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A House Painter in L.A. talks about Illegal Immigration and its impact.

Captain Adverse

Captain Adverse

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A House Painter in L.A. talks about Illegal Immigration and its impact.


Yes, another video I happened across while using YouTube. In this case the simple economics of supply and demand presented by a blue collar with decades of work experience in the Southern California market.

Here is HIS take on the effects of illegal immigration:




The simple facts of how labor supply and demand not only effects the economics of many American citizens, but also how it affects our culture.

NOTE: I am not going to summarize the video, since it seems members think I am making the points rather than the person IN the video.

However, I will agree with his simple, straight-forward points on how illegal immigration really effects American society AND on the nations they have fled.

Enjoy.
 
Captain Adverse said:
A House Painter in L.A. talks about Illegal Immigration and its impact.


Yes, another video I happened across while using YouTube. In this case the simple economics of supply and demand presented by a blue collar with decades of work experience in the Southern California market.

Here is HIS take on the effects of illegal immigration:




The simple facts of how labor supply and demand not only effects the economics of many American citizens, but also how it affects our culture.

NOTE: I am not going to summarize the video, since it seems members think I am making the points rather than the person IN the video.

However, I will agree with his simple, straight-forward points on how illegal immigration really effects American society AND on the nations they have fled.

Enjoy.
Click to expand...


Do you think that some people dont know that illegal immigration is wrong and harmful?
Listen- I pay for bandwidth so I don't open video links. Does the narrater mention the greedy bastards who hire illegals because they love cheap labour? Thats where you need to begin your efforts, unless completely closing the southern border is on the table. Hundreds of thousands of Latinos cross that border every day, perfectly legally. They're going shopping or visiting friends or family or going on a holiday. They stay because somebody hires them. That's where you need to start.
 
Grand Mal said:
Do you think that some people dont know that illegal immigration is wrong and harmful?
Listen- I pay for bandwidth so I don't open video links. Does the narrater mention the greedy bastards who hire illegals because they love cheap labour? Thats where you need to begin your efforts, unless completely closing the southern border is on the table. Hundreds of thousands of Latinos cross that border every day, perfectly legally. They're going shopping or visiting friends or family or going on a holiday. They stay because somebody hires them. That's where you need to start.
Click to expand...

Closing the border? That HAS been mentioned recently.
 
Well, I like the guy in the video. He comes off as not wanting to put the illegals out, and would be open to reforming the immigration system. And maybe even addressing some of the trade issues that drive so many seasonal workers across the border in the first place.

I don't think this guy would be for a wall tho, he seams to reasonable and well versed with the use of ladders to believe a wall would ever work.

I will say this, he does have a point about the abundance of cheap labor. But that's not entirely because of illegal immigration which has been in a decline. That's an intricate web of ****ery, touching on several hot button issues. Including automation, and threats of going overseas.

A few things I would like to see done on immigration. More funding going to the courts, there are to few judges, and heck to few courts themselves to handle the case loads. The whole system is very inefficient. And fixing that will do so much more good than throwing more money at enforcement. which needs drones basically not a wall.
 
Vox said:
Closing the border? That HAS been mentioned recently.
Click to expand...

That's the only way tostop illegal immigration. Just Google how many legal crossings happen every day at San Ysidro alone.
A wall? What a joke. Walls work where there's machine guns involved, with overlapping fields of fire or whatever it's called, but the days of Jose wading the river are gone. And the powers-that-be will spend billions on that white elephant if it makes the great unwashed masses vote for Trump. And they'll keep making big bucks off cheap labour.

Remember how it used to be? Jose and Pablo would sneak across the river at night, leaving their families at home. Theyd work the season, a few months for the guy they worked for last year and they'd take their wages home where it stretched much further. Now, they cant risk having to cross again in a few months so they bring the senora and the ninos and set up housekeeping. And now they need full-time wages.
 
Grand Mal said:
That's the only way tostop illegal immigration. Just Google how many legal crossings happen every day at San Ysidro alone.
A wall? What a joke. Walls work where there's machine guns involved, with overlapping fields of fire or whatever it's called, but the days of Jose wading the river are gone. And the powers-that-be will spend billions on that white elephant if it makes the great unwashed masses vote for Trump. And they'll keep making big bucks off cheap labour.

Remember how it used to be? Jose and Pablo would sneak across the river at night, leaving their families at home. Theyd work the season, a few months for the guy they worked for last year and they'd take their wages home where it stretched much further. Now, they cant risk having to cross again in a few months so they bring the senora and the ninos and set up housekeeping. And now they need full-time wages.
Click to expand...

Hey.......I wash.

And machine guns?

Doubtless needed at some point in the future.

Things are getting worse in the Mestizo/Amerindian territories south and farther south of the border.
 
Good video. I don’t think I agree with ALL his points but most of them are good. The only point I really disagree with is that their home countries would be better off if they hadn’t left. The point he made about how we would be better off without such a glut of laborers holds for the countries down south as well. And many of the ambitious ones who manage to create their own businesses would NOT necessarily have such an opportunity back home.

That said, I agree with the negative impact on America he talks about from illegal immigration. And ensuring the best conditions for AMERICANS should be the primary concern of American politicians.

My position on this has been consistent. Instead of focusing efforts on tracking door poor people just trying to take care of their families, go after the employers who are exploiting their labor and breaking labor laws.
 
Grand Mal said:
Do you think that some people dont know that illegal immigration is wrong and harmful?
Listen- I pay for bandwidth so I don't open video links. Does the narrater mention the greedy bastards who hire illegals because they love cheap labour? Thats where you need to begin your efforts, unless completely closing the southern border is on the table. Hundreds of thousands of Latinos cross that border every day, perfectly legally. They're going shopping or visiting friends or family or going on a holiday. They stay because somebody hires them. That's where you need to start.
Click to expand...

He did mention the people who hire illegal aliens...but it's not greed driving them. It's simple economics. His main point about that was that restricting the flow of illegal aliens into the country will result in employers getting their labor from available sources...which would be citizens and legal residents.

Regarding people who visit legally and then illegally stay, I agree that stricter enforcement of existing employment laws is a good thing. But it is only one of the things we need to do...simultaneously...to combat the illegal alien problem.
 
Grand Mal said:
That's the only way tostop illegal immigration. Just Google how many legal crossings happen every day at San Ysidro alone.
A wall? What a joke. Walls work where there's machine guns involved, with overlapping fields of fire or whatever it's called, but the days of Jose wading the river are gone. And the powers-that-be will spend billions on that white elephant if it makes the great unwashed masses vote for Trump. And they'll keep making big bucks off cheap labour.

Remember how it used to be? Jose and Pablo would sneak across the river at night, leaving their families at home. Theyd work the season, a few months for the guy they worked for last year and they'd take their wages home where it stretched much further. Now, they cant risk having to cross again in a few months so they bring the senora and the ninos and set up housekeeping. And now they need full-time wages.
Click to expand...

And most illegals in the country came here legally and then just overstayed their visa. A wall won’t do crap for that. The best way to fight illegal immigration is to remove the source of jobs. Start throwing employers who violate labor laws in jail or fine them out the ass and our country won’t seem so appealing to illegal immigrants.
 
Vox said:
Hey.......I wash.

And machine guns?

Doubtless needed at some point in the future.

Things are getting worse in the Mestizo/Amerindian territories south and farther south of the border.
Click to expand...

First, sorry, Cap'n, I haven't had a chance to watch your video yet, but I will...though I don't feel like I need to be convinced of the need for sensible, compassionate, border control.

Vox... don't you think Mal's got a point, when it comes to finding more efficient ways of doing so? I mean...Trump is big on big gestures of the "Look, I did something" variety...hey, let's build a big dumb wall...hey, let's call a 7000 immigrants migrating together a national emergency, and send in 5000 soldiers... It's like, he went down to the Legion, and got the advice of a bunch of drunk old dudes... hehe (Respectfully...drunk old dudes at the Legion are some of my favorite people, but there's a limit to what I'd go them for advice for after they've had a few...at least up here, not sure what it's like down there...hehe).

Why not look at expanded work programs that allows people to make an honest living, not be a criminal, and actually give back to the country in the form of taxes? If you make it easier than it would be to devise some way to get over illegally, they're gonna go with that. And, you guys would have control over the whole thing, monitoring who's coming and going, monitoring where they're at, where they're working, and perhaps a trust can be established to allow these folks to be rewarded for compliance with a shot at real citizenship, if they so desire? Surely Trump's momentum with job creation can support this.... ;)

And, as a bonus, you have an effective means of distinguishing between who the good folks are, and who the bad folks are...if someone has nothing to hide, and it's easier to go through official channels, then logically the only people who would attempt to gain entrance into the states illegally would be the kind of person you would definitely want to keep out. This means that you can deal with illegal immigration in such a way as to remove the question of how they should be treated, not knowing whether they're dangerous or otherwise harmless individuals. All of a sudden you don't have the Left freaking out when LE tries to uphold the law.

I get that I don't understand the full complexity of the issue, sitting up here and consuming the information second hand...but as a sort of an objective logic problem, it seems pretty clear that there are better solutions than those being suggested by Trump. Rather than 5000 soldiers being sent to meet this caravan, they should be sending 5000 immigration agents to process these people properly and efficiently, with some humane way to deal with those that don't make the requirements for entry (with security on site, of course, I'm not saying there's zero risk here).

Clearly you guys have an issue with illegal immigration. Rather than coming up with weird, drunken "solutions", maybe thinking a little will yield better results, for a lot less money than a damn wall...haha... My way, you guys make money. ;)
 
Skeptic Bob said:
Good video. I don’t think I agree with ALL his points but most of them are good. The only point I really disagree with is that their home countries would be better off if they hadn’t left. The point he made about how we would be better off without such a glut of laborers holds for the countries down south as well. And many of the ambitious ones who manage to create their own businesses would NOT necessarily have such an opportunity back home.

That said, I agree with the negative impact on America he talks about from illegal immigration. And ensuring the best conditions for AMERICANS should be the primary concern of American politicians.

My position on this has been consistent. Instead of focusing efforts on tracking door poor people just trying to take care of their families, go after the employers who are exploiting their labor and breaking labor laws.
Click to expand...

Those two are one and the same - not opposites (instead of situations) at all. How, exactly, are illegal immigrants going to "take care of their families" if they cannot work for US employers or, if self-employed, US customers?

I agree that laws should be made to make it much harder for US employers to hire illegal immigrant labor - demand that the federal income tax code be changed to allow deduction of direct labor costs for only those employees that have a current (annual) eVerify certification. As for the illegal immigrants themselves, deport them whenever and wherever they are found working - a good place to start is in Home Depot parking lots, restaurants, construction sites and hotels/motels.

Wages for jobs most commonly done by illegal immigrant labor will then rise causing "safety net" expenses to fall.
 
Last edited:
OlNate said:
First, sorry, Cap'n, I haven't had a chance to watch your video yet, but I will...though I don't feel like I need to be convinced of the need for sensible, compassionate, border control.

Vox... don't you think Mal's got a point, when it comes to finding more efficient ways of doing so? I mean...Trump is big on big gestures of the "Look, I did something" variety...hey, let's build a big dumb wall...hey, let's call a 7000 immigrants migrating together a national emergency, and send in 5000 soldiers... It's like, he went down to the Legion, and got the advice of a bunch of drunk old dudes... hehe (Respectfully...drunk old dudes at the Legion are some of my favorite people, but there's a limit to what I'd go them for advice for after they've had a few...at least up here, not sure what it's like down there...hehe).

Why not look at expanded work programs that allows people to make an honest living, not be a criminal, and actually give back to the country in the form of taxes? If you make it easier than it would be to devise some way to get over illegally, they're gonna go with that. And, you guys would have control over the whole thing, monitoring who's coming and going, monitoring where they're at, where they're working, and perhaps a trust can be established to allow these folks to be rewarded for compliance with a shot at real citizenship, if they so desire? Surely Trump's momentum with job creation can support this.... ;)

And, as a bonus, you have an effective means of distinguishing between who the good folks are, and who the bad folks are...if someone has nothing to hide, and it's easier to go through official channels, then logically the only people who would attempt to gain entrance into the states illegally would be the kind of person you would definitely want to keep out. This means that you can deal with illegal immigration in such a way as to remove the question of how they should be treated, not knowing whether they're dangerous or otherwise harmless individuals. All of a sudden you don't have the Left freaking out when LE tries to uphold the law.

I get that I don't understand the full complexity of the issue, sitting up here and consuming the information second hand...but as a sort of an objective logic problem, it seems pretty clear that there are better solutions than those being suggested by Trump. Rather than 5000 soldiers being sent to meet this caravan, they should be sending 5000 immigration agents to process these people properly and efficiently, with some humane way to deal with those that don't make the requirements for entry (with security on site, of course, I'm not saying there's zero risk here).

Clearly you guys have an issue with illegal immigration. Rather than coming up with weird, drunken "solutions", maybe thinking a little will yield better results, for a lot less money than a damn wall...haha... My way, you guys make money. ;)
Click to expand...

Oh GAWD!!!

That's all so COMPLICATED!!!

Why not just give them a simple choice? Go home now or we break your legs.

This has the added benefit that.......IF they do sneak in again......we can tell them by the way they walk.

:thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:
 
Vox said:
Oh GAWD!!!

That's all so COMPLICATED!!!

Why not just give them a simple choice? Go home now or we break your legs.

This has the added benefit that.......IF they do sneak in again......we can tell them by the way they walk.

:thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:
Click to expand...

:lamo ffs... well, that's a half hour or so I'll never get back...
 
ttwtt78640 said:
Those two are one and the same - not opposites (instead of situations) at all. How, exactly, are illegal immigrants going to "take care of their families" if they cannot work for US employers or, if self-employed, US customers?

I agree that laws should be made to make it much harder for US employers to hire illegal immigrant labor - demand that the federal income tax code be changed to allow deduction of direct labor costs for only those employees that have a current (annual) eVerify certification. As for the illegal immigrants themselves, deport them whenever and wherever they are found working - a good place to start is in Home Depot parking lots, restaurants, constructions crews and hotel/motel staff.

Wages for jobs most commonly done by illegal immigrant labor will then rise causing "safety net" expenses to fall.
Click to expand...

The psychological impact of having to leave because one can’t find a job vs being hunted down by cops, handcuffed, put through the system, and kicked out of the country are very different. The end result may be the same, but the psychic toll is quite different. Maybe that is overly based in emotion, but it is how I feel.

Get rid of the jobs and they won’t me motivated to come here in the first place.

I respect that you think a double pronged approach would be most effective and you are probably right. But right now nobody, including Republicans, is serious about going after employers.
 
Vox said:
Oh GAWD!!!

That's all so COMPLICATED!!!

Why not just give them a simple choice? Go home now or we break your legs.

This has the added benefit that.......IF they do sneak in again......we can tell them by the way they walk.

:thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:
Click to expand...

You are going to hell for that. But then so am I for laughing at it. ;)
 
Skeptic Bob said:
You are going to hell for that. But then so am I for laughing at it. ;)
Click to expand...

I don't ENTIRELY believe in hell..........just like I don't ENTIRELY believe in breaking legs.

They're just potential end of the road possibilities.
 
Skeptic Bob said:
The psychological impact of having to leave because one can’t find a job vs being hunted down by cops, handcuffed, put through the system, and kicked out of the country are very different. The end result may be the same, but the psychic toll is quite different. Maybe that is overly based in emotion, but it is how I feel.

Get rid of the jobs and they won’t me motivated to come here in the first place.

I respect that you think a double pronged approach would be most effective and you are probably right. But right now nobody, including Republicans, is serious about going after employers.
Click to expand...

Nobody in congress (of either party) has any reason to go after employers (often called "job creators") so long as they enjoy a re-election rate of over 90%. These illegal immigrant folks are not about to leave voluntarily and thus wages in the US in many industries are going to remain depressed - which was the main point of the OP video.
 
OlNate said:
First, sorry, Cap'n, I haven't had a chance to watch your video yet, but I will...though I don't feel like I need to be convinced of the need for sensible, compassionate, border control.

Vox... don't you think Mal's got a point, when it comes to finding more efficient ways of doing so? I mean...Trump is big on big gestures of the "Look, I did something" variety...hey, let's build a big dumb wall...hey, let's call a 7000 immigrants migrating together a national emergency, and send in 5000 soldiers... It's like, he went down to the Legion, and got the advice of a bunch of drunk old dudes... hehe (Respectfully...drunk old dudes at the Legion are some of my favorite people, but there's a limit to what I'd go them for advice for after they've had a few...at least up here, not sure what it's like down there...hehe).

Why not look at expanded work programs that allows people to make an honest living, not be a criminal, and actually give back to the country in the form of taxes? If you make it easier than it would be to devise some way to get over illegally, they're gonna go with that. And, you guys would have control over the whole thing, monitoring who's coming and going, monitoring where they're at, where they're working, and perhaps a trust can be established to allow these folks to be rewarded for compliance with a shot at real citizenship, if they so desire? Surely Trump's momentum with job creation can support this.... ;)

And, as a bonus, you have an effective means of distinguishing between who the good folks are, and who the bad folks are...if someone has nothing to hide, and it's easier to go through official channels, then logically the only people who would attempt to gain entrance into the states illegally would be the kind of person you would definitely want to keep out. This means that you can deal with illegal immigration in such a way as to remove the question of how they should be treated, not knowing whether they're dangerous or otherwise harmless individuals. All of a sudden you don't have the Left freaking out when LE tries to uphold the law.

I get that I don't understand the full complexity of the issue, sitting up here and consuming the information second hand...but as a sort of an objective logic problem, it seems pretty clear that there are better solutions than those being suggested by Trump. Rather than 5000 soldiers being sent to meet this caravan, they should be sending 5000 immigration agents to process these people properly and efficiently, with some humane way to deal with those that don't make the requirements for entry (with security on site, of course, I'm not saying there's zero risk here).

Clearly you guys have an issue with illegal immigration. Rather than coming up with weird, drunken "solutions", maybe thinking a little will yield better results, for a lot less money than a damn wall...haha... My way, you guys make money. ;)
Click to expand...

Ah, if only anything you suggest would actually work.

And, if only you were addressing the real problem.

As for the wall, you must realize it is and always was a metaphor--it means cutting off the flood of aliens with a combination of barriers--some physical and some human (yes, many of those humans will be military) and some mechanical and robotic (and yes, weapons will eventually become a part of it).......a high tech barrier that is as impenetrable as possible.

The Wall.

It will be ready in a few years, at about the same time we finally totally close the border.

I know you don't see this.

The Liberals are as blind to the horrible outcome of Alien Infestation and Domination as Conservatives are to Global Warming.

Both groups refuse to see the danger of the thing the other group is ranting about.
 
Vox said:
Ah, if only anything you suggest would actually work.

And, if only you were addressing the real problem.

As for the wall, you must realize it is and always was a metaphor--it means cutting off the flood of aliens with a combination of barriers--some physical and some human (yes, many of those humans will be military) and some mechanical and robotic (and yes, weapons will eventually become a part of it).......a high tech barrier that is as impenetrable as possible.

The Wall.

It will be ready in a few years, at about the same time we finally totally close the border.

I know you don't see this.

The Liberals are as blind to the horrible outcome of Alien Infestation and Domination as Conservatives are to Global Warming.

Both groups refuse to see the danger of the thing the other group is ranting about.
Click to expand...


Help me understand what the real problem is, in your opinion. I'd like to test my proposition against it.
 
OlNate said:
Help me understand what the real problem is, in your opinion. I'd like to test my proposition against it.
Click to expand...

The real problem is that by 2075 (unless we take action) whites will have lost numerical and political power and will have become an oppressed minority.

And the OLD minorities will TAKE the reparations they've been demanding.......plus a little extra.

Old story........all history supports it.
 
Vox said:
The real problem is that by 2075 (unless we take action) whites will have lost numerical and political power and will have become an oppressed minority.

And the OLD minorities will TAKE the reparations they've been demanding.......plus a little extra.

Old story........all history supports it.
Click to expand...

Ok, welp…I will agree that my solution does nothing with that.

I'm sorry you harbor those fears. It must be awful. One thing that might help is being a strong advocate for equality being baked into law for everyone, now. That way you don't have to rely the decency of "the majority" (like today's marginalized have had to do, with...shall we say...mixed results) to protect yourself and those you care about. If, as you say, this is inevitable (because let's face it, I'm not sure you're going to find yourself a majority to support a race war, even if you think it is merely self defense), then use the last of your privilege to make things right, at least in the realm of the law, and perhaps establish a precedent of fair treatment, if that's what you hope to secure for yourself, and those you care about.

As a conservative, I'm sure you'll agree with me that sometimes traditional wisdom is the best...so I'll drop one of the oldest bits of wisdom, let me know if you've heard this one before: Do unto others as you'd have done to you.
 
OlNate said:
Ok, welp…I will agree that my solution does nothing with that.

I'm sorry you harbor those fears. It must be awful. One thing that might help is being a strong advocate for equality being baked into law for everyone, now. That way you don't have to rely the decency of "the majority" (like today's marginalized have had to do, with...shall we say...mixed results) to protect yourself and those you care about. If, as you say, this is inevitable (because let's face it, I'm not sure you're going to find yourself a majority to support a race war, even if you think it is merely self defense), then use the last of your privilege to make things right, at least in the realm of the law, and perhaps establish a precedent of fair treatment, if that's what you hope to secure for yourself, and those you care about.

As a conservative, I'm sure you'll agree with me that sometimes traditional wisdom is the best...so I'll drop one of the oldest bits of wisdom, let me know if you've heard this one before: Do unto others as you'd have done to you.
Click to expand...

Of course I AM doing unto others as I'd have done to me.

I'm staying in my own country and I want them to do the same for me.

You said, "One thing that might help is being a strong advocate for equality being baked into law for everyone, now. That way you don't have to rely the decency of "the majority" (like today's marginalized have had to do, with...shall we say...mixed results) to protect yourself and those you care about."

I've always been an advocate for equality being baked into law for everyone and that's more than 50 years as an adult.

Nothing has changed.

Go to Amazon and order a few books on tribalism.

You'll find that nothing WILL change.

If you're white.........you can either fight or accept that whites will become an oppressed minority by 2075.

Your choice.
 
Vox said:
Of course I AM doing unto others as I'd have done to me.

I'm staying in my own country and I want them to do the same for me.

You said, "One thing that might help is being a strong advocate for equality being baked into law for everyone, now. That way you don't have to rely the decency of "the majority" (like today's marginalized have had to do, with...shall we say...mixed results) to protect yourself and those you care about."

I've always been an advocate for equality being baked into law for everyone and that's more than 50 years as an adult.

Nothing has changed.

Go to Amazon and order a few books on tribalism.

You'll find that nothing WILL change.

If you're white.........you can either fight or accept that whites will become an oppressed minority by 2075.

Your choice.
Click to expand...


I don't really accept binaries, bud... Every time I think I've found one, it bites me in the ass.

We all have our choices to make, according to the life we wish to lead. Since I cannot commit to being a racist, I must put my efforts to being on the side of those looking for a solution, and creating a society where people are equal. There is always a time of reckoning, usually during power transfers, and if your prediction comes true, then when it is my time to reckon I will say I stood for equality and inclusion, and hope to be treated in kind. But rather than face that, I think it would be better to nurture that attitude now, in the hopes that the next age won't belong to a racial demographic, but instead to everyone.

Anyway...we have no common ground on this issue, our views being too far apart, and likely neither of us willing to be swayed. I have the Christian disadvantage of being mandated to do good and have faith...so that's what I'll continue to do. That's the choice I make. Beyond that, all gains or consequences are what they are. :)
 
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