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Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevitable

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https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin...489b735b3a3_story.html?utm_term=.cd5566ad8694

A broad national consensus is developing that health care is indeed a right. This is historically new. And it carries immense implications for the future. It suggests that we may be heading inexorably to a government-run, single-payer system. It’s what Barack Obama once admitted he would have preferred but didn’t think the country was ready for. It may be ready now.

As Obamacare continues to unravel, it won’t take much for Democrats to abandon that Rube Goldberg wreckage and go for the simplicity and the universality of Medicare-for-all. Republicans will have one last chance to try to persuade the country to remain with a market-based system, preferably one encompassing all the provisions that, for procedural reasons, had been left out of their latest proposal.

Don’t be surprised, however, if, in the end, single-payer wins out. Indeed, I wouldn’t be terribly surprised if Donald Trump, reading the zeitgeist, pulls the greatest 180 since Disraeli “dished the Whigs” in 1867 (by radically expanding the franchise) and joins the single-payer side.

Talk about disruption? About kicking over the furniture? That would be an American Krakatoa

Krauthammer says the current debate has shifted American belief into healthcare being a right, delivered to us in a single-payer system. Krauthammer doesn't support single-payer but, he acknowledges that single-payer is a reality. He can read the writing on the wall. He's honest enough to read the signs. 60% of Americans support single-payer healthcare. It's telling that Krauthammer, a conservative journalist sees the reality of the American dialogue.

If they pass the AHCA and its designed outcomes take effect, millions of Americans will lose healthcare and premiums for people with pre-existing conditions will skyrocket. After being betrayed by Trump, can the American constituency be expected to continue to act without reproach. People are hurting out there and Trump told them he would help them. the AHCA doesn't do that but, single-payer does. Single-payer is coming, the AHCA will be a minor speed bump, even Charles Krauthammer can see it.
 
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Re: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevit

It is not surprising that 60% favor almost any new federal entitlement when 47% pay little or no federal income tax. The great myth is that taxing "the rich" (just a bit?) more can and will pay for any and all such new entitlements. At age 63, and ready to retire, I can almost agree. I say almost because I know that while I won't be paying any more federal income tax, I also know that nothing is free and that the required tax increases will be passed down to everyone in the form of higher prices for many (most?) goods and services making my fixed retirement income less able to meet my needs and wants.
 
Re: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevit

Healthcare is a service. As a service, it can never be a human right. It cannot even be a constitutional or statutory right, legally, in the United States.
 
Re: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevit

Humans and the societies that they create decide what human rights are. If American society or any society concludes that healthcare is a human right than at least within the context of that society, that's what it is.
 
Re: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevit

“We have a failing health care — I shouldn't say this to our great gentleman and my friend from Australia, because you have better health care than we do,” a tuxedo-clad Trump said at a meeting with Australian Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull in Manhattan on Thursday.

In his 2000 book, 'The America We Deserve,” Trump wrote: “We must have universal health care.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...ealth-care-than-we-do/?utm_term=.c238fa87e032

I personally wouldn't mind seeing a form of single-payer healthcare in the United States.
 
Re: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevit

It is not surprising that 60% favor almost any new federal entitlement when 47% pay little or no federal income tax. The great myth is that taxing "the rich" (just a bit?) more can and will pay for any and all such new entitlements. At age 63, and ready to retire, I can almost agree. I say almost because I know that while I won't be paying any more federal income tax, I also know that nothing is free and that the required tax increases will be passed down to everyone in the form of higher prices for many (most?) goods and services making my fixed retirement income less able to meet my needs and wants.

While I agree that taxes on companies are forwarded to consumers...

Single-payer actually saves you money. Your prescription drug prices will go down. And individual health care costs in the country, will go down. I don't know what your premium is but, the numbers I've ran is around $3,000 for the individual and $6,000 for the mother and father of one middle income household, added together. This is using Bernie's single-payer proposal of a 6.5% payroll tax.

Business as a whole benefits, because right now, they are burdened by purchasing insurance for employees. That entire administrative cost goes away for most of America.

We're not talking FIT here, single-payer would be a separate witholding. And I don't want to do anything to jeopardize your livelihood in your retirement. We need to find something that works for everyone.
 
Re: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevit

Humans and the societies that they create decide what human rights are. If American society or any society concludes that healthcare is a human right than at least within the context of that society, that's what it is.

Societies can grant certain privileges and they can call those privileges "rights" but that is different from the "natural rights" protected by our Constitution.

The right to life, for example, can not be granted by society. It can be taken away by society but no legislative act can create life. Likewise, the right to liberty can be suspended by a society but society can not create freedom.

The "human rights" folks today are so fond of are wonderful principles on which to base a society but, since they require the force of government to enforce, are not natural.
 
Re: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevit

It is not surprising that 60% favor almost any new federal entitlement when 47% pay little or no federal income tax. The great myth is that taxing "the rich" (just a bit?) more can and will pay for any and all such new entitlements. At age 63, and ready to retire, I can almost agree. I say almost because I know that while I won't be paying any more federal income tax, I also know that nothing is free and that the required tax increases will be passed down to everyone in the form of higher prices for many (most?) goods and services making my fixed retirement income less able to meet my needs and wants.

Well I am turning 65 and hubby is turning 69 and we are still paying federal income tax. The last 8 years have been devastating to our portfolio and we certainly had major loses to claim but it didn't stop still owing.

It has gotten to the point if you have anything of value you best unload it and hide the money and play poor enough for special treatment and benefits.

Twitt neither hubby and I have ever taken payments from the government all our lives. No unemployment, not welfare, no anything until it came to being forced into Medicare and Social Security. What a nightmare it has been for us dealing with the Federal Government. I can not comprehend why anyone after this experience would be so willing to allow the Federal government run anything in their lives. Seriously.

It has been real tempting the last 8 years to give the kids and grandkids their inheritance early because the way things were going it would be much less if this insane game continued.

Hubby and I did everything right. We saved for our retirement, We did without to do so. We have always been self sufficient from day one. And today we are being penalized for it.

I am so tired Twitt of the BS that somehow in my "golden years" after spending a lifetime doing everything right am being penalized for it.
 
Re: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevit

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin...489b735b3a3_story.html?utm_term=.cd5566ad8694



Krauthammer says the current debate has shifted American belief into healthcare being a right, delivered to us in a single-payer system. Krauthammer doesn't support single-payer but, he acknowledges that single-payer is a reality. He can read the writing on the wall. He's honest enough to read the signs. 60% of Americans support single-payer healthcare. It's telling that Krauthammer, a conservative journalist sees the reality of the American dialogue.

If they pass the AHCA and its designed outcomes take effect, millions of Americans will lose healthcare and premiums for people with pre-existing conditions will skyrocket. After being betrayed by Trump, can the American constituency be expected to continue to act without reproach. People are hurting out there and Trump told them he would help them. the AHCA doesn't do that but, single-payer does. Single-payer is coming, the AHCA will be a minor speed bump, even Charles Krauthammer can see it.



He's right...it is inevitable.

Every other industrialized country has universal health care. I have been saying since 2008 that the US could save itself a lot of heartache by simply coming on board with the rest of the world.

However, it seems there are too many "**** you, I've got mine" thinkers. And as usual right-wing ideology crumbles in close examination.

As I have repeatedly said is that at my top wage in broadcasting, hell at any wage, I never paid more than my US counterparts in taxes; in fact each time I looked at opportunities south of the line, I would have had to have had a substantial raise to cover the cost of health insurance in the US.

The problem is the "haves" are afraid they might have to give up something from their "Cadillac" of health care systems so that others have an opportunity to have any health care.

FFS, the US has had tax funded public school longer than most other industrialized countries...how is it a basic education is a right and health is not?
 
Re: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevit

He's right...it is inevitable.

Every other industrialized country has universal health care. I have been saying since 2008 that the US could save itself a lot of heartache by simply coming on board with the rest of the world.

However, it seems there are too many "**** you, I've got mine" thinkers. And as usual right-wing ideology crumbles in close examination.

As I have repeatedly said is that at my top wage in broadcasting, hell at any wage, I never paid more than my US counterparts in taxes; in fact each time I looked at opportunities south of the line, I would have had to have had a substantial raise to cover the cost of health insurance in the US.

The problem is the "haves" are afraid they might have to give up something from their "Cadillac" of health care systems so that others have an opportunity to have any health care.

FFS, the US has had tax funded public school longer than most other industrialized countries...how is it a basic education is a right and health is not?

The exorbitantly, disgustingly wealthy people, who were mad about Obamacare subsidies.. can opt out of the public pool and buy private anyway. So, I don't know what they're bitching about. I think it's the same in Canada. In Germany, the two tiered system, allows the grotesquely wealthy people, who would never in a million years, have to worry about healthcare costs, even if there wasn't a public pool, can opt out of the public pool, in favor of deluxe, "Cadillac" plans.

There is a concerted effort in the alt-right blogosphere to misinform the American public about single-payer. The right feels threatened by it. They even sabotaged Obamacare by disrupting "risk corridors" necessary for stable function. They literally trolled the Democrats at the American people's loss. Their behavior is unconscionable. They cannot have any leftwing program succeed because, they view it as an encroachment on their freedom and an erosion of the Constitution. Apparently, people who have pre-existing conditions should have the freedom to pay millions of dollars when they're priced out of insurance.
 
Re: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevit

Every industrialized nations I know who have universal healthcare, aka socialized medicine have huge debt to try and maintain always in the hole in any ending of a fiscal year. That's the facts Jack.

You know what I find appalling is those of you who live outside the U.S. who like to tout their socialized medicine are often old farts who in their socialized system drain the funds taking away limited funds from those much younger on a waiting list. There is nothing glamorus about that at all....carry on...
 
Re: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevit

Thread: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevitable

The GOP has been working very hard to make sure this is the case.
 
Re: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevit

While I agree that taxes on companies are forwarded to consumers...

Single-payer actually saves you money. Your prescription drug prices will go down. And individual health care costs in the country, will go down. I don't know what your premium is but, the numbers I've ran is around $3,000 for the individual and $6,000 for the mother and father of one middle income household, added together. This is using Bernie's single-payer proposal of a 6.5% payroll tax.

Business as a whole benefits, because right now, they are burdened by purchasing insurance for employees. That entire administrative cost goes away for most of America.

We're not talking FIT here, single-payer would be a separate withholding. And I don't want to do anything to jeopardize your livelihood in your retirement. We need to find something that works for everyone.

How is it possible to have about 18% of the economy supported by a 6.5% tax? Are you assuming that Medicare, Medicaid and VA will remain? If so, that is at least a 21.8% (total) payroll tax being proposed. The supporters of UHC talk of everyone being covered yet not everyone is on a payroll - thus it seems to boil down to those on someone's payroll (US workers?) still pay the entire cost of UHC yet get no greater benefit than those not working.
 
Re: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevit

How is it possible to have about 18% of the economy supported by a 6.5% tax? Are you assuming that Medicare, Medicaid and VA will remain? If so, that is at least a 21.8% (total) payroll tax being proposed. The supporters of UHC talk of everyone being covered yet not everyone is on a payroll - thus it seems to boil down to those on someone's payroll (US workers?) still pay the entire cost of UHC yet get no greater benefit than those not working.

That's the magic of cooperation. The numbers are there but you have to make everyone pay. VA, Medicare, and Medicaid, would be rolled into UHC. So, since you're already paying for the poor on Medicaid, why not make it easy on everyone and go single-payer. And if you're disgustingly rich like over 250k/year, you can opt out of the public health pool and buy your own.
 
Re: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevit

Every industrialized nations I know who have universal healthcare, aka socialized medicine have huge debt to try and maintain always in the hole in any ending of a fiscal year. That's the facts Jack.

You know what I find appalling is those of you who live outside the U.S. who like to tout their socialized medicine are often old farts who in their socialized system drain the funds taking away limited funds from those much younger on a waiting list. There is nothing glamorus about that at all....carry on...

Germany runs a budget surplus and has lower wait time than the U.S. and lower costs.
 
Re: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevit

Societies can grant certain privileges and they can call those privileges "rights" but that is different from the "natural rights" protected by our Constitution.

The right to life, for example, can not be granted by society. It can be taken away by society but no legislative act can create life. Likewise, the right to liberty can be suspended by a society but society can not create freedom.

The "human rights" folks today are so fond of are wonderful principles on which to base a society but, since they require the force of government to enforce, are not natural.

Where do these "natural rights" originate? It sounds like you are saying that they are just floating around out there waiting for people to discover them. If that is the case how do we know that we have discovered all them?

What exactly is the "right to life"?

You yourself are basing society on a set of wonderful principles. In this respect, it seems that you are no different than the "human rights" folks. You simply appear to view your set of wonderful principles, which I imagine most human rights folks would endorse, as somehow more real, more valid, than the presumably, fake, made-up rights that you exclude from your list.
 
Re: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevit

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin...489b735b3a3_story.html?utm_term=.cd5566ad8694



Krauthammer says the current debate has shifted American belief into healthcare being a right, delivered to us in a single-payer system. Krauthammer doesn't support single-payer but, he acknowledges that single-payer is a reality. He can read the writing on the wall. He's honest enough to read the signs. 60% of Americans support single-payer healthcare. It's telling that Krauthammer, a conservative journalist sees the reality of the American dialogue.

If they pass the AHCA and its designed outcomes take effect, millions of Americans will lose healthcare and premiums for people with pre-existing conditions will skyrocket. After being betrayed by Trump, can the American constituency be expected to continue to act without reproach. People are hurting out there and Trump told them he would help them. the AHCA doesn't do that but, single-payer does. Single-payer is coming, the AHCA will be a minor speed bump, even Charles Krauthammer can see it.

What The Charles has indicated in the past is single payer as a bill clearing house is OK, but socialized medicine is not. Many liberals confuse the two.

Let's not forget that the entire medical system was upended for the uninsured. It had nothing to do with "payers", it had to do with uninsured patients. So as it stood under Obama, it became a income redistribution system scheme between those who were subsidized and those who weren't, and the income levels for each coincidentally were cleaved at the democrats "sweet spot" demographic. Since conservatives tend to be middle class and have higher incomes, they were paying taxes and not getting subsidies. The poorer were getting subsidies and paying lower taxes and able to use their subsidized plan whereas the middle class struggled with the deductibles.

Lastly, Obamacare was sold as a cheaper version of "what you had before", and it was not. Obamacare was built on lies spun out to those who wanted to believe the BS Obama was spewing. If anything all the hate directed at Republicans over Obama care is because the press is keeping you informed (quality of information, not withstanding), whereas with Obamacare, they were not. Your expectations and view of reality was, is, and will continue to be manipulated.
 
Re: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevit

That's the magic of cooperation. The numbers are there but you have to make everyone pay. VA, Medicare, and Medicaid, would be rolled into UHC. So, since you're already paying for the poor on Medicaid, why not make it easy on everyone and go single-payer. And if you're disgustingly rich like over 250k/year, you can opt out of the public health pool and buy your own.

Yet more contradiction - you simply cannot have it both ways. How does someone not working pay when you stated that UHC was to be funded (entirely?) by a payroll tax? If someone working can "opt out" of UHC then they obviously would not be expected to pay the UHC "premium" tax as well.

Convincing folks that VA and Medicare which they now get will (must?) be replaced by UHC is not likely to go well.
 
Re: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevit

The exorbitantly, disgustingly wealthy people, who were mad about Obamacare subsidies.. can opt out of the public pool and buy private anyway. So, I don't know what they're bitching about. I think it's the same in Canada. In Germany, the two tiered system, allows the grotesquely wealthy people, who would never in a million years, have to worry about healthcare costs, even if there wasn't a public pool, can opt out of the public pool, in favor of deluxe, "Cadillac" plans.

There is a concerted effort in the alt-right blogosphere to misinform the American public about single-payer. The right feels threatened by it. They even sabotaged Obamacare by disrupting "risk corridors" necessary for stable function. They literally trolled the Democrats at the American people's loss. Their behavior is unconscionable. They cannot have any leftwing program succeed because, they view it as an encroachment on their freedom and an erosion of the Constitution. Apparently, people who have pre-existing conditions should have the freedom to pay millions of dollars when they're priced out of insurance.



There is only one tier in Canada although some clinics are privately owned, their income comes from Health BC. It is illegal to charge a patient directly.
The grotesquely wealthy fly to Palm Springs, however to be kind, the richest man in BC has just announced $15,000,000 to help replace the downtown hospital, as well as some years ago spent $100,000,000 for the main hospital in the city.

It is the insurance industries who have waged the campaign against universal health care, they are billing billions each year which they stand to loose if universal health care is brought in to the largest, and last money pit.

That's who's behind the false news showing "Canadians" arriving by bus to get care. I know of two variations on that video, one of them I shot, of an organized pharmacy going to Blaine to buy supplements that at that time were banned in Canada. The campaign will intensify as the debate on what next continues....the last thing they want any American to do is think about universal health care.
 
Re: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevit

Well I am turning 65 and hubby is turning 69 and we are still paying federal income tax. The last 8 years have been devastating to our portfolio and we certainly had major loses to claim but it didn't stop still owing.

It has gotten to the point if you have anything of value you best unload it and hide the money and play poor enough for special treatment and benefits.

Twitt neither hubby and I have ever taken payments from the government all our lives. No unemployment, not welfare, no anything until it came to being forced into Medicare and Social Security. What a nightmare it has been for us dealing with the Federal Government. I can not comprehend why anyone after this experience would be so willing to allow the Federal government run anything in their lives. Seriously.

It has been real tempting the last 8 years to give the kids and grandkids their inheritance early because the way things were going it would be much less if this insane game continued.

Hubby and I did everything right. We saved for our retirement, We did without to do so. We have always been self sufficient from day one. And today we are being penalized for it.

I am so tired Twitt of the BS that somehow in my "golden years" after spending a lifetime doing everything right am being penalized for it.



So who is too blame, the government, the banks, or your investment choices?
 
Re: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevit

Yet more contradiction - you simply cannot have it both ways. How does someone not working pay when you stated that UHC was to be funded (entirely?) by a payroll tax? If someone working can "opt out" of UHC then they obviously would not be expected to pay the UHC "premium" tax as well.

Convincing folks that VA and Medicare which they now get will (must?) be replaced by UHC is not likely to go well.

people unemployed and on disability don't pay. but, they don't pay anyways. the government already pays for them. They're already on Medicaid. So, what's your point? that they are cheating? yes, they're "cheating" and they'll continue cheating whether or not someone who works hard enough to deserve healthcare gets it or not.

most the UHC systems are a "pay as you go" like SSC is. Fearandloathing has stated multiple times that he has had UHC since the 1960s, and his taxes have been less than Americans taxes, without the added cost of presription drugs and insurance premiums.
 
Re: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevit

Anything that can be taken away by a simple majority vote by 535 politicians is not a right.
 
Re: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevit

Humans and the societies that they create decide what human rights are. If American society or any society concludes that healthcare is a human right than at least within the context of that society, that's what it is.

I wish more people understood this.
 
Re: Prominent Conservative Charles Krauthammer Says Single-Payer Healthcare is Inevit

Single payer healthcare system, despite its name, doesn't automatically mean private insurance goes away. Most countries with government run UHC systems still have thriving, profitable, and cheap private health insurance for the things that aren't covered. This obsession with "choice" is kind of ridiculous when the alternative is so obviously better in almost every way. The only thing I worry about is that OUR government would be setting up this system and our government is beholden to so many special interests and is so partisan its going to be a **** show for a while.
 
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