• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Why does Israel need foreign aid?

Jack Hays said:
US aid was important in Israel's victory in the Six Day War. Israel gets foreign aid because it is a democracy surrounded by undemocratic enemies.
Click to expand...

now, Israel has nuclear weapons. They don't need aid
 
Ganesh said:
People have friends, nations only have interests.
Click to expand...

And in the interests of America, it is good to have friends in the the ME.
 
Ganesh said:
When challenged to provide [...] you fell back on Israel being in a constant state of war. So in other words, Israel cannot come to peace terms with its neighbours, so the US has an obligation to help it fight on for another century or so. Why? You have not answered that question.
Click to expand...

That's a pretty distorted view of the discussion. The discussion was initiated with you declaring that there is no strategic interest to be served by the US-Israeli agreement, and me bringing in as an example the various technologies developed by Israel and used by the US. You continued to claim it's just one example, meaning that it doesn't contradict your "there is no strategic interest" remark although that doesn't make any sense but we moved forward, I've listed an endless list of examples where the US interests are being promoted by Israeli actions, be it the development of technologies, the sharing of intelligence, standing together at the UN organizations or sharing tactics of warfare. To each of these examples you've responded by simply dismissing its importance and by claiming that it's not essential, meaning that a huge crisis would not occur had that specific example of cooperation not existed. I explained to you that according to both named high profile US officials and reality itself these cooperations are indeed quite vital and important and are 'worth' the military aid given by the US but you sticked with your own reality and refused to recognize you were wrong no matter what, continuing to throw the word 'essential' so to avoid recognizing so. You can still recognize that you were wrong, it's never too late.

As to your question nowhere have I suggested that Israel can never come to peace terms with its neighbors, perhaps I have only pointed out that it requires actions from the other side as well.

Yes, and I suppose it is nothing in comparison to the trench warfare of WW1 either. But we are not talking about either, we are discussing Israel/Palestine, and that, along with the scramble for oil, are of no doubt the defining and overriding issues of the region, from a global perspective, and have been for the last half century at least. Try to stay focused here Mr A.
Click to expand...

Cute, but you were talking about the I/P conflict as some major cause of radicalization and a major destabilizing cause in the Mideast. So a comparison with the other conflicts to prove how minor it truly is and expose your vision as one that exaggerates the magnitude of the conflict in order to justify several positions surrounding Israel is only natural.

I blame the terrorists that committed those crimes [...] for all the angst produced over the years.
Click to expand...

You might be, but when you claim that if it wasn't for Israel there would be no attacks on the US and Western targets you are being delusional really there is no other way to describe it. The terrorists hate Israel that's nothing new and they place the support for Israel as one of the causes for their attacks on the West but these are hardly the central and major causes you describe them to be, the Paris attacks for example were just an act of barbarism by a barbaric organization with memebrs who believe they are doing the work of God by opposing the evil crusaders and by sending a message not to get involved in Iraq and Syria. It's an act of lunacy to claim that because of Israel such attacks have happened.

My view is actually a very moderate one. Israel has done some great things. It deserves security and peace. Its violent beginnings were morally questionable and probably illegal, but given the history of the time, understandable. But I don't think Israel will ever see a real peace until it can honestly face its past, and make a deal that acknowledges that neither side is perfect in its history. Relentless spin and distortion, such as you are doing here, will only serve to discredit the nation, and ensure future animosity and lack of respect.
Click to expand...

No doubt you find it to be moderate, and no doubt you find my opposition to your positions to be "relentless spin and distortion", but as long as you're going to make statements that are false I'm going to correct you, and I'm sorry that you feel that if I oppose your absurd claim that "no strategic interests are being promoted by the US-Israeli agreement" then it means I'm not being fair and balanced. I also don't know what this has to do with Israel's past as it is its present you were attempting to alter here.
 
America and Europe created this mess with Israel and the rest of the middle east, and the end result was constant war since 1948.

We broke it.............we pay for it.
 
RetiredUSN said:
America and Europe created this mess with Israel and the rest of the middle east, and the end result was constant war since 1948.

We broke it.............we pay for it.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure that's true. There were significant barriers to Jewish settlement in Palestine.
 
Jack Hays said:
I'm not sure that's true. There were significant barriers to Jewish settlement in Palestine.
Click to expand...

Yes...there were. And it brings us back to the original agreements between the original Palestinians and Israel. I'm not saying Israel has been a total victim here, but the palestinians have been moving the goalposts since 1948.
 
Masterhawk said:
None of those countries get any foreign aid so why should Israel?
Click to expand...
Israel are our friends and are fellow good guys. As such, assisting them is a pleasure.

Plus by ensuring that Israel are much stronger than their neighbors, we prevent their neighbors from attacking them, and we give Israel the security to not have to launch preemptive attacks, thereby making the Middle East a much more peaceful place.
 
Toggle Almendro said:
Israel are our friends and are fellow good guys. As such, assisting them is a pleasure.

Plus by ensuring that Israel are much stronger than their neighbors, we prevent their neighbors from attacking them, and we give Israel the security to not have to launch preemptive attacks, thereby making the Middle East a much more peaceful place.
Click to expand...

israel has nuclear weapons. The rest of the middle east is too busy with their own problems to give a **** about israel
 
Masterhawk said:
israel has nuclear weapons. The rest of the middle east is too busy with their own problems to give a **** about israel
Click to expand...
History shows that the rest of the Middle East would attack Israel if they could.

Israel will not rely on their nuclear deterrent alone. If Israel were militarily weaker, they would be more proactive about attacking their neighbors before their neighbors attacked them.

More attacks against Israel and more preemptive attacks by Israel means more war in the Middle East and less stability. Bad for US policy.

And the day would eventually come when Israel would have to use those nukes. Even worse for Mideast stability and US policy.

Far better that we help our close friend and ally, making the entire region safer in the process.
 
Last edited:
Toggle Almendro said:
History shows that the rest of the Middle East would attack Israel if they could.

Israel will not rely on their nuclear deterrent alone. If Israel were militarily weaker, they would be more proactive about attacking their neighbors before their neighbors attacked them.

More attacks against Israel and more preemptive attacks by Israel means more war in the Middle East and less stability. Bad for US policy.

And the day would eventually come when Israel would have to use those nukes. Even worse for Mideast stability and US policy.

Far better that we help our close friend and ally, making the entire region safer in the process.
Click to expand...

Like I said, the middle east is too busy. Saudi arabia is more concerned with crushing the Houthi movement in yemen, Syria and Iraq are in civil war, and Turkey is focused mainly on the syrian war. Plus the US can always defend israel in the event of invasion like they did with Kuwait.
 
Masterhawk said:
Like I said, the middle east is too busy. Saudi arabia is more concerned with crushing the Houthi movement in yemen, Syria and Iraq are in civil war, and Turkey is focused mainly on the syrian war.
Click to expand...
You are forgetting Iran.

And the alleged busyness of the rest of Israel's neighbors will be a temporary thing. They'll all be wishing they could attack Israel in no time.

You are also overlooking the fact that the main reason why we support Israel is because they are our close friend and ally.


Masterhawk said:
Plus the US can always defend israel in the event of invasion like they did with Kuwait.
Click to expand...
So in addition to having the Middle East destabilized with perpetual series of wars against Israel (destabilization leading to, among many other things, soaring gasoline prices), we would have to endure a steady stream of coffins coming home while we defended Israel with our own soldiers?

I'll pass on that dystopia.
 
Master PO said:
Why should any foregin nation get aid, they shouldnt
Click to expand...
We can't wall off the rest of the world and pretend that they don't exist. The world is out there and we have to deal with them.

And it is generally a good thing to help people who are friendly to us.
 
Toggle Almendro said:
We can't wall off the rest of the world and pretend that they don't exist. The world is out there and we have to deal with them.

And it is generally a good thing to help people who are friendly to us.
Click to expand...
from my point, were does the constituion authorize money to foregin goverements in the form of aid
 
Toggle Almendro said:
You are forgetting Iran.

And the alleged busyness of the rest of Israel's neighbors will be a temporary thing. They'll all be wishing they could attack Israel in no time.

You are also overlooking the fact that the main reason why we support Israel is because they are our close friend and ally.



So in addition to having the Middle East destabilized with perpetual series of wars against Israel (destabilization leading to, among many other things, soaring gasoline prices), we would have to endure a steady stream of coffins coming home while we defended Israel with our own soldiers?

I'll pass on that dystopia.
Click to expand...

no matter how much saudi arabia and the arab league hates israel, they will always hate Iran more. Plus the us can always intervene like they did with kuwait which has little to no relations with America.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom