More recent evidence that capitalism would reduce health care costs 80%

James972 · Jan 3, 2018

wolfsgirl said:
How would capitalism reduce health care costs by 80%?

people get rich under capitalism and can afford everything. China had 60 million starving to death under liberalism now under Republican capitalism they are getting rich and can easily afford stuff. Do you understand?

James972 · Jan 3, 2018

Nickyjo said:
I want prices set by the free market too. That’s why I want the government to negotiate.

when we say free market we mean between numerous buyers and sellers, not between one govt and one industry. Econ 101. Do you understand?

James972 · Jan 3, 2018

Nickyjo said:
Medicare costs three times as much as what? What do I spend $10,000 a year on?

Medicare costs 3 times as much as similar care in Europe!!! Medicare costs $12,000 a year per person. Do you understand?

James972 · Jan 3, 2018

wolfsgirl said:
HOW will competition reduce cost of medical care by 80%?

when you compete on basis of price, price goes down. Do you understand this basic concept. If you have a higher price people don't buy from you. Can the liberal grasp the concept?

James972 · Jan 3, 2018

Nickyjo said:
No I don’t. Are you suggesting the government should pay the drug companies whatever they want? .

for 10th time we are suggesting Republican capitalism wherein free market sets price.

wolfsgirl · Jan 3, 2018

James972 said:
people get rich under capitalism and can afford everything. China had 60 million starving to death under liberalism now under Republican capitalism they are getting rich and can easily afford stuff. Do you understand?

Try again.

HOW WOULD CAPITALISM REDUCE HEALTH CARE COSTS BY 80%? That is your claim, back it up.

wolfsgirl · Jan 3, 2018

James972 said:
when you compete on basis of price, price goes down. Do you understand this basic concept. If you have a higher price people don't buy from you. Can the liberal grasp the concept?

You can not make the price go down lower than the actual cost of an item. 60% of hospital overhead is labor cost. How do you lower the labor cost by 80%?

James972 · Jan 3, 2018

wolfsgirl said:
How do you lower the labor cost by 80%?

Republican capitalist competition obviously. Our health care costs is 3-4 four times what they pay in Europe so we know there is huge waste in our system.

Quag · Jan 3, 2018

wolfsgirl said:
You can not make the price go down lower than the actual cost of an item. 60% of hospital overhead is labor cost. How do you lower the labor cost by 80%?

Cut the pay to workers by 80% Those nurses and doctors are way overpaid already. Min wage for doctors and below min wage for nurses. Plus drop the min wage to 1$ a day (assuming it isn't scrapped altogether)

Exactice · Jan 3, 2018

wolfsgirl said:
You can not make the price go down lower than the actual cost of an item. 60% of hospital overhead is labor cost. How do you lower the labor cost by 80%?

Yes but you can set realistic cost rather than bloated cost.

Think housing market....... Actual Replacement Cost for a structure... but the Market Value is 3-10x more..... I live in a state where the market is so Bad..... 500sqft 1969 condo, $300,000 market price... WTF is that? My sister lives in a state 10,000sqft lot with 4 bedroom house for $65,000

This goes the same with Wages...... $8.25 per per current minimum wage. ($17,160 annual salary) This is supposed to be the bottom LOW wage low skilled, low educated position. Now add in benefits.... you are looking at about $20,000 annual cost.

I am an individual business owner that started from scratch... i learned to live off of $17,000 NET Cash per year for 3 years.... now I have a business that does about $2mill gross sales a year..... Why because I worked hard.... has NOTHING to do with overhead but more to do about INDIVIDUAL motivation..... peoples needs vs wants and reality....

James972 · Jan 3, 2018

Exactice said:
Yes but you can set realistic cost rather than bloated cost.
.

good point most hospitals are so bloated they have no idea what their costs are. In CA routine surgery can range from $5-50K. This means that one hospital has at least $45k or 90% waste in their price that could be instantly eliminated with Republican capitalism, but because liberals will lack the IQ to understand capitalism all American suffer at least an $8000 loss each year.

wolfsgirl · Jan 3, 2018

James972 said:
Republican capitalist competition obviously. Our health care costs is 3-4 four times what they pay in Europe so we know there is huge waste in our system.

Europe has a government controlled system in most areas. How would doing the opposite of what they are doing have the same or better results.

Seriously you are starting to sound like the underwear gnomes.

Step 1. Collect underpants.

Step 2. ????????

Step 3. Profit.

Simply saying that capitalism will reduce prices by 80% is not showing how it would work.
I could claim that eating fried chicken will reduce carbon emissions, but without showing how it would do so it is just a claim.

wolfsgirl · Jan 3, 2018

Exactice said:
Yes but you can set realistic cost rather than bloated cost.

Think housing market....... Actual Replacement Cost for a structure... but the Market Value is 3-10x more..... I live in a state where the market is so Bad..... 500sqft 1969 condo, $300,000 market price... WTF is that? My sister lives in a state 10,000sqft lot with 4 bedroom house for $65,000

This goes the same with Wages...... $8.25 per per current minimum wage. ($17,160 annual salary) This is supposed to be the bottom LOW wage low skilled, low educated position. Now add in benefits.... you are looking at about $20,000 annual cost.

I am an individual business owner that started from scratch... i learned to live off of $17,000 NET Cash per year for 3 years.... now I have a business that does about $2mill gross sales a year..... Why because I worked hard.... has NOTHING to do with overhead but more to do about INDIVIDUAL motivation..... peoples needs vs wants and reality....

So what is a realistic cost for labor in hospitals? What do you think that doctors and nurses should get paid?

James972 · Jan 3, 2018

wolfsgirl said:
Europe has a government controlled system in most areas. How would doing the opposite of what they are doing have the same or better results.

Ever heard of Cuba /Florida? People in Florida are rich and can afford everything thanks to Republican capitalism. People in Cuba are poor thanks to socialism and cant afford anything. Now do you understand?

James972 · Jan 3, 2018

wolfsgirl said:
Simply saying that capitalism will reduce prices by 80% is not showing how it would work.
I could claim that eating fried chicken will reduce carbon emissions, but without showing how it would do so it is just a claim.

ever heard of East /West Germany? Ever heard of Hong Kong/ Red China. Republican capitalism makes things affordable. Now do you understand?

James972 · Jan 3, 2018

wolfsgirl said:
So what is a realistic cost for labor in hospitals? What do you think that doctors and nurses should get paid?

only years of relentless competition can determine that. Who knew that competition would turn the main frame into a smart phone. Theranos had a plan to do self blood tests and eliminate 70% of doctor visits. Nurse practicioners can do 80% of ER work at 10% of the cost.

wolfsgirl · Jan 3, 2018

James972 said:
Ever heard of Cuba /Florida? People in Florida are rich and can afford everything thanks to Republican capitalism. People in Cuba are poor thanks to socialism and cant afford anything. Now do you understand?

I'm from Florida, and I can tell you first hand that not everyone in Florida is rich and can afford everything. Try again.

wolfsgirl · Jan 3, 2018

James972 said:
only years of relentless competition can determine that. Who knew that competition would turn the main frame into a smart phone. Theranos had a plan to do self blood tests and eliminate 70% of doctor visits. Nurse practicioners can do 80% of ER work at 10% of the cost.

Physician average salary $187 k
Nurse practitioner average salary $104 k

That is not 10% of the cost.

Try again.

Nickyjo · Jan 3, 2018

James972 said:
when we say free market we mean between numerous buyers and sellers, not between one govt and one industry. Econ 101. Do you understand?

You described a world that you apparently wish should be. Fine. Work to bring it about. In the world that is, want the government to continue to negotiate.

Nickyjo · Jan 3, 2018

James972 said:
Medicare costs 3 times as much as similar care in Europe!!! Medicare costs $12,000 a year per person. Do you understand?

Fine. Let’s have hearings and fix it. Meanwhile I am glad to have it.

Nickyjo · Jan 3, 2018

James972 said:
for 10th time we are suggesting Republican capitalism wherein free market sets price.

I don’t understand. When you buy in great quantities you generally can negotiate the price. Adam Smith and Ayn Rand would approve. All part of the free market. Car dealer sets the price, I offer less, we split the difference. If I bought 100 cars, I probably would be a fool not to ask for an even lower price per. Ditto Pentagon and 100 Jeep’s. No contradiction here. Go to a flea market or garage sale to see what I am talking about. Don’t republicans want to save taxpayers money? If Bayer wants to charge the VA, Medicare patients, etc. $100 per aspirin, the government shouldn’t negotiate? What am I missing about capitalism when I ask my government to get a better deal with my money? Maybe the 11th explanation will clear things up.

James972 · Jan 3, 2018

Nickyjo said:
What am I missing about capitalism

capitalism assumes many buyers and many sellers not one buyer( govt) and one seller( colluding drug companies) .

Theory of Capitalism | The Center on Capitalism and Society
capitalism.columbia.edu/theory-capitalism
The Debate Over Capitalism The claims for capitalism differ from the classical case for a competitive market economy. Adam Smith's thesis two centuries ago was that the presence of many buyers and many sellers competing with one another in the marketplace would weed out wasteful resource allocations “as if by an .

Nickyjo · Jan 3, 2018

James972 said:
capitalism assumes many buyers and many sellers not one buyer( govt) and one seller( colluding drug companies) .

Theory of Capitalism | The Center on Capitalism and Society
capitalism.columbia.edu/theory-capitalism
The Debate Over Capitalism The claims for capitalism differ from the classical case for a competitive market economy. Adam Smith's thesis two centuries ago was that the presence of many buyers and many sellers competing with one another in the marketplace would weed out wasteful resource allocations “as if by an .

In this case, that is medical care, why should it bother me? I do not want to read prospectuses from a dozen private insurance companies and try to imagine how I will be sick 20 years from now. Adam Smiths ideas are fine when I buy my kid a skateboard. The entire industrialized world has government provided health insurance in one form or another. They apparently are healthier. I have heard nothing from Canada, Europe, etc. of movements to replace their terrible, freedom-crushing systems with the one we had prior to the ACA. (And please don’t post anecdotes about a guy from Sweden who came to the US so he could get a knee replacement more guickly.). I assume that 20-30 years from now the shouting will be over, and conservatives will be fussing over some new liberal idea, having accepted Obamacare or what it evolves into —but careful not to mention the president it was named after.

James972 · Jan 3, 2018

Nickyjo said:
I have heard nothing from Canada, Europe, etc. of movements to replace their terrible, freedom-crushing systems with the one we had prior to the ACA. .

Republicans don't want to go back to that goofy spaghetti socialist system we had before ACA. We want capitalism to reduce prices 80% and add 10-20 years to our life expectancies. Now do you understand?

James972 · Jan 3, 2018

Nickyjo said:
I—but careful not to mention the president it was named after.

Obama presided over the worst economy since the Great Depression and had 3 communist parents. what does that teach you?