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Individuals’ Catastrophic Medical costs.

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I'm Supposn

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I originally posted this topic last year within a different group. The link from which I quote is from a NY Times article dated July 3, 2018 and was linked the next day within an MSN web site. The article's title is entitled “Obamacare Is Proving Hard to Kill”, by Reed Abelson.

Respectfully, Supposn
Originally posted by Supposn
Individuals’ Catastrophic Medical costs:

Federal insurance for catastrophic medical costs on behalf of individuals:

Excerpted from Congressman Paul Ryan’s website. He forwarded a transcript concerning his positions of regarding USA’s healthcare policies; Racine [WI] Journal News, Mark Schaaf, July 7, 20217.
“Republicans have proposed the federal and state governments subsidize the cost of care for people in the individual market with catastrophic illnesses, Ryan said. He believes that will make it easier to insure people in those high-risk pools at a more affordable price”.

Paul Ryan ’s advocating federal insuring catastrophic medical costs of individuals. That’s a concept that both sides of the political aisle could agree upon.
I’m a proponent for federal acceptance of fiscal responsibility for catastrophic medical condition regardless if patients were or were not previously insured. Hospitals must be reimbursed for those extraordinary expenditures.
Excerpted from: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/03/health/obamacare-insurance-rates.html
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/ob...cid=spartanntp
“...In Minnesota, which created a reinsurance program to help pay for customers’ expensive medical conditions, carriers are actually seeking lower premiums. A midlevel policy in Minneapolis is priced at $302 a month. ...”.
 
That has potential. I like the idea of dealing with those unable to get insurance on a case by case basis, rather than trying to change it for everyone.
 
I'm always amazed at Americans' reluctance to embrace a healthcare system (single payer) that has been proven to be superior on a world-wide basis.
 
RetiredUSN said:
Ezra Klein has a interesting article on the healthcare cost issue and is a quick read for those who are curious as to why the USA costs are so high.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...ng-about-single-payer/?utm_term=.40ed4ac09d30


I think Ezra gets it wrong by saying it's the liberals who are mistaken when there are many republicans with the same mindset.
Click to expand...

"The pharmaceutical industry was in third place, with a 19.9 percent return, and the medical products and equipment industry was right behind it, with a 16.3 percent return."

BINGO!!!
 
Aristaeus said:
I'm always amazed at Americans' reluctance to embrace a healthcare system (single payer) that has been proven to be superior on a world-wide basis.
Click to expand...

LOL...weird how most world leaders and others who can afford to come to America when they have serious health issues.
 
Flashback:

Congress Weakens Obamacare by Limiting ‘Bailout’ Funds for Insurers
The $1.1 trillion omnibus spending bill headed for approval in the House on Friday contains yet another GOP blow to the Affordable Care Act. This one blocks administration efforts to bolster a special fund created under the law to compensate insurance companies for excessive losses due to a disproportionate share of very sick or elderly enrollees.
Click to expand...

Apparently we've come a long way in two and a half years.
 
itsforthekids said:
LOL...weird how most world leaders and others who can afford to come to America when they have serious health issues.
Click to expand...

I'm sure the US healthcare system is great for millionaires and world leaders. If that's your measurement of a good national healthcare system, then good luck.
 
Aristaeus said:
I'm sure the US healthcare system is great for millionaires and world leaders. If that's your measurement of a good national healthcare system, then good luck.
Click to expand...

For about 85% of americans.. our system is better than what government insurance they would get in most countries. It is one of the reasons that healthcare costs so much in this country.

that's why americans don't want to adopt a single payer system.

Oh sure.. you will have someone here that will say "hey look at say Canada and how they get free government healthcare for everyone and they love it"...

And what they don't point out is.. Most single payer government insurances don't cover the things that private insurance covers here. Like Canada government insurance doesn;t cover outpatient drugs, or outpatient therapies or home care, etc.

Most single payer insurances have way more restrictions on specialist, longer wait times for seeing those specialists and tests etc.

And.. healthcare is a big part of our GDP. Hurt the healthcare industry.. and you basically can kiss tons of jobs goodbye in the US. Good paying jobs that prop up wages for the middle class.
 
Aristaeus said:
I'm always amazed at Americans' reluctance to embrace a healthcare system (single payer) that has been proven to be superior on a world-wide basis.
Click to expand...

What about the little child that was denied proper medical care in England recently? The parents were prohibited from taking the kid to another country where he could have received proper care.

What about the Canadians who come to the United States for operations?

On a side note when Michelle Obama was at her "job" at a Chicago hospital she helped David Axlerod deny care to indigent persons in order to have more beds available for persons who could pay. I put job in quotes because her function was so vital the position, created by Valerie Jarret, was not filled after she left.

The left keeps arguing that insurance costs will raise under Trump while ignoring that each year Obamacare was in effect both premiums and deductibles rose every year.
 
Aristaeus said:
I'm always amazed at Americans' reluctance to embrace a healthcare system (single payer) that has been proven to be superior on a world-wide basis.
Click to expand...

Same here. What I can tell you, though, is that you won't convince them even with charts and data. In their reality, the only way to fix our broken system is to deregulate it. I'd advise you not to waste your time.
 
Aristaeus said:
I'm always amazed at Americans' reluctance to embrace a healthcare system (single payer) that has been proven to be superior on a world-wide basis.
Click to expand...

Because as with everything else in America...it's about money. (profits) Pharmaceuticals ? By far, the most profitable industry in the world.

Not hard to reason that, when the entire medical industry is not trained to 'cure' anything...only treat it, with pills etc.
 
HowardBThiname said:
Single-payer. Direct, not through the insurers. We're done.
Click to expand...

Except Germany has a single-payer, govt. run health care system that includes many insurance companies...making a profit.

Unlike in America where it's all about profits, the govt. made a deal...regulation, provision for anybody and private profits.

In the US. it's cover only who we choose, cover only what we want and all...to maximize profits.

To hell with the people. It's not about the people, it's about their profits.
 
Pedestrian said:
Because as with everything else in America...it's about money. (profits) Pharmaceuticals ? By far, the most profitable industry in the world.

Not hard to reason that, when the entire medical industry is not trained to 'cure' anything...only treat it, with pills etc.
Click to expand...

A bit of a broad brush, but yes, a lot of the problems with our health care system can trace their roots to desire for ever increasing profits.
 
holbritter said:
"The pharmaceutical industry was in third place, with a 19.9 percent return, and the medical products and equipment industry was right behind it, with a 16.3 percent return."

BINGO!!!
Click to expand...

Last year, US giant Pfizer, the world's largest drug company by pharmaceutical revenue, made an eye-watering 42% profit margin.
As one industry veteran understandably says: "I wouldn't be able to justify [those kinds of margins]."

Even if they stripped out the one-off $10bn (£6.2bn) the company made from spinning off its animal health business leaves a margin of 24%, still pretty spectacular by any standard.

Last year, five pharmaceutical companies made a profit margin of 20% or more - Pfizer, Hoffmann-La Roche, AbbVie, GlaxoSmithKline (GSK) and Eli Lilly.
 
I'm Supposn said:
Federal insurance for catastrophic medical costs on behalf of individuals:
Click to expand...

I'll never get all the ways that is crap out.

First, Republicans can barely keep the lights on. I'd need to take a half dozen different psychedelics at the same time to think that lot would pass that legislation.

Second, Paul Ryan doesn't like social programs, been trying to kill them forever. That's the real guy. This is just political happy talk.

Third, the place where we can get the biggest improvement in national health stats at the lowest cost is preventitive care. Which means getting the poor basic, routine health care. A shot now can save a six figure bill later...

Fourth, it is highly unlikely to prevent the coming health care crisis. It doesn't get at the causes... One of the reasons that is true is because Republicans didn't want to see the government negotiate with drug companies (the way so many countries do) to get lower drug prices.

We can get basically the same health care results using the Brit system, and at half the cost.

I'd suggest spending more, we can afford it. But some sort of single payer is the way out of this mess.

There are health care system academics who spend their lives studying health care systems. If you want to know more, ask people that have a clue.
 
Helix said:
Same here. What I can tell you, though, is that you won't convince them even with charts and data. In their reality, the only way to fix our broken system is to deregulate it. I'd advise you not to waste your time.
Click to expand...

Because charts and data don't mention that for most americans.. including I think you.. since I think you have medicare (not sure though)... going to a single payer like most countries have.. would give you worse care.

There is no free lunch here. the decrease in cost comes at a price.
 
jaeger19 said:
Because charts and data don't mention that for most americans.. including I think you.. since I think you have medicare (not sure though)... going to a single payer like most countries have.. would give you worse care.

There is no free lunch here. the decrease in cost comes at a price.
Click to expand...

The Brits have health care stats similar to ours at half the cost.

Our system is a nightmare headed for a meltdown.
 
DLLS said:
What about the little child that was denied proper medical care in England recently? The parents were prohibited from taking the kid to another country where he could have received proper care.

What about the Canadians who come to the United States for operations?

On a side note when Michelle Obama was at her "job" at a Chicago hospital she helped David Axlerod deny care to indigent persons in order to have more beds available for persons who could pay. I put job in quotes because her function was so vital the position, created by Valerie Jarret, was not filled after she left.

The left keeps arguing that insurance costs will raise under Trump while ignoring that each year Obamacare was in effect both premiums and deductibles rose every year.
Click to expand...

All of medical costs...rise every year.

More partisan vicious attack of bull****, denigration and demonization of the opposition and it really is getting old and foolish.

Mrs. Obama in fact, would not make a very profitable capitalist. The capitalist would just kick them to the streets to do the right thing...die.
Let the right twist and spin, soon enough voters will retaliate at the polls.

Michelle Obama helped create the program, which aims to find neighborhood doctors for low-income people who were flooding the emergency room for basic treatment.

Hospital officials say such patients hinder their ability to focus on more critically ill patients in need of specialized care, such as cancer treatment and organ transplants.

Called care triage. But for the capitalist selection of patients...who should just go ahead and die.

Obama’s top political strategist, David Axelrod, co-owns the firm, ASK Public Strategies, that was hired by the hospital last year to sell the program,
called the Urban Health Initiative to the community as a better alternative for poor patients.

Obama’s wife and Valerie Jarrett, an Obama friend and adviser who chairs the medical center’s board, backed the Axelrod firm’s hiring, hospital officials said.

The Canadians who come to America are seeking specialists that most all north Americans can't afford and only because yep, they...are rich enough.
 
late said:
The Brits have health care stats similar to ours at half the cost.

Our system is a nightmare headed for a meltdown.
Click to expand...

Nightmare for patients and I am sure...lots of nurses, but don't see the meltdown, only younger deaths.

Life expectancy in the US has stopped going up. Europe's has not.
 
Pedestrian said:
Nightmare for patients and I am sure...lots of nurses, but don't see the meltdown, only younger deaths.

Life expectancy in the US has stopped going up. Europe's has not.
Click to expand...

Hospitals are closing, costs rising, a big shortage of Docs and nurses expected, lack of preparedness for disaster...

The Boomers are going to hit health care like a tidal wave hitting a bamboo hut.
 
jaeger19 said:
Because charts and data don't mention that for most americans.. including I think you.. since I think you have medicare (not sure though)... going to a single payer like most countries have.. would give you worse care.

There is no free lunch here. the decrease in cost comes at a price.
Click to expand...

You and I have exhausted this topic. You're immune to data, you want what you believe to be true too much for honest debate, and I don't waste time with willful blindness. Go ahead and post the last response to make yourself feel better, and then we can be done with it.
 
Pedestrian said:
Last year, US giant Pfizer, the world's largest drug company by pharmaceutical revenue, made an eye-watering 42% profit margin.
As one industry veteran understandably says: "I wouldn't be able to justify [those kinds of margins]."

Even if they stripped out the one-off $10bn (£6.2bn) the company made from spinning off its animal health business leaves a margin of 24%, still pretty spectacular by any standard.

Last year, five pharmaceutical companies made a profit margin of 20% or more - Pfizer, Hoffmann-La Roche, AbbVie, GlaxoSmithKline (GSK) and Eli Lilly.
Click to expand...

in 2017 GSK had top line revenue of 30,188 (in millions)
income before tax was 3,525 (in millions)
income tax 278
net after taxes 3,247 (in millions)

according to my math...that is no where close to a 20% return...these are right off the TD ameritrade fundamentals charts

LLY (elli Lilly 2017 numbers)
LLY had top line revenue of 22,871 (in millions)
income before tax 2,197 (in millions)
income tax 488
net income after tax 1,710 (in millions)

so if you are referring to Gross Profit top line....20% is nothing in some businesses...expenses eat much of that up

But these companies are NOWHERE near 20% net profit per actual annual companies reports
 
late said:
The Brits have health care stats similar to ours at half the cost.

Our system is a nightmare headed for a meltdown.
Click to expand...

Depends on what you are talking about. They do better at preventative medicine.

But if you have cancer.. and have insurance in the US.. you are much more likely to be alive after 5 years in the US versus Britain.
And we have more choice, less wait times for specialists and in general get more paid for than the brits. that's in part why their system costs less.

And.. what do you think happens to our economy when you kill about a quarter of our GDP?
 
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