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A better way for all americans?

RussiaTimes and Opinion section?
 
Margaret Flowers writes an excellent article about healthcare in the US.

The Covid-19 pandemic exposes deep flaws in America’s broken healthcare system — RT Op-ed

Intelligent public policy would attempt to implement her ideas.

Trying to assert that the current US shortage of PPE and testing capability is caused by not having a wonderful UHC system (like China does?) does not pass the reality test. Why no mention of how much better Italy and Spain did if having UHC was the solution to a guarantee a better pandemic response?
 
Trying to assert that the current US shortage of PPE and testing capability is caused by not having a wonderful UHC system (like China does?) does not pass the reality test. Why no mention of how much better Italy and Spain did if having UHC was the solution to a guarantee a better pandemic response?

She was limited by how many words she could write.

Best to chew it and then digest it, and then talk about it. :mrgreen:
 
She was limited by how many words she could write.

Best to chew it and then digest it, and then talk about it. :mrgreen:

As am I, but why not address them? It's not easy to debate when your position is that if you disagree with what (extremely little) was said in the OP then you simply did not understand it correctly.
 
Interesting article. Pretty much supports the idea of socialized medicine.

The writer of the OP-ed is a co-director popular-resistance.org which is a left leaning organization. In their mission station statement they have a part that say they want to restore "power to the people". I have not heard that since the 60's.
 
Margaret Flowers writes an excellent article about healthcare in the US.

The Covid-19 pandemic exposes deep flaws in America’s broken healthcare system — RT Op-ed

Intelligent public policy would attempt to implement her ideas.


QUESTIONABLE SOURCE
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Overall, we rate RT Questionable based on promoting pro-Russian propaganda, promotion of conspiracy theories, numerous failed fact checks and a lack of author transparency.

RT News (RT.Com) - Media Bias/Fact Check



OP seems to like the path less taken.
 
Trying to assert that the current US shortage of PPE and testing capability is caused by not having a wonderful UHC system (like China does?) does not pass the reality test. Why no mention of how much better Italy and Spain did if having UHC was the solution to a guarantee a better pandemic response?

Apparently and no surprise, the US has now caught up in PPE and ventilators. Last night 60 Minutes had informative pieces about GM going into the ventilator business.

What I found most interesting in the OP is that while the US has 5% of the global population, it has 32% of reported Covid cases. Also, 25% of Covid deaths are in the US.

Contrast with China, it has .1 number of cases and deaths.
 
QUESTIONABLE SOURCE
A questionable source exhibits one or more of the following: extreme bias, consistent promotion of propaganda/conspiracies, poor or no sourcing to credible information, a complete lack of transparency and/or is fake news. Fake News is the deliberate attempt to publish hoaxes and/or disinformation for the purpose of profit or influence (Learn More). Sources listed in the Questionable Category may be very untrustworthy and should be fact checked on a per article basis. Please note sources on this list are not considered fake news unless specifically written in the reasoning section for that source. See all Questionable sources.

Overall, we rate RT Questionable based on promoting pro-Russian propaganda, promotion of conspiracy theories, numerous failed fact checks and a lack of author transparency.

RT News (RT.Com) - Media Bias/Fact Check



OP seems to like the path less taken.

Again you demonstrate your inability to discuss ideas and thoughts. You demonstrate your happy obedience to the mainstream media narrative. You are an obedient soul, and I'm happy.
 
Apparently and no surprise, the US has now caught up in PPE and ventilators. Last night 60 Minutes had informative pieces about GM going into the ventilator business.

What I found most interesting in the OP is that while the US has 5% of the global population, it has 32% of reported Covid cases. Also, 25% of Covid deaths are in the US.

Contrast with China, it has .1 number of cases and deaths.

China is well known for spewing disinformation (propaganda). If you had bothered to look at per capita deaths by country (serach engines allow such miracles) you might change your tune a tad.

• Coronavirus deaths per million by country | Statista
 
Thank you, that rather makes the point.

3.3 for China and almost 160 for the US. That aligns nicely with Flowers' numbers.

Hmm... why no mention of those many European nations with UHC systems? Using China as your example of how a country should be run is not likely to impress other folks as much as it seems to impress you.
 
Hmm... why no mention of those many European nations with UHC systems? Using China as your example of how a country should be run is not likely to impress other folks as much as it seems to impress you.

I'm not trying to impress folks. I'm doing the same thing you are, posting on an internet website, seeking rational public dialogue. So kill me
 
I'm not trying to impress folks. I'm doing the same thing you are, posting on an internet website, seeking rational public dialogue. So kill me

You are cherry picking two nations (USA and China) while ignoring the many European nations (e.g. Spain, Italy, France and the UK) with UFC systems which have a significantly higher per capita COVID-19 death rate than the US does.
 
You are cherry picking two nations (USA and China) while ignoring the many European nations (e.g. Spain, Italy, France and the UK) with UFC systems which have a significantly higher per capita COVID-19 death rate than the US does.

Oh dear!!!

I'm able to read between lines of data and extrapolate. Are you?

You're sore because Flowers' observations and criticism threaten somehow the way you see the world.

Sorry I bothered mate.
 
Oh dear!!!

I'm able to read between lines of data and extrapolate. Are you?

You're sore because Flowers' observations and criticism threaten somehow the way you see the world.

Sorry I bothered mate.

You are the very first (alleged) Libertarian I have encountered who uses China as an example of ideal government control. The way I see the world is in line with how most outside of China see the world - which is that China's communist party lies constantly about almost everything.
 
You are the very first (alleged) Libertarian I have encountered who uses China as an example of ideal government control. The way I see the world is in line with how most outside of China see the world - which is that China's communist party lies constantly about almost everything.

You are desperate sir, made so when your own link basically supported Flowers' claims. Don't worry.

Never have you seen me say that China is an example of ideal government control. I will say there is strong circumstantial evidence that they have a superior healthcare system than ours, if public health is what one is seeking. But no, I've never been a fan of their style of government. I do not fear or hate the Chinese government as you seem to, but I'm not a fan of how they do things.

That you must say that I do is more evidence that you've found yourself in an awkward position as far as "debate" goes. :peace
 
Apparently and no surprise, the US has now caught up in PPE and ventilators. Last night 60 Minutes had informative pieces about GM going into the ventilator business.

What I found most interesting in the OP is that while the US has 5% of the global population, it has 32% of reported Covid cases. Also, 25% of Covid deaths are in the US.

Contrast with China, it has .1 number of cases and deaths.

The ventilator issue, coupled with the rhetoric about being so complex and expensive, turned out in the long run to be a very questionable treatment option at best - an 88% fatality rate almost seems like putting a patient into a coma and on a respirator was a death sentence in and of itself.

The cost and complexity was another bandwagon to those who are easily baffled by anything mechanical; no rocket since here - a UMMC Dr. made his own ventilator: "Made with "primarily a garden hose, a lamp timer and electronic valve," the ventilator, named the Robertson Ventilator, for less than $100, can be assembled in approximately 20 to 30 minutes, meaning a dedicated team of four to five could produce nearly 100 in a day if needed, he said."
Coronavirus ventilators for $100? They're being built in Mississippi

So now we have far more ventilators on line (with a reserve stockpile) we don't seem to need, but pathetically insufficient testing is available to get a grasp of what we are truly up against, while in far too many cases people have to wear homemade masks thanks to an ongoing shortage. Just possibly, if the healthcare industry was a single entity instead of the fragmented money-grab we have today, some positive consensus on how to move forward more effectively may have focused efforts in a more productive, and fiscally responsible way.
 
Margaret Flowers writes an excellent article about healthcare in the US.

The Covid-19 pandemic exposes deep flaws in America’s broken healthcare system — RT Op-ed

Intelligent public policy would attempt to implement her ideas.

Actually.. intelligent public policy would be to stay away from her ideas.. as they would make things much much worse.

Okay.. lets take this first thing...

Even hospitals are shutting down essential departments such as obstetrics and pediatrics to make space for more lucrative areas like cardiology and orthopedics.

Yep..she is right. BUT she doesn;.t understand WHY!.. The reason that hospitals are shutting down departments like obstetrics and pediatrics is because they are not lucrative... and why? BECAUSE they are made up of patients that have MEDICAID... A GOVERNMENT INSURANCE...which pays less than pretty much any other private insurance. Because government payors are so low.... the hospital cannot maintain services... so what happens is that services like pediatrics and obstretrics have to consolidate.

The reasons that hospitals who are able to maintain pediatrics and obstretics do so by cost shifting... so that more lucrative services.. that are paid with private insurance.. end up subsidizing the services like pediatrics that have such a large portion that's government payer.

GOING toward more government payer.. means that MORE hospitals will shut down.. and more services will be lost because the government payment is too low to sustain them.. that's why they are closing NOW.

Now lets take this:

Another key feature would be that the federal government would purchase pharmaceuticals and medical supplies in bulk to lower the cost and ensure states have what they nee
Okay... with the idea that it would cost less... but again.. that means LESS revenue for suppliers.. and since they are buying in bulk.. it means that only a couple of suppliers would be winners of the bid.. which likely means that our supply would shift completely to other countries.. as production costs in the US are so much higher than say China.

We are already seeing that as American producers.. are few and far already because supply has moved overseas as its so much cheaper already.

As far as this:

Two-thirds of US bankruptcies are caused by medical bills
This has been completely debunked. Multiple studies have shown this to not only be false.. but studies show that when medical reasons are cited for bankruptcy.. only a small percentage of the persons debt is medical bills. What really causes medical bankruptcy is the loss of INCOME that a person has when they are sick.
 
Contrast and compare the data and experience in China to that in the US and other western countries.
 
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