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Perhaps a Million Iraqis March to Tell US/Foreign Military Forces to Leave Iraq.

Evilroddy

Evilroddy

Pragmatic, pugilistic, prancing, porcine politico.
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A "million-man march" by Shi'a Iraqis organised by the anti-foreign interference Shi'a cleric Muqtada al-Sadr which just took place in Baghdad is demanding US and other foreign military forces leave Iraqi territory immediately.

Huge rally as Iraqis demand US troops pull out - BBC News

What will US and other foreign military forces do? The Iraqi Parliament has passed a non-binding resolution ordering US and other foreign military forces out of Iraq ASAP. The care-taker Prime Minister of Iraq has ordered US forces out by the end of 2020. Hundreds of thousands (perhaps a million) Iraqis have marched to support the expulsions just outside the Green Zone. The US Secty of State and the US Secty of Defence as well as the US President have said that US military forces will not leave Iraq while foreign military forces are preparing to leave.

Will the US militarily occupy Iraq in contravention of the 2014 agreement with Iraq to readmit* US forces to fight ISIL and the Islamic Caliphate? Will an Iraqi insurrgency and resistence begin to target US forces?

What's President Trump's game-plan in Iraq?

The word "readmit" is asterixed because the US Forces never really left as inflated embassy and consulate protection forces plus US-paid military contractors (mercenaries) remainded in force after the 2011 "US pull-out".

Cheers.
Evilroddy.
 
Last edited:
I'm certain that Germans wanted American military forces to leave Germany at the end of WW2 too.
 
Evilroddy said:
Will the US militarily occupy Iraq in contravention of the 2014 agreement with Iraq to readmit* US forces to fight ISIL and the Islamic Caliphate? Will an Iraqi insurrgency and resistence begin to target US forces?
Click to expand...
Yes, and yes.

Silly rabbit. Pax is for kids. :)
 
Evilroddy said:
A "million-man march" by Shi'a Iraqis organised by the anti-foreign interference Shi'a cleric Muqtada al-Sadr which just took place in Baghdad is demanding US and other foreign military forces leave Iraqi territory immediately.

Huge rally as Iraqis demand US troops pull out - BBC News

What will US and other foreign military forces do? The Iraqi Parliament has passed a non-binding resolution ordering US and other foreign military forces out of Iraq ASAP. The care-taker Prime Minister of Iraq has ordered US forces out by the end of 2020. Hundreds of thousands (perhaps a million) Iraqis have marched to support the expulsions just outside the Green Zone. The US Secty of State and the US Secty of Defence as well as the US President have said that US military forces will not leave Iraq while foreign military forces are preparing to leave.

Will the US militarily occupy Iraq in contravention of the 2014 agreement with Iraq to readmit* US forces to fight ISIL and the Islamic Caliphate? Will an Iraqi insurrgency and resistence begin to target US forces?

What's President Trump's game-plan in Iraq?

The word "readmit" is asterixed because the US Forces never really left as inflated embassy and consulate protection forces plus US-paid military contractors (mercenaries) remainded in force after the 2011 "US pull-out".

Cheers.
Evilroddy.
Click to expand...

Trump's original "game plan" was to pull out of the Middle East entirely. Starting with Syria immediately after the defeat of ISIS, followed by Afghanistan, and Iraq.

Who howled about it back then? Military leaders, Democrats, Republicans...seemed like everyone in government except Trump thought it was a "bad idea."

IMO he wants to get out, but not be "driven out."

I'd say he will wait until things simmer down, to show he isn't compelled by Iran, Iraq, or anyone...then in his own time simply start a phased withdrawal.

That's my hope anyway, as one of the first things he does either just before the 2020 election, or shortly after (if it happens) re-election.
 
joko104 said:
I'm certain that Germans wanted American military forces to leave Germany at the end of WW2 too.
Click to expand...

Joko104:

In WWII Nazi Germany declared war on the United States of America. In the 2003 the USA invaded Iraq based on a calculated campaign of deception and false causi belli. The USA was the aggressor in the 2003 war and did not have proper and legal Congressional or international authorisation to wage the war. Finally WWII predates the UN Charter which banned aggressive war but the 2003 Invasion post dates that Charter, which the US signed on to, by 55 years.

Cheers.
Evilroddy.
 
Trump is the least likely to stay in Iraq if the government officially requests it pack up and go. I doubt, however, the majority mean what they posture - they know damn well what foreign forces will ignore their request and who won't.

But save for protecting the Kurds, the rest of Iraq can go to hell if that is what they choose. Americans are fed up with dealing with a people whose religion, culture, and perhaps inante biology preclude any other form of social cohesion except that which is enforced by a ruthless dictator.

I'm sure there is a new Saddam Hussein in the wings, just licking his chops.
 
maxparrish said:
Trump is the least likely to stay in Iraq if the government officially requests it pack up and go. I doubt, however, the majority mean what they posture - they know damn well what foreign forces will ignore their request and who won't.

But save for protecting the Kurds, the rest of Iraq can go to hell if that is what they choose. Americans are fed up with dealing with a people whose religion, culture, and perhaps inante biology preclude any other form of social cohesion except that which is enforced by a ruthless dictator.

I'm sure there is a new Saddam Hussein in the wings, just licking his chops.
Click to expand...

Maxparrish:

Dictators are in vogue in Washington these days. The Saudis, El-Sisi's Egypt, Duterte's Philippines, Kim Jong-Un's N. Korea, Victor Orban's Hungary, Xi's China, Modi's India, and of course Putin's Russia are all respected regimes in the eyes of the US Head of State. Why should Iraq be any different to all these other states?

Cheers.
Evilroddy.
 
Hopefully Trump will take this opportunity to get us the hell out of there. And while we are at it, get the hell out of Afghanistan too.
 
Evilroddy said:
Joko104:

In WWII Nazi Germany declared war on the United States of America. In the 2003 the USA invaded Iraq based on a calculated campaign of deception and false causi belli. The USA was the aggressor in the 2003 war and did not have proper and legal Congressional or international authorisation to wage the war. Finally WWII predates the UN Charter which banned aggressive war but the 2003 Invasion post dates that Charter, which the US signed on to, by 55 years.

Cheers.
Evilroddy.
Click to expand...

Didn't congress actually vote to invade Iraq? I keep hearing it was a horrible decision by Joe Biden from Bernie Sanders.
 
charliebrown said:
Didn't congress actually vote to invade Iraq? I keep hearing it was a horrible decision by Joe Biden from Bernie Sanders.
Click to expand...

chaliebrown:

The Congress voted to allow the President to use military force to remove the Regime of Saddam Hussein. Whether this amounted to a declaration of war is still a hotly debated issue. The justifications for the use of military force were about 1/3 false, 1/3 very debatable and 1/3 true. The scope of the military intervention was also debatable as was the need for international authorisation before a full-blown war could be started. Congress authorised no funds to pay for and support such a war. To date it remains an unfunded military operation. So the case that the AUMF of 2002 authorised whole scale war is debatable.

Cheers.
Evilroddy.
 
Evilroddy said:
A "million-man march" by Shi'a Iraqis organised by the anti-foreign interference Shi'a cleric Muqtada al-Sadr which just took place in Baghdad is demanding US and other foreign military forces leave Iraqi territory immediately.

Huge rally as Iraqis demand US troops pull out - BBC News

What will US and other foreign military forces do? The Iraqi Parliament has passed a non-binding resolution ordering US and other foreign military forces out of Iraq ASAP. The care-taker Prime Minister of Iraq has ordered US forces out by the end of 2020. Hundreds of thousands (perhaps a million) Iraqis have marched to support the expulsions just outside the Green Zone. The US Secty of State and the US Secty of Defence as well as the US President have said that US military forces will not leave Iraq while foreign military forces are preparing to leave.

Will the US militarily occupy Iraq in contravention of the 2014 agreement with Iraq to readmit* US forces to fight ISIL and the Islamic Caliphate? Will an Iraqi insurrgency and resistence begin to target US forces?

What's President Trump's game-plan in Iraq?

The word "readmit" is asterixed because the US Forces never really left as inflated embassy and consulate protection forces plus US-paid military contractors (mercenaries) remainded in force after the 2011 "US pull-out".

Cheers.
Evilroddy.
Click to expand...

Lol.

You think trump has a game plan.
 
joko104 said:
I'm certain that Germans wanted American military forces to leave Germany at the end of WW2 too.
Click to expand...

Are you. What do you think was stopping the Soviet Union from overrunning all of western Europe? Basically, that's what the Normandy invasions were about, stopping Russia.
You need to read some history. Russia won that war, so emphatically that they came out owning half of Europe and the Allies were just there to stop them owning all of it.
Here's something someone so ignorant of history might not know- one of the shining moments in US history, one of the moments when America lived up to it's self-perception, came when Krushchev blockaded Berlin and Kennedy ordered it supplied by air. Google "Berlin airlift". Google "Ich bin ein Berliner!"
And don't kid yourself. Every German then knew the value of the Allied troops in West Germany.
 
Evilroddy said:
chaliebrown:

The Congress voted to allow the President to use military force to remove the Regime of Saddam Hussein. Whether this amounted to a declaration of war is still a hotly debated issue. The justifications for the use of military force were about 1/3 false, 1/3 very debatable and 1/3 true. The scope of the military intervention was also debatable as was the need for international authorisation before a full-blown war could be started. Congress authorised no funds to pay for and support such a war. To date it remains an unfunded military operation. So the case that the AUMF of 2002 authorised whole scale war is debatable.

Cheers.
Evilroddy.
Click to expand...


I agree they did not vote for war, but they did vote for the use of force and as soon as they did that, they pretty much voted for the use of force to keep the country stable and clean up the mess we would make.

We live in a country that has a military complex. This military complex requires conflict to thrive. They will do anything to sustain that complex.
 
Iraq needs a bloodbath.
 
Iraq is finding out like other nations that imperialism doesn't come cheap from the US..
 
Grand Mal said:
Are you. What do you think was stopping the Soviet Union from overrunning all of western Europe? Basically, that's what the Normandy invasions were about, stopping Russia.
You need to read some history. Russia won that war, so emphatically that they came out owning half of Europe and the Allies were just there to stop them owning all of it.
Here's something someone so ignorant of history might not know- one of the shining moments in US history, one of the moments when America lived up to it's self-perception, came when Krushchev blockaded Berlin and Kennedy ordered it supplied by air. Google "Berlin airlift". Google "Ich bin ein Berliner!"
And don't kid yourself. Every German then knew the value of the Allied troops in West Germany.
Click to expand...
Truman not Kennedy.
 
joko104 said:
I'm certain that Germans wanted American military forces to leave Germany at the end of WW2 too.
Click to expand...

Actually, no. We we're the only thing saving Germany from becoming another vassal in the Soviet empire. Our presence in Germany helped facilitate the second 'economic miracle' of the 20th century; the West German economy roared back to life, while Soviet controlled East Germany languished in poverty.

Human skid mark Alan Dershowitz wrote in his book Chutzpah, that the US should have kept the whole of Germany in poverty for an entire generation, as punishment for the holocaust. This was exactly the strategy that was used after WW1, and precipitated the holocaust.
 
Evilroddy said:
A "million-man march" by Shi'a Iraqis organised by the anti-foreign interference Shi'a cleric Muqtada al-Sadr which just took place in Baghdad is demanding US and other foreign military forces leave Iraqi territory immediately.

Huge rally as Iraqis demand US troops pull out - BBC News

What will US and other foreign military forces do? The Iraqi Parliament has passed a non-binding resolution ordering US and other foreign military forces out of Iraq ASAP. The care-taker Prime Minister of Iraq has ordered US forces out by the end of 2020. Hundreds of thousands (perhaps a million) Iraqis have marched to support the expulsions just outside the Green Zone. The US Secty of State and the US Secty of Defence as well as the US President have said that US military forces will not leave Iraq while foreign military forces are preparing to leave.

Will the US militarily occupy Iraq in contravention of the 2014 agreement with Iraq to readmit* US forces to fight ISIL and the Islamic Caliphate? Will an Iraqi insurrgency and resistence begin to target US forces?

What's President Trump's game-plan in Iraq?

The word "readmit" is asterixed because the US Forces never really left as inflated embassy and consulate protection forces plus US-paid military contractors (mercenaries) remainded in force after the 2011 "US pull-out".

Cheers.
Evilroddy.
Click to expand...

2003- US invaded Iraq vowing to establish democracy
2020- Iraq's democracy clearly wants us to leave

We should leave. We won't leave of course, because we're only over there to protect oil and Israel.
 
truthatallcost said:
2003- US invaded Iraq vowing to establish democracy
2020- Iraq's democracy clearly wants us to leave

We should leave. We won't leave of course, because we're only over there to protect oil and Israel.
Click to expand...

TAAC:

Regrettably, I think you are correct in this conclusion, for the most part. I think more than oil and the State of Israel are involved, such as Saudi Arabian security and regional hegemony, but no doubt both oil and the State of Israel factor into American military and foreign policy calculus too, as does containing Eurasian power.

Evilroddy
 
jamesbyoung said:
1948 Truman Berlin Airlift

1972 Kennedy Cuban Blockade
Click to expand...

Jamesbyoung:

1948 1948-49) is in the ball park but 1972 is a decade too late for the Cuban Missile Crisis.

Cheers.
Evilroddy.
 
Fletch said:
Hopefully Trump will take this opportunity to get us the hell out of there. And while we are at it, get the hell out of Afghanistan too.
Click to expand...

Yeup, I would include the entire ME other than embassy security and a rapid deployment force to defend them if needed. Way past time we packed and took our men and women out if harms way.
 
charliebrown said:
Didn't congress actually vote to invade Iraq? I keep hearing it was a horrible decision by Joe Biden from Bernie Sanders.
Click to expand...

No, it did not.

In fact, Congress gave the President a blanket authorization to use military force.

The Republicans were still pretending that Bush wasn’t going to start a war, and DeLay and Hastert were giving empty assertions that no military action would take place unless Iraq was declared in breach of the inspections regime.

As the winter of 2003 turned into spring, and it became more and more obvious that mushroom clouds, weapons of mass destruction or iminent threat to the US only existed in the imaginations of Dick Cheney, and Donald Rumsfeld, the need to accelerate starting the war became more apparent before the American public started to get wise to the fact that none of this noise that was being blasted on talk radio and Fox (and by Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rice, Lutti, Faith, Wolfowitz and Pearle) was actually true (as it turned out not to be).

So, in order for Bush to start his war, he first started to try and railroad the UN into supporting the war. When it became apparent that France, Russia and Germany were competing over who would veto the resolution (one of the very few times that a UN resolution was vetoed by a US ally), Bush abruptly changed course and started the war.
 
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