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Dementia Care

Manc Skipper

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Dementia is a growing problem as we all grow older and live longer. During a discussion here in the UK someone claimed that "dementia care" is not seen as needing specialist skills under Medicare, as other physical debilitating conditions might be. Is this true?
 
"If the person with Alzheimer's or dementia is a Medicare beneficiary, Medicare will pay for some, but not all, care costs."
"There are Medicare Special Needs Plans (SNPs) available for individuals with dementia, including Alzheimer’s disease. SNPs are Medicare Advantage plans that specialize in care and coverage for beneficiaries with dementia. Only Medicare beneficiaries with dementia can enroll in these plans. Learn more information about Medicare SNPs in Medicare's Guide to SNPs."

https://www.alz.org/care/alzheimers-dementia-medicare.asp

Seems someone with dementia would need the SNP. Basic Medicare will not meet all of the persons needs.

https://www.medicare.gov/sign-up-ch...care-advantage-plans/special-needs-plans.html
 
Kind of. Out here we've got dementia care broken down into "memory care" and "nursing home". A memory care facility will generally handle people who can still handle some of their daily needs independently while a nursing home is for people who need help with pretty much everything. There's a lot of crossover because dementia manifests itself differently in different patients and because a lot of families are in denial regarding how much care their family member needs. As a rule, a memory care facility will be overseen by an MD and RNs but most of the care is provided by semi-skilled staff. A nursing home will generally have a higher proportion of medical professionals on hand.
 
Dementia is a growing problem as we all grow older and live longer. During a discussion here in the UK someone claimed that "dementia care" is not seen as needing specialist skills under Medicare, as other physical debilitating conditions might be. Is this true?

Having run an adult family home for a while with two residents with dementia, well, whoever said they don't need specialized care doesn't know what they're talking about. I know you're probably referring to what Medicare allows or doesn't allow - and Mike2810 gave a great answer in comment #2 - but when it comes to dementia, it also depends on the type and severity of dementia. Here in WA state, a social worker will come and conduct a determination of the level of need, and then the state will proceed from there. The state is happy to support family members' efforts to keep them at home, but most will wind up in an adult family home, a nursing home, or a memory care facility...if if that person's family can't pay, then the state will pay (but all the person's assets become the property of the state in order to at least partially defray the cost). That, and if the resident is under the age of 65, it's normally done through Medicaid instead.
 
Dementia is a growing problem as we all grow older and live longer. During a discussion here in the UK someone claimed that "dementia care" is not seen as needing specialist skills under Medicare, as other physical debilitating conditions might be. Is this true?

Alzhimer’s patients, as the disease progresses, generally need custodial care. Medicare, of course, will pay for any underlying diseases and conditions that are eligible, but Medicare does not pay for custodial care beyond a certain number of days. So if custodial care becomes too much for family, a nursing home or in-home round-the-clock professional caretaking or mixture of both is the only option. Medicare does not pick up those costs.

If the patient has assets, those assets go first to cover nursing home costs, as an example. When they are exhausted (there are some rules to prevent impoverishing a spouse), Medicaid will step in and pick up all nursing home costs.

Medicaid beds in nursing homes are most often restricted because Medicaid pays so little. In our area, a good nursing home, one you’d want to leave mom in, costs upwards of $9,000 a month. That high cost helps the nursing home defray the Medicaid shortfall.

Often, children don’t want to see their parents’ assets disappear for nursing home care, so a few things might happen. The worst is that the patient is left alone when he/she shouldn’t be, poorly taken care of, etc. I actually know a family who, it was later found, left their mother alone at home while the “caretaker” worked. She was locked in, windows nailed shut, left to stay dirty all day because the person had no bowel or bladder control, etc. It is pathetic to think that her three children would try so hard to conserve her assets that they wouldn’t even pay for a PART-TIME in-home caretaker. When she died, they divided up over $400,000,which still left a home that the caretaker lives in to this day.

The next thing family will try to do is to mis-appropriate a person’s assets and split them up ahead of time so that they can then claim Medicaid benefits and the children still get a parent’s money. Medicaid is on to this, though, and will claw BACK those stolen assets or, much worse, exempt the person from any coverage at all until the stolen money is made up. Example...

A patient has $90,000. Her three children gift themselves $30,000 each to impoverish her so she’s eligible for Medicaid. They apply. Medicaid does a forensic examination of the patient’s finances, finds the $90,000 missing, and demands payback before mom will be covered by Medicaid. If they cannot pay it back, then Medicaid will use a regional average monthly rate of, let’s say, $7,000 a month, and, with that example, would require mom to pay her own way for approx. thirteen months before they would step in.

Of course, no one in the family can pay for those thirteen months, so the family must scramble to find a nursing home willing to take mom for 13 months free anticipating Medicaid’s eventual takeover of mom’s expenses. Can you imagine the ****hole they find?

There are other ways, other horror stories. But the upshot is that Medicare does not pay for custodial care, not even in their generous and wonderful hospice program.
 
Having run an adult family home for a while with two residents with dementia, well, whoever said they don't need specialized care doesn't know what they're talking about. I know you're probably referring to what Medicare allows or doesn't allow - and Mike2810 gave a great answer in comment #2 - but when it comes to dementia, it also depends on the type and severity of dementia. Here in WA state, a social worker will come and conduct a determination of the level of need, and then the state will proceed from there. The state is happy to support family members' efforts to keep them at home, but most will wind up in an adult family home, a nursing home, or a memory care facility...if if that person's family can't pay, then the state will pay (but all the person's assets become the property of the state in order to at least partially defray the cost). That, and if the resident is under the age of 65, it's normally done through Medicaid instead.

Thanks. I'm RN Mental health (retired) where the UK has specialist mental health nurses who can "sub-specialise"? in elderly care. It came up discussion where a carer of a PWD (person with dementia) made the bald statement (but tangential) that Medicare didn't cover specialist dementia care at all. Seems he was half-right.
Thanks for the indepth replies! Wish I'd thought of you guys sooner, it's nearly 3am!
 
Thanks. I'm RN Mental health (retired) where the UK has specialist mental health nurses who can "sub-specialise"? in elderly care. It came up discussion where a carer of a PWD (person with dementia) made the bald statement (but tangential) that Medicare didn't cover specialist dementia care at all. Seems he was half-right.
Thanks for the indepth replies! Wish I'd thought of you guys sooner, it's nearly 3am!

And actually.. in its possible that a diagnosis of dementia can preclude a patient from getting services in other disciplines like Speech, physiotherapy and occupational therapy or certain orthopedic surgeries etc. If a person has a dementia diagnosis it can cause a denial in these services.
 
And actually.. in its possible that a diagnosis of dementia can preclude a patient from getting services in other disciplines like Speech, physiotherapy and occupational therapy or certain orthopedic surgeries etc. If a person has a dementia diagnosis it can cause a denial in these services.

yeah, well, sadly there is only 5 bucks left in the wallet... And I am only 33 and have no disease, yet I am responsible for the wallet, somehow...to make sure there is 5 buck for someone somehow i dont even know , yet I owe them.
Sadder, when I get sick - nothing in them there wallet for me. I might as well die in the ditch
 
It's very devastating when a love one/parent comes down with dementia...especially a mother.
I feel for the families that are going through...it's tough.
I want to be corrected on this but the irony is when a parent no longer recognizes their children and their earlier lives together.
From what I understand there are medications for treatment or to ease the symptoms temporary.
I hope some day there will be a stronger treatment without worrying about negative reactions. We here so much on television about "taken so and so my cause..."
Of course there are risks....a number of them.
I wish we can take medications with little to no risks in helping to ease/control dementia.
 
Rough stuff, a friend and former roomate of mine has early onset alzheimers, he is only 52 years old, wife, 4 kids. Devastating.
 
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