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Māori Council wants Pope to apologise for colonisation of New Zealand

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soylentgreen

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http://https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2019/11/maori-council-wants-pope-to-apologise-for-colonisation-of-new-zealand.html

The doctrine of discovery provided the legal and political justification for European monarchs to conquer and claim lands inhabited by indigenous peoples. It was supported by a number of papal bulls (Catholic laws) issued by the Vatican in the 15th and 16th centuries.

Tukaki says this "fueled white supremacy" and supported the "dehumanisation, dispossession, murder, and forced assimilation" of those indigenous peoples.

"It is a shameful blight not only on our history here in New Zealand but right across the first nations world where an old, archaic and quite frankly document is not repudiated by the Vatican," Tukaki says.

"They must be held to account for the sins of their ancestors in what has been an intergenerational trauma visited on many of our indigenous brothers and sisters over many centuries."

"Today the New Zealand Māori Council joins that fight alongside our indigenous and first nations brothers and sisters for an accounting of the Vatican."
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The pope will not even apologise for the peadophiles he protects let alone think that he may apologise for white supremacy that his church endorsed.

Do you think the american indigenous will or should get behind this?
 
Shhh! They were spreading the "Word of God," by sword and seizing land.
 
It was a time in history when most Europeans supported the idea of colonization and conquest. Modern scruples about such things were largely non-existent.

Many of the conquered peoples were not exactly pure and innocent flowers either. Not speaking of the Maori specifically, but it isn't as if many of the areas subject to colonization/conquest were at peace. Tribal warfare, conquest, enslavement, and so on were staples of life in most places at that time.

It was what it was. Will the current Pope apologizing on behalf of a centuries-ago Pope really make anything better?

Does it help anyone if I apologize for the fact that some of my distant ancestors owned slaves? I acknowledge they were wrong to do so... but that changes nothing.
 
1. Yes, yes, yes: NO apologies to any group.

2. Instead of crying about the past, deal with TO-DAY!

3. Sure, the Europeans and Americans were not angels; neither were the groups that are now demanding apologies.

4. China, for example, was badly treated by Europeans and Japan.

a. The Chinese do not waste their time begging for apologies.
b. They are too busy building a country that is prosperous and strong. A country that scares other countries. That's the best revenge there is.
 
soylentgreen said:
http://https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2019/11/maori-council-wants-pope-to-apologise-for-colonisation-of-new-zealand.html



The pope will not even apologise for the peadophiles he protects let alone think that he may apologise for white supremacy that his church endorsed.

Do you think the american indigenous will or should get behind this?
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The Maori have inhabited New Zealand for less time than the English have inhabited England. Anyone who supports mass migration into Europe while condemning the colonization of New Zealand is a fraud and a hypocrite.
 
Why should the Pope apologize? What did the Pope do?
 
joko104 said:
Why should the Pope apologize? What did the Pope do?
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These days, apparently one is guilty of the crimes of one's ancestors or predecessors, however indirect the connection.
 
Goshin said:
Does it help anyone if I apologize for the fact that some of my distant ancestors owned slaves? I acknowledge they were wrong to do so... but that changes nothing.
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No, it doesn't change anything in the past.

But acknowledging how past wrongs changed societies and how their long standing impact can influence modern situations is the first step towards having a constructive conversation on addressing current issues. Hell, in Iraq modern irrigation and water supplies, the stuff that people need to live both by drinking and by supplying their crops, still hasn't recovered from the Mongol conquest over 800 years ago.
 
Goshin said:
It was a time in history when most Europeans supported the idea of colonization and conquest. Modern scruples about such things were largely non-existent.

Many of the conquered peoples were not exactly pure and innocent flowers either. Not speaking of the Maori specifically, but it isn't as if many of the areas subject to colonization/conquest were at peace. Tribal warfare, conquest, enslavement, and so on were staples of life in most places at that time.

It was what it was. Will the current Pope apologizing on behalf of a centuries-ago Pope really make anything better?

Does it help anyone if I apologize for the fact that some of my distant ancestors owned slaves? I acknowledge they were wrong to do so... but that changes nothing.
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I want an apology from the Queen for the way my Highland ancestors were treated after Culloden in 1746. Their language, their music, their style of dress, all made illegal and their lands forfeit and their social system broken up and replaced...
Better have that apology engraved, come to think.
 
AmNat said:
. Anyone who supports mass migration into Europe while condemning the colonization of New Zealand is a fraud and a hypocrite.
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Uh, the reverse is also true.
 
Colonization/conquest has been part of human history up until the recent age where most are enlightened enough to respect the territory of others. It's silly to condemn or guilt trip over European colonization when nearly all other people groups are guilty of the same thing and oftentimes with much more cruelty.
 
digsbe said:
Colonization/conquest has been part of human history up until the recent age where most are enlightened enough to respect the territory of others. It's silly to condemn or guilt trip over European colonization when nearly all other people groups are guilty of the same thing and oftentimes with much more cruelty.
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So la Reconquista is perfectly acceptable.
 
Every person should apologize to the neanderthals - and have to pay reparations.
 
Actually, the premise is a lie. Secular military and economic forces considered indigenous non-white people to be non-human animals that could be killed and even totally eradicated - and were doing so. They literally killed to extinction EVERY person on EVERY Caribbean island - no exceptions. 100% of EVERYONE on Cuba, Haiti, Pueto Rico, the Bahamas etc - 100% were killed. This was standard practice across the world...

... UNTIL the Pope declared non-white people are human beings with souls and therefore could not be outright murdered. But for that Pope, it is very possible that every indigenous person in all of the Americas and much of the rest of the world would also have been murdered to extinction.

It is tragic how schools stopped teaching both history and civics decades ago. The result is probably the historically and institutionally dumbest Americans in US history - by far. That declaration by the Pope is way, way up the list on decisive moments in human history - and but for it we might be living in a world with only white people. But instead all you will ever hear is attacks against the Catholic Church, Christians and white people by atheists - when it was secular motivations for literal total genocide of entire racial and ethnic groups to literal extinction.

Curious how no one ever calls upon the Iranians (Persians) to apologize for killing over 200,000,000 people - nearly 25% of the world's population - in their empire building, nor on the Mongols nor any other mass murderous peoples. PCism ONLY allows - but also requires - targeting ONLY white people and Christians for the past.
 
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AmNat said:
The Maori have inhabited New Zealand for less time than the English have inhabited England. Anyone who supports mass migration into Europe while condemning the colonization of New Zealand is a fraud and a hypocrite.
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There is no equivilence to immigration in europe and the colonisation of first world countries.
 
Grand Mal said:
I want an apology from the Queen for the way my Highland ancestors were treated after Culloden in 1746. Their language, their music, their style of dress, all made illegal and their lands forfeit and their social system broken up and replaced...
Better have that apology engraved, come to think.
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And your not alone in that

Apology sought for 'war crimes' in Culloden's aftermath - BBC News

A state apology is being sought for the actions of Hanoverian forces following the Battle of Culloden in April 1746.
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Pope had nothing to do with this, Englishmen gave Maori the time -machine, which moved them from stone age forward to the telephones, universities, Hospitals, democracy and the most successful country in the world
 
Litwin said:
Pope had nothing to do with this, Englishmen gave Maori the time -machine, which moved them from stone age forward to the telephones, universities, Hospitals, democracy and the most successful country in the world
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Englishmen are a lot better at taking things than they are at giving them. The Maori were better off before.
 
digsbe said:
Colonization/conquest has been part of human history up until the recent age where most are enlightened enough to respect the territory of others. It's silly to condemn or guilt trip over European colonization when nearly all other people groups are guilty of the same thing and oftentimes with much more cruelty.
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even thought empires which are committing all possible colonial crimes today are not European or American (Muscovy, China, and Ethiopia) and they are almost never mentioned by western activists , why ?
 
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