't be seen with our own eyes. It seems as though the USA has chosen as its allies the most bigoted, narcissistic people we could find when we abandoned Europe in favor of Israel, Saudi Arabia and China.[/QUOTE]

Your issue is?
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truthatallcost said:
DNA purity tests for Judaism. One doesn't need to make a substantial argument for why this is wrong, do they?
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PuRiTy TeSt? Allowing someone to use evidence to demonstrate something is different than requiring that specific demonstration.

But nice try. Goebbels would be proud.
 
truthatallcost said:
Such strange practices are carried out by #1 Best Ally®. On the one hand, rabbinical courts in Israel conduct DNA testing in order to prove a religious affiliation of a person. Refusal to submit to DNA testing for Judaism can be seen taken as proof that a person is not a Jew. Meanwhile in the West, Jewish anthropologists like Franz Boas are credited with moving social sciences away from genetic determinism and toward environmental determinism.

The popular modern idea that 'race is a social construct' was spread by social scientists like Boas, many of them also Jewish, some Zionists, and the message has always been directed at non-Jewish white people. The implication of that theory is that white people shouldn't feel any special bond with other white people, or take collective pride in accomplishments of white civilizations. It's become fashionable for people to refer to themselves as 'mutts', if their ancestry is made up of several different European ethnicities.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EPY_R2WWsAAl5Cz?format=png&name=small

Yet the originators of the 'race is a social construct' theory view Judaism as measurable in hard scientific terms. They believe that Judaism can be seen under a microscope, but race can't be seen with our own eyes. It seems as though the USA has chosen as its allies the most bigoted, narcissistic people we could find when we abandoned Europe in favor of Israel, Saudi Arabia and China.
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That's not quite true. From your link:"The data also show that in 2017, 3,868 people applied to have their Judaism confirmed and 96 percent of the requests were approved; in 2018, there were 3,451 applications and 97 percent were approved. “These figures speak for themselves. The vast majority of the applications were approved, only in a very few cases was a request for genetic testing made,” Sohlberg wrote."

Native Americans DNA testing for tribal enrollment has proved to be problematic. As your link noted, while DNA can be used to proved tribal identity, to use it to disallow membership despite evidence to the contrary would be self-defeating in the long run.

Tribal Enrollment and Genetic Testing | Genetics
Issues and Considerations in Using DNA Testing for Tribal Enrollment

Recent advances in DNA testing have brought with them possibilities for using DNA testing as criteria for tribal enrollment. Many people have found the prospect that these DNA tests can provide a concrete yes or no answer about biological relationships (parentage and descent) to be an attractive and positive aspect of using these tests. However, using DNA testing may limit the understanding of tribal identity to only a biological understanding if it is not supplemented with other tools or methods of determining tribal identity (or enrollment eligibility). Further, there are concerns that DNA testing within families and communities could reveal information about parents and lineage that contradicts other claims or family stories. More specifically each kind of testing offers particular positive aspects and some challenges above and beyond these basics.
 
CJ 2.0 said:
PuRiTy TeSt? Allowing someone to use evidence to demonstrate something is different than requiring that specific demonstration.

But nice try. Goebbels would be proud.
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Agreed. Herr Goebbels was very adept at antisemitic propaganda as you well know.
 
CJ 2.0 said:
PuRiTy TeSt? Allowing someone to use evidence to demonstrate something is different than requiring that specific demonstration.

But nice try. Goebbels would be proud.
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Bold- Proud of Israel, I'll assume. Since you're experienced in what goes on in Israel, tell me- what possible case would require a DNA test to prove someone's Judaism? I just don't understand that part.
 
truthatallcost said:
Bold- Proud of Israel, I'll assume. Since you're experienced in what goes on in Israel, tell me- what possible case would require a DNA test to prove someone's Judaism? I just don't understand that part.
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It’s not complicated. Religious identity is inherited through the mother. If you have a Jewish mother, you are automatically Jewish. Otherwise, you need to go through a formal conversion process, which lots of people do.

Now what is interesting about it, and what folks like you certainly won’t like, is why Judaism is a more closed religion than others. Cause it wasn’t, way back in the day.

Of course, that had to change when Jews had their homeland destroyed and they were forced to live at the sufferance of other religious majorities that were very intolerant of any religions that challenged their power structure.

The best way the Jews could ensure their survival in the Christian and later Muslim world was to have the religion reform to not actively seek converts and to not appear to be a threat to reduce the numbers of the majority population.

I’m sure you have some racist explanation for how you feel about the Rabbinate using DNA (which does in fact do a good job at tracing Ashkenazi heritage because of the impacts of Christian domination over the centuries) to confirm people have Jewish ancestry in the absence of other established documentation, but it says far more about you than you think it says about the Jews.
 
truthatallcost said:
DNA purity tests for Judaism. One doesn't need to make a substantial argument for why this is wrong, do they?
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It is obviously more bogus racism, just like the Aryan myth.
 
Jean-s said:
It is obviously more bogus racism, just like the Aryan myth.
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Or it is a mirror that causes antisemites to lose their minds with irrational hatred and to go off on nonsensical tangents about those racist Jews.

You know, one or the other.
 
Fledermaus said:
How can a DNA test be "bogus"?
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I'm guessing he has a thing about "Jewish Supremacy" or some other such nonsense stemming from his commanding understanding of the Jews.
 
CJ 2.0 said:
It’s not complicated. Religious identity is inherited through the mother. If you have a Jewish mother, you are automatically Jewish. Otherwise, you need to go through a formal conversion process, which lots of people do.

Now what is interesting about it, and what folks like you certainly won’t like, is why Judaism is a more closed religion than others. Cause it wasn’t, way back in the day.

Of course, that had to change when Jews had their homeland destroyed and they were forced to live at the sufferance of other religious majorities that were very intolerant of any religions that challenged their power structure.

The best way the Jews could ensure their survival in the Christian and later Muslim world was to have the religion reform to not actively seek converts and to not appear to be a threat to reduce the numbers of the majority population.

I’m sure you have some racist explanation for how you feel about the Rabbinate using DNA (which does in fact do a good job at tracing Ashkenazi heritage because of the impacts of Christian domination over the centuries) to confirm people have Jewish ancestry in the absence of other established documentation, but it says far more about you than you think it says about the Jews.
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As it turns out, you decided not to answer my question in an honest, straightforward way, to the surprise of no one!

I looked into it- the DNA tests conducted by the rabbinate are used for a variety of reasons, one of which is marriage. Marriage in Israel must be approved by the rabbinate, if both parties are Jewish, and inter-religious marriages are not sanctioned. So DNA tests are used to prove that someone is Jewish, if they are seeking to marry a Jew. Very sneaky.
 
CJ 2.0 said:
Or it is a mirror that causes antisemites to lose their minds with irrational hatred and to go off on nonsensical tangents about those racist Jews.

You know, one or the other.
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Double standards, hypocrisy, and subterfuge define you.
 
truthatallcost said:
As it turns out, you decided not to answer my question in an honest, straightforward way, to the surprise of no one!

I looked into it- the DNA tests conducted by the rabbinate are used for a variety of reasons, one of which is marriage. Marriage in Israel must be approved by the rabbinate, if both parties are Jewish, and inter-religious marriages are not sanctioned. So DNA tests are used to prove that someone is Jewish, if they are seeking to marry a Jew. Very sneaky.
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If you knew as much about Israel as you believe you do, you'd also know that the system of infra-religious marriage (IOW between two people of the same faith) being conducted only under the auspices of the religious community to which the couple belongs (thus also forming the only religious recognition), is not limited to Jews but to other religious denomination as well.

What's more, that particular instrument was not implemented by the State of Israel as a "first", but dates back to Ottoman rule. The British Mandate maintained it without any modification and Israel, upon its founding, followed suit.

What you fail to grasp in the answer you were given, however, remains as much a mystery as your insinuation that it lacks straight-forwardness or honesty.

As much as your accusation of "sneaky" defies comprehension.
 
Chagos said:
If you knew as much about Israel as you believe you do, you'd also know that the system of infra-religious marriage (IOW between two people of the same faith) being conducted only under the auspices of the religious community to which the couple belongs (thus also forming the only religious recognition), is not limited to Jews but to other religious denomination as well.

What's more, that particular instrument was not implemented by the State of Israel as a "first", but dates back to Ottoman rule. The British Mandate maintained it without any modification and Israel, upon its founding, followed suit.

What you fail to grasp in the answer you were given, however, remains as much a mystery as your insinuation that it lacks straight-forwardness or honesty.

As much as your accusation of "sneaky" defies comprehension.
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There's always an excuse which centers upon placing blame for abhorrent practices upon others. Israel has street posters which promote phone hotlines that Jews are encouraged to call if they spot a Jewish girl mingling with an Arab boy. These are not illegal. Who shall we blame for those Chagos, the Ottomans ? British?
 
truthatallcost said:
There's always an excuse which centers upon placing blame for abhorrent practices upon others. Israel has street posters which promote phone hotlines that Jews are encouraged to call if they spot a Jewish girl mingling with an Arab boy. These are not illegal. Who shall we blame for those Chagos, the Ottomans ? British?
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Well, start a thread on it, seeing how it has absolutely nothing to do with what I outlined.
 
truthatallcost said:
I already did.

https://www.debatepolitics.com/middle-east/341596-meet-jewish-alt-right-israel.html?highlight=Lehava

In fact you commented on it, where you downplayed the relevance of the practice, with some ridiculous argument that 'everyone knows Israel prohibits miscegenation, no big deal'. Hot garbage.
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So when you can't come up with anything pertinent to the previous posts, you just have to resort to lying again.

Well, no surprise really to anyone accustomed to your antics.

Good thing with you (always) is being released from having to point out not having done anything of the sort of what you claim, seeing how your claim is defined by your reputation already. IOW if you say it was so, most know by now that it's a lie.
 
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truthatallcost said:
As it turns out, you decided not to answer my question in an honest, straightforward way, to the surprise of no one!

I looked into it- the DNA tests conducted by the rabbinate are used for a variety of reasons, one of which is marriage. Marriage in Israel must be approved by the rabbinate, if both parties are Jewish, and inter-religious marriages are not sanctioned. So DNA tests are used to prove that someone is Jewish, if they are seeking to marry a Jew. Very sneaky.
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Yeah. Super sneaky. There is no civil marriage in israel. So not really sneaky at all. Just ordinary state dysfunction.

But about what I would expect from you in terms of where your mind goes. Seems to live there a lot.
 
CJ 2.0 said:
Yeah. Super sneaky. There is no civil marriage in israel. So not really sneaky at all. Just ordinary state dysfunction.

But about what I would expect from you in terms of where your mind goes. Seems to live there a lot.
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'State dysfunction' which gels perfectly with the mainstream view of American Zionists, who constantly say that Israel is just so darn unique in the world, that they have to be allowed to operate according to an ethnocentric way that promotes segregation, ethnic/religious nationalism, and intolerance of all of the social justice that we in the West must follow. Very sneaky indeed.

It's funny that when you avoid answering a simple question in an honest, straightforward manner, that I become suspicious of your intent. Funny how that works, isn't it?
 
Chagos said:
So when you can't come up with anything pertinent to the previous posts, you just have to resort to lying again.

Well, no surprise really to anyone accustomed to your antics.

Good thing with you (always) is being released from having to point out not having done anything of the sort of what you claim, seeing how your claim is defined by your reputation already. IOW if you say it was so, most know by now that it's a lie.
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You view the truth as a lie. Not my problem.
 
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