YorkshirePete
DP Veteran
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Hell yeah! :2razz:
Clearly someone who hasn't had a $2000000 bill
Hell yeah! :2razz:
STOP LYING... that's really beneath you. I HAVE NOT... NEVER.. EVER.. "ignored the charts and data"... NEVER EVER EVER.
YOU ARE MAKING A BALD FACE LIE when you say that. And there is no "lack of argument".
Its simple.. YOU claim that other countries have better life expectancy and a lower cost because of their healthcare system.
And you use the graph to prove your point. THE PROBLEM IS THAT GRAPH ALSO SHOWS THAT COUNTRIES WITH SIMILAR SYSTEMS HAVE DIFFERENCES IN THEIR LIFE EXPECTANCIES AND COSTS.
YOU IGNORE THAT INCONVENIENT FACT.
Because that inconvenient fact shows that its not healthcare system that accounts for the difference...
STOP LYING... if you want to disagree.. that's fine... but don't you dare make up lies about me. Its beneath you.
STOP LYING... that's really beneath you. I HAVE NOT... NEVER.. EVER.. "ignored the charts and data"... NEVER EVER EVER.
YOU ARE MAKING A BALD FACE LIE when you say that. And there is no "lack of argument".
Its simple.. YOU claim that other countries have better life expectancy and a lower cost because of their healthcare system.
And you use the graph to prove your point. THE PROBLEM IS THAT GRAPH ALSO SHOWS THAT COUNTRIES WITH SIMILAR SYSTEMS HAVE DIFFERENCES IN THEIR LIFE EXPECTANCIES AND COSTS.
YOU IGNORE THAT INCONVENIENT FACT.
Because that inconvenient fact shows that its not healthcare system that accounts for the difference...
STOP LYING... if you want to disagree.. that's fine... but don't you dare make up lies about me. Its beneath you.
Who cares if you live to 85 is rather than 83.
As a Person who has lived In the uk, it's a huge relief to have not to pay even though you pay in taxes
No huge files, just an ID card
Based on what exactly?
I am basing my premise on the contention that we should "go to a system like Canada government insurance". I am basing my premise on " we should go to single payer and reduce healthcare by 50%).
Then I objectively point out what the Canadian government insurance pays for and what they do not.. and the ways that they get cost savings.
You.. are saying.. "I want a Canadian system"..
but then ignoring the facts about that Canadian system.
The canadian system includes private insurance
Yep.. which seems to be selectively ignored by folks that claim "we need to go to a system like Canada and get private insurance out of it".. :lamo
Remember.. ole Helix.. who thinks that your healthcare shouldn;t be based on where you live and what job you have?
Well guess what? The Canadian healthcare system is based on what province/territory you live in.. and private insurance that supplements that government insurance (if you have a supplement).. is for most people.. based on their employer.
but hey.... "lets go with a Canadian system and get rid of all that!".. :doh
How many people die waiting for treatment in SP countries?
I don't know, but ...
New study finds 45,000 deaths annually linked to lack of health coverage
If you want to see a really intelligent woman who knows her facts discuss healthcare, including wait times in Canada, before the US Senate, watch this:
I waited 5 months to see a specialist in the us and I have great insurance
"A new study says Government controlling your life will save your life! Give in to the control!"
"A new study says Government controlling your life will save your life! Give in to the control!"
Where do you get government control? You control your life, knowing that whatever happens, your health needs will be met, even if you are poor or lose your job.
Nope, the Canadian system isn't perfect. I know, I live here, but it's a hell of a lot better than what you have down South. Your system costs 50% more, but delivers poorer outcomes. And we never need to worry if we will be denied coverage for preexisting conditions.
From Canada Health Act
health insurance covers surgery and services, including psychotherapy, in clinics and doctors' offices as well as dental surgery at dental offices and laboratory tests.
Yes you can get additional coverage from some employers, I have it. For example, if I get sick for six months, my insurance makes up for the lost income.
That's comparing apples and oranges, never mind that they ignore a huge percentage of hospitalizations, ie the ones outside the age range of 25-64.
As for the notion that greater government involvement in health insurance will reduce bankruptcy, it is helpful to compare personal bankruptcy rates in the United States and Canada. Unlike the United States, Canada has a universal, government-run health insurance system. Following the logic of Himmelstein and colleagues, we should therefore expect to observe a lower rate of personal bankruptcy in Canada compared to the United States.
Yet the evidence shows that in the only comparable years, personal bankruptcy rates were actually higher in Canada. Personal bankruptcy filings as a percentage of the population were 0.20 percent in the United States during 2006 and 0.27 percent in 2007. In Canada, the numbers are 0.30 percent in both 2006 and 2007. The data are from government sources and defined in similar ways for both countries and cover the time period after the legal reforms to U.S. bankruptcy laws in 2005 and before the onset of the 2008 economic recession.
Where do you get government control? You control your life, knowing that whatever happens, your health needs will be met, even if you are poor or lose your job.
Actually no.. on many metrics we score higher than Canada.. Things like effectiveness in care, timeliness of care, etc.
Actually the medical bankruptcy due to medical bills is largely a myth... in fact.. when Canada and America bankruptcies were compared when Canada and America had similar bankruptcy law..
https://www.fraserinstitute.org/article/medical-bankruptcy-myth
Thanks for the good reply.
I don't see how timeliness in care can be scored higher in the USA, where some people never get care.
?
To paraphrase "12-13% of Americans are citing medical debt as one of their reasons for bankruptcy", but I didn't see any mention of Canadians going broke due to medical debt. Did I just not see it, or does my point still stand?
https://www.afp.com/en/news/2266/swedes-enjoy-world-class-healthcare-when-they-get-it-doc-18l33e1
What's half your pay and months waiting for "free" care right?
I waited 5 months to see a specialist in the us and I have great insurance
No you didn't.
Let's take the maxima value, 63'000 deaths in 16 years because of waiting times in Canada. 4'000 deaths per year. Approximately 0.011% of the population.
In the US, approximately 45'000 people die every year because of lack of healthcare. That's roughly 0.014% of the population.
So yeah, 0.011% is way lower than 4%. Also, the numbers are pretty close, but you have a better chance waiting in Canada than living in the US. Also, you won't end up broke.
Single payer may not be the solution best fitted for the american government, but the numbers prove one thing without a doubt : the health care system needs reform and it needs it now.
https://www.afp.com/en/news/2266/swedes-enjoy-world-class-healthcare-when-they-get-it-doc-18l33e1
What's half your pay and months waiting for "free" care right?