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Non-US Citizens and Voting.

So your husband is here legally. Was honest and presented a green card. Obviously he wouldn't be allowed to vote. What about those that are dishonest though? That believe that they should have a say even if the law says that they "can't"? Is it really nonsense to think that there are millions of people like that? Those that are here illegally have already demonstrated a penchant for ignoring our laws. They've also demonstrated a penchant for using false identities and stolen identities. What is truly in place to stop them from voting?

First you have to register, then you have to show ID proving you're registered. If you think millions of people voted illegal, that is massive scale voter fraud. That is higly unlikely.
 
So often we hear people say that they don't vote. So here's a few questions for those that say this and believe it.

How do you know they're not voting?
Voter rolls are a local responsibility.

State voter registration rolls are checked (purged) on a regular basis, often every two years. They often work with the federal government, and sometimes with 3rd party systems (like the Interstate Crosscheck System or Pew's Electronic Registration Information Center). At least 16 states work check the DHS immigration database.

In 2012, Florida aggressively purged its rolls. They started with a list of 182,000 potential non-citizens who voted. By the time they were done, and after several embarrassments over false positives (including veterans btw), they kicked a whopping 85 people off the voter rolls.

A better way to put it is: There is no evidence of rampant voter fraud by ineligible voters.

And that's not from a lack of trying. Republicans -- who now have substantial local control over elections, which also means responsibility -- have been desperately searching for evidence of voting fraud, and keep coming up snakeyes.

I'm also curious, do you support policies that expand voting rights for legitimate voters? Do you support expanding voting hours? Online registration? Pre-registration for 16- and 17-year olds? Automatic state registration? Streamlined voter registration for military personnel? Expanding assistance for disabled voters?
 
I recently registeted to vote at the BMV. I have citizenship. My husband does not. He is legally here with a resident green card. The lady at the BMV said he can't vote on a green card. The day I voted, I had to show ID and they checked I was legally registered and permitted to vote off their database.

My husband didn't vote.

It's highly unlikly millions of illegal aliens illegally voted. That is nonsense.

Depends on where you live. Besides, how do you know, if nobody checks, or cares?
 
So your husband is here legally. Was honest and presented a green card. Obviously he wouldn't be allowed to vote. What about those that are dishonest though? That believe that they should have a say even if the law says that they "can't"? Is it really nonsense to think that there are millions of people like that?
Yes, it is, because no one has found any evidence of widespread voter fraud.

And as noted above, that's not for a lack of trying. Voter rolls are local and state responsibilities, and most states now have Republican administrations -- meaning they manage and are responsible for those voter rolls. They have been trying desperately for years to uncover voting fraud, and haven't found it.

This is not a real issue. It is, at best, fearmongering.
 
Depends on where you live. Besides, how do you know, if nobody checks, or cares?

You can look at the facts or keep you head firmly buried in the sand like a good Trump supporter...
 
LOL

Whatever reality you think you need to believe to validate your position is fine with me.

What facts do you have that millions of people voted illegally?

If facts don't support your reality, then guess what that means...
 
Voter rolls are a local responsibility.

State voter registration rolls are checked (purged) on a regular basis, often every two years. They often work with the federal government, and sometimes with 3rd party systems (like the Interstate Crosscheck System or Pew's Electronic Registration Information Center). At least 16 states work check the DHS immigration database.

In 2012, Florida aggressively purged its rolls. They started with a list of 182,000 potential non-citizens who voted. By the time they were done, and after several embarrassments over false positives (including veterans btw), they kicked a whopping 85 people off the voter rolls.

A better way to put it is: There is no evidence of rampant voter fraud by ineligible voters.

And that's not from a lack of trying. Republicans -- who now have substantial local control over elections, which also means responsibility -- have been desperately searching for evidence of voting fraud, and keep coming up snakeyes.

I'm also curious, do you support policies that expand voting rights for legitimate voters? Do you support expanding voting hours? Online registration? Pre-registration for 16- and 17-year olds? Automatic state registration? Streamlined voter registration for military personnel? Expanding assistance for disabled voters?

What good is an immigration database going to do with those here illegally and using false or stolen identities? The immigration database only works with those that are registered in it. Last I knew the government admits that they don't even know exactly how many illegals are in the US, much less who they are.

Bold: Yes.
Underlined. Why register 16 year olds? I can understand 17 year old's as depending on their birthday's they could be turning 18 on voting day or even slightly before. But 16? Seems a bit worthless to me since they can't vote until 2 years later.
Red: So long as it includes a way to prove that the ones being registered are US Citizens I have no problem with it.
Rest: Yes.
Did I pass your test?
 
First you have to register, then you have to show ID proving you're registered. If you think millions of people voted illegal, that is massive scale voter fraud. That is higly unlikely.

Why wouldn't they? There is nothing in place to stop them. Obama admitted that.
 
Yes, it is, because no one has found any evidence of widespread voter fraud.

And as noted above, that's not for a lack of trying. Voter rolls are local and state responsibilities, and most states now have Republican administrations -- meaning they manage and are responsible for those voter rolls. They have been trying desperately for years to uncover voting fraud, and haven't found it.

This is not a real issue. It is, at best, fearmongering.

Of course there's no evidence. Can't be evidence for something when there is nothing in place to detect that something. And right now there is nothing in place to detect it.
 
Why wouldn't they? There is nothing in place to stop them. Obama admitted that.

If you're so concerned about a few hundred or thousand illegals voting, you may want to focus instead of the 65.8 million who were disenfranchised when the candidate they voted for won by 3 million votes yet did not take office. Even if you believe the reports of 11 million illegals and they somehow vote as frequently as everyone else, that's still far less of a threat to democracy. But i would bet anything it's way way less common, because illegals don't want to draw attention to themselves - "Hey here's where i live and here's my fake ID!"

Hell, i bet there's more working class who want to vote but cannot because they're...working! during the few hours on a weekday that polls are open, than illegals who manage to vote
 
If you're so concerned about a few hundred or thousand illegals voting, you may want to focus instead of the 65.8 million who were disenfranchised when the candidate they voted for won by 3 million votes yet did not take office. Even if you believe the reports of 11 million illegals and they somehow vote as frequently as everyone else, that's still far less of a threat to democracy. But i would bet anything it's way way less common, because illegals don't want to draw attention to themselves - "Hey here's where i live and here's my fake ID!"

Hell, i bet there's more working class who want to vote but cannot because they're...working! during the few hours on a weekday that polls are open, than illegals who manage to vote

One way to fix the system is to make sure that those that are not allowed to vote aren't voting. There being nothing in place to prevent them from voting is a threat to democracy as illegals voting are drowning out the voices of citizens.
 
One way to fix the system is to make sure that those that are not allowed to vote aren't voting. There being nothing in place to prevent them from voting is a threat to democracy as illegals voting are drowning out the voices of citizens.

The citizens have no voice as is - see: those 65.8 million and countless who couldn't make the polls on a workday. Address this first, get rid of the electoral college, or can't take the conspiracies seriously
 
What facts do you have that millions of people voted illegally?

If facts don't support your reality, then guess what that means...

I didn't write that I have facts to support millions of illegal aliens voted. I wrote that there is no way of knowing, since nobody checks, and frankly, nobody cares.

I also wrote that it depends on what state you're talking about.

It's obvious illegal aliens voted, given how easy it is to do that in some states. As posts in this thread proved, California has passed legislation to allow illegal aliens to vote without any legal ramifications.

How many did? I don't know, anybody checking? I don't think so.
 
Why wouldn't they? There is nothing in place to stop them. Obama admitted that.

If massive scale voter fraud happened, I think there would be evidence. More votes cast than people actually registered would detected. Something like what you're describing would fly under our noses.
 
If massive scale voter fraud happened, I think there would be evidence. More votes cast than people actually registered would detected. Something like what you're describing would fly under our noses.

Only if they bypassed the registration system. Those with stolen identities do not need to bypass it.
 
The citizens have no voice as is - see: those 65.8 million and countless who couldn't make the polls on a workday. Address this first, get rid of the electoral college, or can't take the conspiracies seriously

Why get rid of the EC? So that those in the big cities can dictate to those in the countryside? No thanks. The EC is an integral part of America. Without it we'd have mod rule. Something which has always ended in disaster and took away peoples Rights. Again, no thanks.
 
What facts do you have that millions of people voted illegally?

If facts don't support your reality, then guess what that means...

No one has said that they are voting illegally. What this thread is about is the fact that there is no system in place to check. As such you can't say that they are voting or that they are not voting.
 
I wonder how many Democrats would be okay with just letting the rest of the world vote for U.S. president as well as current citizens?
 
Why get rid of the EC? So that those in the big cities can dictate to those in the countryside? No thanks. The EC is an integral part of America. Without it we'd have mod rule. Something which has always ended in disaster and took away peoples Rights. Again, no thanks.

Why get rid of illegal immigrant voting? So white racists can dictate to the most vulnerable population? Immigration is an integral part of America. Without it, we'd have only wild injuns! I can speak for those very same racists when i say no thanks
 
So often we hear people say that they don't vote. So here's a few questions for those that say this and believe it.

How do you know they're not voting?
What processes are in place to identify and deny and punish those that are not allowed to vote because they are in the US illegally either through running through the border or overstaying their visa's or are simply just not Citizens?
If you were here in the US and a non-citizen would you vote knowing that the voting process does not include a way to identify you as a non-US Citizen and as such not able to legitimately vote?
I previously addressed the matter, referencing surveys, statistics, and probabilities: http://www.debatepolitics.com/general-political-discussion/271355-approx-3-09-million-non-citizens-registered-vote-many-voted.html

Now, after realizing that the number of non-citizens in the U.S. is considerably higher than 25 million, I'm thinking between 3-5 million non-citizens were registered to vote.

Many have easily obtained Social Security Numbers via fake IDs and that's how they're working. Others had their IDs expire but they already had Social Security Numbers.

It's a piece of cake, and they know it, to use these IDs to register to vote, and, you're right, there's no criminal tracking on this that leads to the voting booth.

Trump v. Clinton polarized everyone strongly, so if there was an election where they were going to vote, it was this was .. and, of course, nearly all would be voting for Clinton.

Fortunately, a great number of them are in California, which was going to go Clinton anyway, so the EC protected us .. but local races could indeed have been affected.

It's sad.
 
Why get rid of illegal immigrant voting? So white racists can dictate to the most vulnerable population? Immigration is an integral part of America. Without it, we'd have only wild injuns! I can speak for those very same racists when i say no thanks

Difference between what I said and what you said? Yours is hyperbole and relies on the race card. A typical tactic when actual logic fails.
 
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