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Russian IL-20 shot down by Syria as Israel used it as cover for attack

Westphalian

Westphalian

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https://www.rt.com/news/438686-syria-russia-s200-il20/

“The Israeli pilots used the Russian plane as cover and set it up to be targeted by the Syrian air defense forces. As a consequence, the Il-20, which has radar cross-section much larger than the F-16, was shot down by an S-200 system missile,” the statement said.

The Russian ministry said the Israelis must have known that the Russian plane was present in the area, but this did not stop them from executing “the provocation.” Israel also failed to warn Russia about the planned operation in advance. The warning came just a minute before the attack started, which “did not leave time to move the Russian plane to a safe area,” the statement said.
 
Nonsense. Russia should know that such mistakes and friendly fire from their Syrian puppets can happen as long as they are deeply involved in the Syrian war zone.
 
oops. :neutral:


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The relevant point here is that Israel failed to provide Russia adequate warning of their strike, which breaches whatever agreement they have by which Rusia does not engage Israeli aircraft. Moreover, Israel was conducting another illegal act of aggression which Russia has tolerated to date, but I suspect no longer.

The consequences of this for Israel will not be good.
 
And again, nonsense. Russia can only blame their Syrian puppets. Israel continues to engage in defensive measures that fall in line with its security needs, not illegal and not "aggression".
 
'Defensive measures' do not entail repeatedly striking another state with missiles. Maybe Russia needs to take 'defensive measures' against Israeli airbases. No .......... It doesn't work like that in your world of double standards? What a surprise :roll:

Israel appears to have deliberately used the reconnaissance plane as cover for its fighters to carry out their illegal act of aggression on Syria.

This incident is serious, I read this strongly into official and unofficial channels, and it will not go unanswered. A high tech plane and the lives of 15 servicemen will require a response beyond words.
 
Westphalian said:
The relevant point here is that Israel failed to provide Russia adequate warning of their strike, which breaches whatever agreement they have by which Rusia does not engage Israeli aircraft. Moreover, Israel was conducting another illegal act of aggression which Russia has tolerated to date, but I suspect no longer.

The consequences of this for Israel will not be good.
Click to expand...

Or the consequences may be better as it turned out with Turkey.
 
Coin said:
Or the consequences may be better as it turned out with Turkey.
Click to expand...


But the Israeli and Russian militaries had a good working relationship prior to this fiasco. And Israel is not Turkey.

The most serious claim is that Israel effectively used the IL-20 as cover for its jets. If true, that is the end of a working relationship.

I don't see how this can go without consequences. Too many people have died and a high value aircraft has been lost.
 
Westphalian said:
'Defensive measures' do not entail repeatedly striking another state with missiles. Maybe Russia needs to take 'defensive measures' against Israeli airbases. No .......... It doesn't work like that in your world of double standards? What a surprise :roll:

Israel appears to have deliberately used the reconnaissance plane as cover for its fighters to carry out their illegal act of aggression on Syria.

This incident is serious, I read this strongly into official and unofficial channels, and it will not go unanswered. A high tech plane and the lives of 15 servicemen will require a response beyond words.
Click to expand...

Actually defensive measures do entail that and that is why they exist and will continue as was made clear to the Russian administration from the beginning of their military involvement in Syria.
Israel's actions originate in its security needs which is something that cannot be said about the Russian presence in the region.
Contrary to your suggestion Russia will not go to war with a power like Israel over this for obvious reasons.

There's nothing to suggest, anyway, that Israel planned the Russian puppets' incompetence that led to the lost of the plane and its crew. That's absurd.
 
Welcome to the absolute quagmire also known as the Middle East, and we should bottom line this for everyone's sake here at DP.

We have a multiple way civil war in Syria that in one way or another has been going on for over 7 years.

Russia is protecting their vested interests and ally al-Assad in control in Syria. Anyone that stands against al-Assad is a target in Syria by Russia.

The US has a vested interest in Israel and Iraq (let that sink in a little) as well as other "allies" such as Saudi Arabia and Turkey (let that sink in a little.) Turkey has ground operations in Syria every now and then to satisfy their interests in harming the Kurds, who the US as off and on supported (again, let that sink in a little.)

Iran has long been a supporter of Hezbollah in Syria, and as no surprise Hezbollah and their "Shiite proxy from Iran" support al-Assad. That puts Russia in bed with Syria and Iran at the same time (which should surprise no one) as we basically have Iran looking to ensure al-Assad control over Syria.

Then we have poor picked on Israel who conducts air operations in Syria targeting Hezbollah, as in the hundreds of air operations calling them attacking Iran advancement on Israel. And of course we have Iran who time and time again calls for Israel to be "wiped off the face of the Earth" (or something like that.)

Presumably Israel and Russia have a "dedicated and open line" between them when conducting operation in Syria (let that sink in a little) but Israel decided not to tell them about this mission, or at least waited until the last minute. Sources vary on this.

So... now we get this latest event where Israeli F-16's are on a strike mission in Syria, end up fired on by Syria, but the missile ends up hitting a Russian reconnaissance aircraft the Israeli F-16's used to evade. Syria ends up killing a bunch of Russians to defend Hezbollah.

This is beyond stupid... just stupid.
 
Apocalypse said:
Actually defensive measures do entail that and that is why they exist and will continue as was made clear to the Russian administration from the beginning of their military involvement in Syria.
Israel's actions originate in its security needs which is something that cannot be said about the Russian presence in the region.
Contrary to your suggestion Russia will not go to war with a power like Israel over this for obvious reasons.

There's nothing to suggest, anyway, that Israel planned the Russian puppets' incompetence that led to the lost of the plane and its crew. That's absurd.
Click to expand...

I never suggested Russia would 'go to war' over this because it obviously will not. What I said is there would be consequences. If you're going to mis-represent me then you're a troll.

As for your contention that Israel's actions are justified based on its security needs, then that is a short cut to global hell if all states took that line of reasoning.
 
Westphalian said:
I never suggested Russia would 'go to war' over this because it obviously will not. What I said is there would be consequences. If you're going to mis-represent me then you're a troll.

As for your contention that Israel's actions are justified based on its security needs, then that is a short cut to global hell if all states took that line of reasoning.
Click to expand...

If all states took that line of reasoning there'd be far less many wars. Acting because you have to is a whole lot different than what Russia is doing in Syria for example.
 
Westphalian said:
https://www.rt.com/news/438686-syria-russia-s200-il20/

“The Israeli pilots used the Russian plane as cover and set it up to be targeted by the Syrian air defense forces. As a consequence, the Il-20, which has radar cross-section much larger than the F-16, was shot down by an S-200 system missile,” the statement said.

The Russian ministry said the Israelis must have known that the Russian plane was present in the area, but this did not stop them from executing “the provocation.” Israel also failed to warn Russia about the planned operation in advance. The warning came just a minute before the attack started, which “did not leave time to move the Russian plane to a safe area,” the statement said.
Click to expand...

War is hell.
 
Apocalypse said:
Nonsense. Russia should know that such mistakes and friendly fire from their Syrian puppets can happen as long as they are deeply involved in the Syrian war zone.
Click to expand...

That neither explains nor absolves the presence of Israeli aircraft in sovereign Syrian airspace. The Israelis will regret this.
/
 
Apocalypse said:
And again, nonsense. Russia can only blame their Syrian puppets. Israel continues to engage in defensive measures that fall in line with its security needs, not illegal and not "aggression".
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That statement is a odiferous pile of grimy, green, gooey, gopher grunt.
/
 
DaveFagan said:
That neither explains nor absolves the presence of Israeli aircraft in sovereign Syrian airspace. The Israelis will regret this.
/
Click to expand...

Israel has the right to defend itself and your opinion is duly noted.
 
Westphalian said:
https://www.rt.com/news/438686-syria-russia-s200-il20/

“The Israeli pilots used the Russian plane as cover and set it up to be targeted by the Syrian air defense forces. As a consequence, the Il-20, which has radar cross-section much larger than the F-16, was shot down by an S-200 system missile,” the statement said.

The Russian ministry said the Israelis must have known that the Russian plane was present in the area, but this did not stop them from executing “the provocation.” Israel also failed to warn Russia about the planned operation in advance. The warning came just a minute before the attack started, which “did not leave time to move the Russian plane to a safe area,” the statement said.
Click to expand...

A Russian proxy shoots down the wrong target.... At least it wasn't Russian forces shooting down another airliner.
 
I don't think anything major will come of this.

The Russian Government thus far has indicated while they believe the Israelis are at fault, the ultimate cause of the issue was a technical malfunction of a Syrian SAM targeting the wrong jet.

Probably some not nice words and barbs tossed, then a half-hearted apology by Tel Aviv, and then business as usual. Israel and Russia have too many mutually shared interests to let this develop into something serious.
 
Fledermaus said:
One word explains Israel in Syria.

HEZBOLLAH....
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A few words describe "moderate rebel" White Helmet headchoppers in Syria. Israel is attacking Shiites and the terrorists/headchoppers are Sunnis. There exists a huge tapestry of misinformation/disinformation/agenda narrative as regards anything Syria. It is woven by Western MSM (Massive Syrian Misinformation).
/
 
Fledermaus said:
Spoken like a six year old.

Well done.
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To refer to the statement as a simple lie would have been inadequate. Your dropping is noted. Please wipe.
/
 
DaveFagan said:
A few words describe "moderate rebel" White Helmet headchoppers in Syria. Israel is attacking Shiites and the terrorists/headchoppers are Sunnis. There exists a huge tapestry of misinformation/disinformation/agenda narrative as regards anything Syria. It is woven by Western MSM (Massive Syrian Misinformation).
/
Click to expand...

Why do you insist on lying?

And what does your lying rant have to do with the post quoted?
 
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