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Cuba is no longer a communist country

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Masterhawk

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In February 2019, Cuban voters overwhelmingly voted in favor of a new constitution. How much may you ask? 90.61% of the votes went in favor of it. And in case you were wondering how many people bothered to show up, the referendum had a 90.15% turnout (easily higher than in the US). A rigged or lopsided election/referendum would probably have a much lower turnout.

Now some of you may be wondering what in the constitution would make Cuba no longer a communist country. Well, one of the provisions incldued the recognition of private property. The reason this goes against communism is because as Marx himself said "the theory of communism may be summed up in one sentence: abolish all private property".

Other provisions include the recognition of foreign investment and gay marriage, presumption of innocence in court, and even a maximum age limit of 60 years for any president of Cuba beginning their first term.
 
Good for Cuba. I just really wish our current government was doing more to encourage them. Obama tried to get something started, but of course Trump's policy is to basically do the opposite of Obama.

I'm certainly more left than right, but that doesn't mean I support communism. I support democracy, and I support policy that will help the people, not just the rich. And I fully support other countries doing the same.
 
Masterhawk said:
In February 2019, Cuban voters overwhelmingly voted in favor of a new constitution. How much may you ask? 90.61% of the votes went in favor of it. And in case you were wondering how many people bothered to show up, the referendum had a 90.15% turnout (easily higher than in the US). A rigged or lopsided election/referendum would probably have a much lower turnout.

Now some of you may be wondering what in the constitution would make Cuba no longer a communist country. Well, one of the provisions incldued the recognition of private property. The reason this goes against communism is because as Marx himself said "the theory of communism may be summed up in one sentence: abolish all private property".

Other provisions include the recognition of foreign investment and gay marriage, presumption of innocence in court, and even a maximum age limit of 60 years for any president of Cuba beginning their first term.
Click to expand...

Cuba is still a dictatorship no matter how many pretty ribbons you want to put on it.

Lipstick on a pig.
 
Masterhawk said:
Other provisions include the recognition of . . . gay marriage
Click to expand...

Didn't think it was possible, but somehow, Cuba just became even worse.

P.S. A communist state is still worthy of utter destruction until such time as the Communist Party no longer rules it.
 
nekrodev said:
Good for Cuba. I just really wish our current government was doing more to encourage them. Obama tried to get something started, but of course Trump's policy is to basically do the opposite of Obama.

I'm certainly more left than right, but that doesn't mean I support communism. I support democracy, and I support policy that will help the people, not just the rich. And I fully support other countries doing the same.
Click to expand...

Obama started the wave with Castro at a ball game.Very Presidential
 
Masterhawk said:
In February 2019, Cuban voters overwhelmingly voted in favor of a new constitution. How much may you ask? 90.61% of the votes went in favor of it. And in case you were wondering how many people bothered to show up, the referendum had a 90.15% turnout (easily higher than in the US). A rigged or lopsided election/referendum would probably have a much lower turnout.

Now some of you may be wondering what in the constitution would make Cuba no longer a communist country. Well, one of the provisions incldued the recognition of private property. The reason this goes against communism is because as Marx himself said "the theory of communism may be summed up in one sentence: abolish all private property".

Other provisions include the recognition of foreign investment and gay marriage, presumption of innocence in court, and even a maximum age limit of 60 years for any president of Cuba beginning their first term.
Click to expand...

This is not entirely accurate.

In the interest of fairness this development is a small step in the right direction, but ultimately this is not a new constitution but a referendum editing parts of the existing constitution. The source of the referendum was closed door meetings and discussions from the Communist Party, and we still will see laws and regulations resulting from the same organization. And also understand a referendum in Cuba is not the same as what we may call that. In Cuba all it means is a call for the government to come up with a new series of laws that presumably replaced outdated laws by the referendum. But those laws are still there until replaced.

Even though the referendum edits major parts of the constitution, as your example is true about private property, it leaves in place a very centralized military and intelligence complex with all the existing means to monitor and influence economics and society. We also still have a question mark on if these new referendums apply to civilian populations working for the government.

There is some good news on the referendum allowing for new law recognizing business interests which may or may not help with exports and imports, but we should keep in mind that Cuba (despite the position of the US on this) already trades with dozens of nations many of whom are our allies. Small and medium businesses should be able to take advantage of how they define what they do, and the worker should be able to be something other than "self-employed."

Here is the biggest problem we are going to have. Even with the referendum, and supposedly the new laws we can expect, the Communist Party is still the only permitted political group. All opposition at a party level remains underground and suspect of the Cuban government. You can assume that the referendum makes way for multiple candidates but they will all still be from the same party and presumably at the discretion of the same group of men controlling the party now.

It is a mere definition technicality to suggest Cuba is no longer a communist nation, all they really did was shift to some other hybrid form of authoritarianism. Insert whatever term you would like to avoid the term communism but the economy is leans heavy to planned (very little is market,) the social model is still under the control of government, and ultimately the government still controls just about everything down to media.

Still authoritarian, still very little rights for the individual, still very little evidence Cuba is changing.

It will take much more than this.
 
nekrodev said:
Good for Cuba. I just really wish our current government was doing more to encourage them. Obama tried to get something started, but of course Trump's policy is to basically do the opposite of Obama.

I'm certainly more left than right, but that doesn't mean I support communism. I support democracy, and I support policy that will help the people, not just the rich. And I fully support other countries doing the same.
Click to expand...

No no no, we all know that either you support Trump 150 percent, or you are to the left if Lenin. Or that's what I hear from the Trumpettes at least.
 
RetiredUSN said:
Cuba is still a dictatorship no matter how many pretty ribbons you want to put on it.

Lipstick on a pig.
Click to expand...

So are lots of countries. What’s your point?
 
OrphanSlug said:
This is not entirely accurate.

In the interest of fairness this development is a small step in the right direction, but ultimately this is not a new constitution but a referendum editing parts of the existing constitution. The source of the referendum was closed door meetings and discussions from the Communist Party, and we still will see laws and regulations resulting from the same organization. And also understand a referendum in Cuba is not the same as what we may call that. In Cuba all it means is a call for the government to come up with a new series of laws that presumably replaced outdated laws by the referendum. But those laws are still there until replaced.

Even though the referendum edits major parts of the constitution, as your example is true about private property, it leaves in place a very centralized military and intelligence complex with all the existing means to monitor and influence economics and society. We also still have a question mark on if these new referendums apply to civilian populations working for the government.

There is some good news on the referendum allowing for new law recognizing business interests which may or may not help with exports and imports, but we should keep in mind that Cuba (despite the position of the US on this) already trades with dozens of nations many of whom are our allies. Small and medium businesses should be able to take advantage of how they define what they do, and the worker should be able to be something other than "self-employed."

Here is the biggest problem we are going to have. Even with the referendum, and supposedly the new laws we can expect, the Communist Party is still the only permitted political group. All opposition at a party level remains underground and suspect of the Cuban government. You can assume that the referendum makes way for multiple candidates but they will all still be from the same party and presumably at the discretion of the same group of men controlling the party now.

It is a mere definition technicality to suggest Cuba is no longer a communist nation, all they really did was shift to some other hybrid form of authoritarianism. Insert whatever term you would like to avoid the term communism but the economy is leans heavy to planned (very little is market,) the social model is still under the control of government, and ultimately the government still controls just about everything down to media.

Still authoritarian, still very little rights for the individual, still very little evidence Cuba is changing.

It will take much more than this.
Click to expand...

True, Cuba still has a long way to go before becoming a free market democracy. There are still various state-owned enterprises and the government still has yet to fully transition to being politically free. However, it's still a step in the right direction.
 
I'll just toss in there that Cuba was never actually communist, whatever they called themselves.

Functionally, the concept collapses immediately in groups larger than a small village.
 
"Cuba is no longer a communist country."

FALSE.

In fact, the new constitution only makes it more difficult for any pro-democracy movement to start changing the system from within.

Article 3 of the new Cuba Constitution says that “socialism and the social and political revolutionary system established by this Constitution are irrevocable.”

Also: “Citizens have the right to combat by all means, including armed struggle, when other means are not available, against anybody who seeks to topple the political, social and economic order established by this Constitution.”


This is basically saying that Cuba's hereditary dictatorship cannot be challenged - and if anyone is bold enough to try, civilian-clad secret police have carte blanch to legally kill the offenders! :shock:

Cubans are SO much worse off with this new "improved" constitution. . . . God help them.
 
SkyChief said:
"Cuba is no longer a communist country."

FALSE.

In fact, the new constitution only makes it more difficult for any pro-democracy movement to start changing the system from within.

Article 3 of the new Cuba Constitution says that “socialism and the social and political revolutionary system established by this Constitution are irrevocable.”

Also: “Citizens have the right to combat by all means, including armed struggle, when other means are not available, against anybody who seeks to topple the political, social and economic order established by this Constitution.”


This is basically saying that Cuba's hereditary dictatorship cannot be challenged - and if anyone is bold enough to try, civilian-clad secret police have carte blanch to legally kill the offenders! :shock:

Cubans are SO much worse off with this new "improved" constitution. . . . God help them.
Click to expand...


:applaud:applaud:applaud:applaud
 
The Referendum Triggered Arbitrary Arrests in Cuba
The Referendum Triggered Arbitrary Arrests in Cuba – Translating Cuba

March 7, 2019Categories14ymedio, Translator: Sheilagh Carey

Patriotica-Antitotalitario-Asociacion-Observadores-Electorales_CYMIMA20190305_0015_16.jpg

Text of the sign: “#We All March. We don’t vote at the polling places of the assassins.” Among the most repressed independent organizations were the Patriotic Union of Cuba, Women in White, the United Antitotalitarian Forum, and the Cuban Association of Electoral Observers, among others. (@bertasolerf)

14ymedio, Havana, March 5, 2019 — The detentions for political reasons in Cuba increased to 310 in February compared to 144 in January, the Cuban Commission of Human Rights and National Reconciliation (CCDHRN) denounced in its monthly report published this Wednesday. The number is substantially below the figure reported by the Cuban Observatory of Human Rights (OCDH), based in Madrid, last Sunday, which placed arrests at 405.

According to the CCDHRN, before the referendum held on February 24, a “large mobilization” of the police and para-police forces took place, capable of exercising “preventive repression and intimidation” on citizens classified as disaffected or non-sympathetic to the Government.
Click to expand...
Threats, arrests, fines, confiscations of work materials, invasion of independent activists homes, and house arrests are some of the many strategies employed against those promoting a position that differs from the yes vote for the referendum backed by the Castroit regime and for which an intense campaign has also unfolded in national media, schools, and public transportation. The regime does not care about the violations of international electoral standards.
 
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