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Young Iraqis Overwhelmingly Consider US Their Enemy Poll Says

Tigerace117 said:
"Most militaristic state in the history of mankind"

I think the USSR, Nazi Germany, Imperial Japan, the Roman Empire, Napoleon's France and more than a few others are all good contenders for that spot.
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And Contemporary America is not?

Tigerace117 said:
Not even to mention the fact that many of these countries don't have to spend a lot on the militaries because American troops are stationed in country or simply can't afford it.
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coldjoint said:
That is the root cause of the problem. Islam teaches hate for non-Muslims. It is a fact proven by their holy litrature, history, and Islam inspired present day terror.
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Notice how you have shifted your argument from geo-political reasons to now, "Its those damn Mooslims!".

Try dealing with it because denying it is the cop out.
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So its Islam you say? The simplistic thought that its religion?
Okay, this is what I pointed out to an earlier poster...
""Young Arabs are more divided in their
perceptions of the United States, with 63 per
cent saying they consider it an ally versus 32
per cent who view it an enemy. Perceptions
of the US are particularly strong in the GCC
where 85 per cent say it is an ally. " https://theintercept.com/wp-uploads/sites/1/2016/04/2016-AYS-White-Paper-EN_12042016100316.pdf

Well golly gee, the whole religious arguments just doesnt hold any water...
 
Tigerace117 said:
For one thing, they'd be in Libya or Afghanistan or Somalia, not Iraq, so in one regard that is true---they'd be shifted over a couple thousand miles.
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Well technically cells who have said they are part of ISIS are in those places.. And for another, other Islamist groups have started to fill the void in that region.. So, your point is what?

The moral of the story, in other words, is don't start pulling troops out until you've absolutely annihalted the opposition. Don't leave them an organizational frame work to rebuild
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Ahhh so now your going with the whole argument it was the "pull out" that caused ISIS
1.)This predates the pull out as presented earlier
2.)It was not the pull out that lead to the situation Iraq is currently in... See the post you just quoted
3.)GEN. WESLEY CLARK: I don’t think that keeping a few thousand troops in Iraq would have stopped ISIS. And it wouldn’t have fixed the Iraqi forces.
Gen. Wesley Clark: Staying Longer In Iraq Wouldn?t Have Made A Difference | Colmes Quarters
4.)Im gonna guess you have left your original argument of just blaming this on "ignorant youths"?
 
TheDemSocialist said:
Well technically cells who have said they are part of ISIS are in those places.. And for another, other Islamist groups have started to fill the void in that region.. So, your point is what?


Ahhh so now your going with the whole argument it was the "pull out" that caused ISIS
1.)This predates the pull out as presented earlier
2.)It was not the pull out that lead to the situation Iraq is currently in... See the post you just quoted
3.)GEN. WESLEY CLARK: I don’t think that keeping a few thousand troops in Iraq would have stopped ISIS. And it wouldn’t have fixed the Iraqi forces.
Gen. Wesley Clark: Staying Longer In Iraq Wouldn?t Have Made A Difference | Colmes Quarters
4.)Im gonna guess you have left your original argument of just blaming this on "ignorant youths"?
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Oh sure. More than a few of this is from ignorant youth. But the facts remain that without the pullout things wouldn't have gotten as bad as they have been. A few thousand troops may not have made much of a difference but we certainly had more than just a few thousand troops in the region beforehand. Not to mention US forces could have provided "stiffener" for the Iraqi troops.
 
TheDemSocialist said:
Read more @: Young Iraqis Overwhelmingly Consider US Their Enemy Poll Says

The eruption of joy that never came... Apparently if your country is bombed, invaded and occupied those being bombed and occupied dont like the country doing the bombing and occupying. [/FONT][/COLOR]
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I don't suppose it ever occurred to you that these opinions have formed or solidified over the last 8 years--you know, that time during which Obama was president and in control of the nations foreign policy. If Iraq is just as bad today as it was when Obama took office--if not worse--then Obama is a failed president. Time for you to try and wrap your brain around that. Best of luck
 
Tigerace117 said:
Oh sure. More than a few of this is from ignorant youth. But the facts remain that without the pullout things wouldn't have gotten as bad as they have been. A few thousand troops may not have made much of a difference but we certainly had more than just a few thousand troops in the region beforehand. Not to mention US forces could have provided "stiffener" for the Iraqi troops.
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Or... The u.s troops would have been part of the rout.
 
Tigerace117 said:
Oh sure. More than a few of this is from ignorant youth. But the facts remain that without the pullout things wouldn't have gotten as bad as they have been. A few thousand troops may not have made much of a difference but we certainly had more than just a few thousand troops in the region beforehand. Not to mention US forces could have provided "stiffener" for the Iraqi troops.
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Let me point out this again:
1.)ISIS still predates the pullout
2.)GEN. WESLEY CLARK: I don’t think that keeping a few thousand troops in Iraq would have stopped ISIS. And it wouldn’t have fixed the Iraqi forces.
3.)This is more than simply just about ISIS. This is about the reasons for a strong distaste among Iraqis of American government policy
 
Fletch said:
I don't suppose it ever occurred to you that these opinions have formed or solidified over the last 8 years--you know, that time during which Obama was president and in control of the nations foreign policy. If Iraq is just as bad today as it was when Obama took office--if not worse--then Obama is a failed president. Time for you to try and wrap your brain around that. Best of luck
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As I pointed out earlier. This predates the past 8 years.
http://www.debatepolitics.com/middl...s-their-enemy-poll-says-4.html#post1065766656
 
TheDemSocialist said:
Notice how you have shifted your argument from geo-political reasons to now, "Its those damn Mooslims!".


So its Islam you say? The simplistic thought that its religion?
Okay, this is what I pointed out to an earlier poster...
""Young Arabs are more divided in their
perceptions of the United States, with 63 per
cent saying they consider it an ally versus 32
per cent who view it an enemy. Perceptions
of the US are particularly strong in the GCC
where 85 per cent say it is an ally. " https://theintercept.com/wp-uploads/sites/1/2016/04/2016-AYS-White-Paper-EN_12042016100316.pdf

Well golly gee, the whole religious arguments just doesnt hold any water...
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No water. Blood. Hey, Hey, He get off of your cloud.
 
Unitedwestand13 said:
Or... The u.s troops would have been part of the rout.
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TheDemSocialist said:
Let me point out this again:
1.)ISIS still predates the pullout
2.)GEN. WESLEY CLARK: I don’t think that keeping a few thousand troops in Iraq would have stopped ISIS. And it wouldn’t have fixed the Iraqi forces.
3.)This is more than simply just about ISIS. This is about the reasons for a strong distaste among Iraqis of American government policy
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Funny joke. ISIS couldn't rout US forces if they had a hundred million men. This isn't the ****ing Waffen SS--- it's a bunch of spoiled brats who only know how to fight one way.

General Clark doesn't think US troops could have changed things, but who knows. That's just his guess.
 
Tigerace117 said:
General Clark doesn't think US troops could have changed things, but who knows. That's just his guess.
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Again, your still only focusing one part of the argument..... Its like a point by point break down with you, only able to handle one point at a time.
 
Tigerace117 said:
Funny joke. ISIS couldn't rout US forces if they had a hundred million men. This isn't the ****ing Waffen SS--- it's a bunch of spoiled brats who only know how to fight one way.

General Clark doesn't think US troops could have changed things, but who knows. That's just his guess.
Click to expand...

So Isis is the devil incarnate and should be defeated at all cost, but it's forces are a joke that can not beat the U.S. In military battles?
 
TheDemSocialist said:
Again, your still only focusing one part of the argument..... Its like a point by point break down with you, only able to handle one point at a time.
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One part of the argument that is the argument. The reason they hate us is the religion/ideology they learn from childhood. It is not a mystery that depends on a given political situation. Until the religion reforms or ceases to be they will hate the West(and non-Muslims). And polls show the majority of the ME support everything that makes Islam incompatible with freedom, even limited freedom.

Like Sharia, punishment for blasphemy, and honor killing.
 
coldjoint said:
One part of the argument that is the argument.
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One part of the argument is only one part of the argument... Its not the whole argument.

The reason they hate us is the religion/ideology they learn from childhood. It is not a mystery that depends on a given political situation. Until the religion reforms or ceases to be they will hate the West(and non-Muslims). And polls show the majority of the ME support everything that makes Islam incompatible with freedom, even limited freedom.

Like Sharia, punishment for blasphemy, and honor killing. [/COLOR]
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So its religion, but Gulf Countries (the majority of the region) who hold the same religion consider us their allies? The invalidates your whole ****ing argument that its religion.
 
TheDemSocialist said:
One part of the argument is only one part of the argument... Its not the whole argument.



So its religion, but Gulf Countries (the majority of the region) who hold the same religion consider us their allies? The invalidates your whole ****ing argument that its religion.
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Are you that naive? Name one that does not have ties to terror. And.....

The United States Has No Gulf Allies
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https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/persian-gulf/2016-04-12/united-states-has-no-gulf-allies
 
coldjoint said:
Are you that naive? Name one that does not have ties to terror. And.....



https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/persian-gulf/2016-04-12/united-states-has-no-gulf-allies
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Holy **** :doh You first moved it to being about the power vacuum
and once presented (it was presented several times here:
"1.)ISIS still predates the pullout
2.)GEN. WESLEY CLARK: I don’t think that keeping a few thousand troops in Iraq would have stopped ISIS. And it wouldn’t have fixed the Iraqi forces.
3.)This is more than simply just about ISIS. This is about the reasons for a strong distaste among Iraqis of American government policy"
)

Now you moved to religion blaming it on a religion

And now since you are sticking to your religion point, it was presented here how illogical it was:

"""Young Arabs are more divided in their
perceptions of the United States, with 63 per
cent saying they consider it an ally versus 32
per cent who view it an enemy. Perceptions
of the US are particularly strong in the GCC
where 85 per cent say it is an ally. " https://theintercept.com/wp-uploads/...2016100316.pdf "


Stop moving goal posts. Your arguments, based in **** talking points, hold no logic
 
TheDemSocialist said:
Holy **** :doh You first moved it to being about the power vacuum
and once presented (it was presented several times here:
"1.)ISIS still predates the pullout
2.)GEN. WESLEY CLARK: I don’t think that keeping a few thousand troops in Iraq would have stopped ISIS. And it wouldn’t have fixed the Iraqi forces.
3.)This is more than simply just about ISIS. This is about the reasons for a strong distaste among Iraqis of American government policy"
)

Now you moved to religion blaming it on a religion

And now since you are sticking to your religion point, it was presented here how illogical it was:

"""Young Arabs are more divided in their
perceptions of the United States, with 63 per
cent saying they consider it an ally versus 32
per cent who view it an enemy. Perceptions
of the US are particularly strong in the GCC
where 85 per cent say it is an ally. " https://theintercept.com/wp-uploads/...2016100316.pdf "


Stop moving goal posts. Your arguments, based in **** talking points, hold no logic
Click to expand...


I have moved nothing. I stated the root cause of the problem is Islam itself.
 
coldjoint said:

I have moved nothing. I stated the root cause of the problem is Islam itself.
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Its Islam? But you have yet to explain this point:
""""Young Arabs are more divided in their
perceptions of the United States, with 63 per
cent saying they consider it an ally versus 32
per cent who view it an enemy. Perceptions
of the US are particularly strong in the GCC
where 85 per cent say it is an ally. " https://theintercept.com/wp-uploads/...2016100316.pdf ""
 
Not Found

The requested URL /wp-uploads/...2016100316.pdf was not found on this server.
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Nice link. That explains it all.
 
coldjoint said:
Nice link. That explains it all.
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I guess I'll repost it for the 5th time
https://theintercept.com/wp-uploads/sites/1/2016/04/2016-AYS-White-Paper-EN_12042016100316.pdf
Its Islam? But you have yet to explain this point:
""""Young Arabs are more divided in their
perceptions of the United States, with 63 per
cent saying they consider it an ally versus 32
per cent who view it an enemy. Perceptions
of the US are particularly strong in the GCC
where 85 per cent say it is an ally. "
 
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