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The Real National Emergency

calamity said:
Gun Deaths

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We are the Worst developed Country in the World for them. And, each year, we are getting Worse. We've had a 50% increase in gun homicides from 2014.

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40,000 gun deaths per year and counting....

Now, that is a National Emergency!
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Most of which are suicides.
 
Logician Man said:
Not really. State's rights and such.
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States don't have rights, they have powers, and the Bill of Rights was incorporated against the states in the 14th Amendment. Chicago v McDonald specifically protects the Second Amendment against the states.
 
Rucker61 said:
States don't have rights, they have powers, and the Bill of Rights was incorporated against the states in the 14th Amendment. Chicago v McDonald specifically protects the Second Amendment against the states.
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Then you should be good to go to carry a firearm in those areas where they are prohibited. correct?
 
Logician Man said:
Then you should be good to go to carry a firearm in those areas where they are prohibited. correct?
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While they may not have the legal authority, they currently retain the power. We'll see about the total prohibitions on carrying firearms after SCOTUS gets warmed up.
 
DebateChallenge said:
I've got a gun vault that is very secure. I keep my guns locked in the vault.


I always keep my car locked when Im not in it, whether I've got guns in it or not.


Some people like to collect guns, that's why they might have so many. You need different tools for different jobs. A hunting rifle is not going to be used as an EDC. A small handgun is not going to be used to take large game. You need a shotgun if you want to hunt ducks or if you want to shoot skeet or trap.


Im not careless in how I store or transport my guns. On the contrary I take extra steps to make sure I do so safely.


Sadly there are those gun owners who don't properly store their guns, although as to the lost and stolen guns Im skeptical as to how many of them were legally owned to begin with.
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I'm skeptical that all of them were really lost of stolen and not straw purchases.
 
iguanaman said:
I'm skeptical that all of them were really lost of stolen and not straw purchases.
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Straw purchases can be tracked back to the original buyer, so a smart person is not going to do straw purchases.
 
DebateChallenge said:
Straw purchases can be tracked back to the original buyer, so a smart person is not going to do straw purchases.
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How is that done? The buyer just needs to say the gun was stolen and he is off the hook.
 
Rucker61 said:
While they may not have the legal authority, they currently retain the power. We'll see about the total prohibitions on carrying firearms after SCOTUS gets warmed up.
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I was being a bit of a weisenheimer, Ruck about state rights,etc..I've been on the receiving and giving end of hot lead ejected from firearms,as well as watched a good friend of mine get murdered in a liquor store robbery, so even though I think we need to do 'something' with gun laws, I'm most certainly all for the right for responsible, mentally stable citizens to be allowed to defend themselves by any reasonable means.
 
Logician Man said:
I was being a bit of a weisenheimer, Ruck about state rights,etc..I've been on the receiving and giving end of hot lead ejected from firearms,as well as watched a good friend of mine get murdered in a liquor store robbery, so even though I think we need to do 'something' with gun laws, I'm most certainly all for the right for responsible, mentally stable citizens to be allowed to defend themselves by any reasonable means.
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It would be best to just keep guns out of the wrong hands. But, as we all know, hands change and so does the behavior of men. Give a guy a gun, and the chances he'll kill himself or a loved one drastically increases.
 
calamity said:
It would be best to just keep guns out of the wrong hands. But, as we all know, hands change and so does the behavior of men. Give a guy a gun, and the chances he'll kill himself or a loved one drastically increases.
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Plenty of personal knowledge in these arenas also Cal-Man. Too many firearms in the wrong hands = too many early funerals and too much grief.
 
calamity said:
It would be best to just keep guns out of the wrong hands. But, as we all know, hands change and so does the behavior of men. Give a guy a gun, and the chances he'll kill himself or a loved one drastically increases.
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Most guys I know would not kill themselves or loved ones if they've got guns.
 
Rucker61 said:
"Possibly"?

Here's the Democratic Party platform.

"With 33,000 Americans dying every year, Democrats believe that we must finally take sensible action to address gun violence. While responsible gun ownership is part of the fabric of many communities, too many families in America have suffered from gun violence. We can respect the rights of responsible gun owners while keeping our communities safe. To build on the success of the lifesaving Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act, we will expand and strengthen background checks and close dangerous loopholes in our current laws; repeal the Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act (PLCAA) to revoke the dangerous legal immunity protections gun makers and sellers now enjoy; and keep weapons of war—such as assault weapons and large capacity ammunition magazines (LCAM’s)—off our streets. We will fight back against attempts to make it harder for the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives to revoke federal licenses from law breaking gun dealers, and ensure guns do not fall into the hands of terrorists, intimate partner abusers, other violent criminals, and those with severe mental health issues. There is insufficient research on effective gun prevention policies, which is why the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention must have the resources it needs to study gun violence as a public health issue."

Party Platform - Democrats
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In other words, the Democratic Party platform is to ignore the Constitution of the United States and replace it with fascism based on an oligarchy.
 
Logician Man said:
Not really. State's rights and such.
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States are required to conform to the 2nd amendment on this one. Also, your State may have similar wording in its own constitution. The States have recognized that this right is a natural right, and is not be interfered with by any government.
 
Rucker61 said:
States don't have rights, they have powers, and the Bill of Rights was incorporated against the states in the 14th Amendment. Chicago v McDonald specifically protects the Second Amendment against the states.
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States DO have rights, simply by being States. They have the right to self defense, just as the people do. They have the right to be free and independent States, not serfs to the federal government. They have the right of representation in the federal government (at least until the 17th amendment). The 14th amendment was passed by the States, using that representation. It did not change anything concerning the application of the Bill of Rights to anyone.
 
calamity said:
It would be best to just keep guns out of the wrong hands. But, as we all know, hands change and so does the behavior of men. Give a guy a gun, and the chances he'll kill himself or a loved one drastically increases.
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Chances are not determined by the presence of a gun.
 
Mycroft said:
So. What do you propose? Declaring a national emergency?

Then what? Declare the 2nd Amendment null and void? Good luck with that.

Then what?
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If you were to study American history, the second amendment is far different believed in during the 19th century then the 21st century. During the cowboy era during the 1870's and into the 1880's in the west: firearms were more costly. With the average worker, it was a months wages to purchase a handgun: and a weeks wages to pay for the ammunition to load the gun. With the westerns during the 1950's with gun battles -- both sides were spending more then a years worth of wages to conduct the battle.

During the first congress, nobody believed that everyone had the right to a firearm. The people living in a cities at the time was not thought of being for guns. Reason, you can have a firearm but the ammunition was raw gunpowder. Having gunpowder in a apartment could blow up and the fire could kill hundreds of people.

Each generation can decide what the second amendment should be about. Right now, less households own firearms but the people that do have firearms keep purchasing more firearms. My father lived in the country and he did have firearms. But, he only owned shotguns for hunting. I live in cities, and I really dislike country lifestyles. With my income, I do not really live in a high crime community.

If I was poor, had a poor education and became a high school dropout. And living in a poor neighborhood: then I would need a firearm -- legal or illegal. The less educated you are, the poorer you are, the poorer your social skills are -- you need a firearm. Owning firearms, in my judgment, only shows the poverty of your social skills and poverty with the ability to adapt to a new world order.
 
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