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— So Police Take Away All His Guns and License to Carry

TurtleDude said:
That is not a proper crime. It is akin to blaming a woman for her rape by how she is dressed and where she is walking,
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I think a better analogy to compare it to would be to a woman who is raped and becomes pregnant by her rapist and reports the crime forcibly having her tubes tied so she can never become pregnant by a rapist again.
 
Wayne Jr said:
Well, it's not a matter of opinion. The criminal now has his gun because he failed to secure it.
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and you blame the victim not the criminal. I still haven't figured out your obsession over this issue.
 
TurtleDude said:
I reject your concept of his basic responsibilities


I hope that anti gun politicians are ruined financially for violating the constitutional rights of citizens. I'd prefer jail sentences of hard labor, followed by a permanent debarment from ever holding public office but I doubt that can be implemented. SO I will settle for the politicians and their state being sued jointly and severally for constitutional tort violations and that the verdicts be sufficiently vast to completely serve as a deterrent for other clowns in office from doing the same thing.
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TurtleDude:

I expected no less from you. I guess you live in a fundamentalist world of absolute rights and only notional responsibilities. I fear however that the years of foisting that fundamentalist world view on your fellow citizens are coming to an imminent close. A political tsunami is building and it will soon break on the shores of the gun-rights zealots' islands like yourself. When that wave hits and the politics cascade around you, you will have to choose between the rule of law and the rule of the gun. If you choose the former you will have to accept enhanced responsibility and an end to absolute rights. If you choose the latter you will have to choose the path of Cain and spill your fellow Americans' blood. You have free will to choose as you see fit. I hope you choose wisely and with reason rather than with visceral passion.

Peace be upon you.
Evilroddy.
 
Felis Leo said:
I think a better analogy to compare it to would be to a woman who is raped and becomes pregnant by her rapist and reports the crime forcibly having her tubes tied so she can never become pregnant by a rapist again.
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that works-or is forced to wear a chastity belt that only a government agent has the key to
 
Evilroddy said:
TurtleDude:

I expected no less from you. I guess you live in a fundamentalist world of absolute rights and only notional responsibilities. I fear however that the years of foisting that fundamentalist world view on your fellow citizens are coming to an imminent close. A political tsunami is building and it will soon break on the shores of the gun-rights zealots' islands like yourself. When that wave hits and the politics cascade around you, you will have to choose between the rule of law and the rule of the gun. If you choose the former you will have to accept enhanced responsibility and an end to absolute rights. If you choose the latter you will have to choose the path of Cain and spill your fellow Americans' blood. You have free will to choose as you see fit. I hope you choose wisely and with reason rather than with visceral passion.

Peace be upon you.
Evilroddy.
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shall not be infringed is pretty absolute. The rest of your pronouncements I reject as hysterical. But I have said there will be a civil war over gun rights probably within several decades. After that happens, there will be no more anti gun movement, I suspect. But I don't expect to be around that long. Now my son, he most likely will be.
 
TurtleDude said:
and you blame the victim not the criminal.
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I blame them both. I already said, there is no good guy here, only bad guys.

TurtleDude said:
I still haven't figured out your obsession over this issue.
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See there's 2 kinds of problems in the world: WaynesProblems, and NotWaynesProblems.

Your confusion is one of those NotWaynesProblems. I wish you good luck with it.
 
Wayne Jr said:
I blame them both. I already said, there is no good guy here, only bad guys.


See there's 2 kinds of problems in the world: WaynesProblems, and NotWaynesProblems.

Your confusion is one of those NotWaynesProblems. I wish you good luck with it.
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not locking your car because you were only gone a couple minutes is not something that makes you a bad guy. Something that requires the criminal actions of another person to create a harm is not malfeasance on the part of the first person
 
Wayne Jr said:
Requiring you to secure your gun when you're not using it is not an infringement.
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uh yes it is. Now people should secure their firearms and I have thousands of dollars worth of safes and sophisticated alarm systems. But I have a gun in my car and if someone breaks the window, and jimmies the consul, they can steal it-assuming they can do it fast enough before the alarm wakes me up and I get the AR 15 with the night vision scope sitting right above where the car is parked.
 
Felis Leo said:
I think a better analogy to compare it to would be to a woman who is raped and becomes pregnant by her rapist and reports the crime forcibly having her tubes tied so she can never become pregnant by a rapist again.
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Felis Leo:

If I bake a cherry pie and leave it on the open window sill of my kitchen in full view of my neighbour's children and one of them rushes over while I am distracted and tips the scalding hot pie onto his face and upper torso, I am responsible and liable (at least in part) for those injuries even if the child trespassed and attempted to steal the pie.

The gentleman in CT left a firearm unsecured in an unlocked car on a public street. He should face legal consequences for that stupidity and for his cavalier lack of responsibility. If the theif who stole the gun can be found he should be prosecuted for the theft. But the theft should not be used as an excuse for the gunowener's lack of basic responsibility and frankly his stupidity. The fact that he is the victim of a crime does not excuse his failure to properly secure the firearm in accordance with state law.

Cheers.
Evilroddy.
 
TurtleDude said:
not locking your car because you were only gone a couple of minutes is not something that makes you a bad guy.
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He was gone the whole night. Did you not catch that? He THOUGHT he was only going to be a couple of minutes, but he was ACTUALLY away from his car for the whole night.
 
Captain Adverse said:
And how would they know? Are all guns registered there?

If so, I'm glad I don't live there. Sounds like the poster child for opposing "reasonable gun control." :coffeepap:
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You don't believe it's reasonable to expect owners to keep their guns securely?
 
Wayne Jr said:
Man Reports His Pistol Stolen — So Police Take Away All His Guns and License to Carry
By Pluralist | Oct 4, 2019

"A Connecticut man had his pistol permit and firearms seized by authorities after he reported the theft of one of his guns on Monday. Officers responded on Tuesday to a report of car burglary made by Christopher Jerome, 26, the New Haven Register reported. He told police that, believing he would get back into the vehicle shortly, he didn’t lock his car doors after parking on Monday evening. Jerome said the next day he discovered his pistol had been lifted from the car’s unlocked glove box and the driver’s side door was open.

Police arrested Jerome on a reckless endangerment charge.

Under a recently implemented state law, police then entered Jerome’s home and removed the rest of his firearms: a Glock, another handgun and an AR-15.

The new law, which took effect on Oct. 1, prohibits storing a handgun in an unattended motor vehicle if it is not in the trunk, a locked safe or a locked glove box. Authorities also seized his pistol permit, which according to one police official, will likely be revoked. Capt. Richard Conklin told The Register the state believes storing a firearm in a car – even a locked car – is not “a prudent thing to do.” “A car is like a glass box. If you take out any of the windows, it is no longer locked,” Conklin said. He also said small safes shouldn’t be an option either since they can be easily taken out of vehicles.

Jerome has been released after posting a $1,000 bond."

Text of the new law.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, secure your guns or you won't have any guns to worry about anymore. I support this law and would like it to be a Federal regulation. It's one of the few gun control policies I support because it can actually improve safety and doesn't undermine the RKBA.

Queue the hate, it changes nothing.
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It's a stupid law.

I live in Arizona. We are a Constitutional Carry state which means anyone can carry their personal firearm openly or concealed without a permit. We do, however, afford business owners the option or prohibiting armed persons on their premises. For those of us that carry, that means we may have to store our sidearm in the car while running into the store. Same applies to having to run into a government building. If I have to stop at the post office (or police station) I have to leave my sidearm in the car. If my vehicle gets broken into and my firearm gets stolen when my purpose for having it in the car is to ACCOMMODATE THE LAW then the law has no business taking my firearms.
 
Wayne Jr said:
Man Reports His Pistol Stolen — So Police Take Away All His Guns and License to Carry
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This is why concealed carry permits are not "reasonable gun control". If you have to beg the government for permission in order to exercise your natural right to self-defense, then your right is being treated as a government-granted privilege, which can and will be revoked for any reason they can come up with.

Police arrested Jerome on a reckless endangerment charge.
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Of course there was nothing even close to reckless endangerment here.

Under a recently implemented state law, police then entered Jerome’s home and removed the rest of his firearms: a Glock, another handgun and an AR-15.
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The man is a victim of theft, so the police arrest the victim and confiscate his property. Now he's a victim of another robbery, this time by the state of CT.

It's one of the few gun control policies I support because it can actually improve safety
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It doesn't "improve safety". All that happens now is gun owners stop reporting gun thefts to the police.

and doesn't undermine the RKBA.
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Yes it does. The point of this kind of law is to have a chilling effect on gun ownership.
 
Lutherf said:
It's a stupid law.

I live in Arizona. We are a Constitutional Carry state which means anyone can carry their personal firearm openly or concealed without a permit. We do, however, afford business owners the option or prohibiting armed persons on their premises. For those of us that carry, that means we may have to store our sidearm in the car while running into the store. Same applies to having to run into a government building. If I have to stop at the post office (or police station) I have to leave my sidearm in the car. If my vehicle gets broken into and my firearm gets stolen when my purpose for having it in the car is to ACCOMMODATE THE LAW then the law has no business taking my firearms.
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If your car is locked you dont have problem
 
Wayne Jr said:
The Army taught me the need to keep sensitive items secure. People who don't, are punished.
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Such as jelly doughnuts? There is a scene of a recruit not properly securing a jelly doughnut in his unlocked footlocker in the movie Full Metal Jacket.


Wayne Jr said:
The gun owner was the first criminal by failing to secure his gun. Then another criminal came and stole the gun. There is no good guy here, only bad guys.
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He made a mistake. He wasn't trying to commit any crime, unlike the thief who stole his gun.
 
Evilroddy said:
A more sensible solution would be to permantly seize the unsecured gun from the unlocked car
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He should have his gun returned or at least be given financial compensation. That was his gun that he payed money for.
 
DebateChallenge said:
Such as jelly doughnuts? There is a scene of a recruit not properly securing a jelly doughnut in his unlocked footlocker in the movie Full Metal Jacket.



He made a mistake. He wasn't trying to commit any crime, unlike the thief who stole his gun.
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He's an idiot. No gun for him
 
Manc Skipper said:
You don't believe it's reasonable to expect owners to keep their guns securely?
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Maybe in your country, but in my country how stuff is done has been none of your country's business ever since 1776.
 
DebateChallenge said:
Maybe in your country, but in my country how stuff is done has been none of your country's business ever since 1776.
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Non answer.


It's my business and he is a moron who should not have a gun
 
Manc Skipper said:
You don't believe it's reasonable to expect owners to keep their guns securely?
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That would depend on what that means . . . . . . where, when and why

loaded gun laying on the seat of a unlocked car, no i dont support stupidity like that and gun owners shouldn't do that

out of site in a locked car is just fine by me otherwsie it is unreasonable .. especially in the OP, the claim was made that they dont even think a gun locked in a lockbox/safe in a locked car is ok. thats plan nuts to suggest that shouldnt be allowed.
 
AGENT J said:
That would depend on what that means . . . . . . where, when and why

loaded gun laying on the seat of a unlocked car, no i dont support stupidity like that and gun owners shouldn't do that

out of site in a locked car is just fine by me otherwsie it is unreasonable .. especially in the OP, the claim was made that they dont even think a gun locked in a lockbox/safe in a locked car is ok. thats plan nuts to suggest that shouldnt be allowed.
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Had he locked the glove box or the car, preferably both, then he'd behaved responsibly. He didn't do either of those simple things.
 
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