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Thread: To Those Who Don't Live In The USA, Stop Criticizing Our Gun Rights

  1. #501
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    Re: To Those Who Don't Live In The USA, Stop Criticizing Our Gun Rights

    Quote Originally Posted by flogger View Post
    No just the statistical comparison. Most homicides in the home in the US involve the use of a firearm whereas almost none in the UK do
    I'm still looking for the data that supports your 11 to 1 ratio. You can post a link to that study anytime. Before 1996, when the Brits could own handguns, was that US to UK ratio anywhere close to your purported 11 to 1?

    Here's one person's view on US v UK:

    U.S. vs U.K. - Crime/Murder - iGeek
    Individuals can not be reasoned out of beliefs they were not reasoned into.

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    Re: To Those Who Don't Live In The USA, Stop Criticizing Our Gun Rights

    Quote Originally Posted by flogger View Post
    Pure Hollywood baloney
    Prove it. I am a professional level shooter (undefeated shooting against the British national skeet team BTW). Most criminals are not good shooters
    Quote Originally Posted by jet57 View Post
    Yeah; a shotgun IS a rifle; it uses a different load.
    Quote Originally Posted by jet57 View Post
    You know that Reagan signed the Brady Bill - right?
    Quote Originally Posted by jet57 View Post
    I'm smart on the gun issue and what we need to do about it.

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    Re: To Those Who Don't Live In The USA, Stop Criticizing Our Gun Rights

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    demanding I prove something that is obvious and known to everyone on this board shows you are not interested in honest conversation. Even the Obama DOJ noted thousands of Defensive gun uses a month
    Offensive shootings outnumber defensive shootings 32 to one as I recently illustrated elsewhere by your own FBI.

    You just like the idea of killing bad guys like they do in the movies and just cant wait for it to happen

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    Re: To Those Who Don't Live In The USA, Stop Criticizing Our Gun Rights

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    demanding I prove something that is obvious and known to everyone on this board shows you are not interested in honest conversation. Even the Obama DOJ noted thousands of Defensive gun uses a month
    CDC WISQARS data shows that there were 15,000 gun related homicides, including legal intervention, in 2017. The data also shows 108,000 firearm injuries from assault and legal intervention. That's a pretty good demonstration that about 7 times as many people survive being shot with intent than die from being shot with intent.
    Individuals can not be reasoned out of beliefs they were not reasoned into.

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    Re: To Those Who Don't Live In The USA, Stop Criticizing Our Gun Rights

    Quote Originally Posted by flogger View Post
    Offensive shootings outnumber defensive shootings 32 to one as I recently illustrated elsewhere by your own FBI.

    You just like the idea of killing bad guys like they do in the movies and just cant wait for it to happen
    Are you counting non-fatal defensive shootings?
    Individuals can not be reasoned out of beliefs they were not reasoned into.

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    Re: To Those Who Don't Live In The USA, Stop Criticizing Our Gun Rights

    Quote Originally Posted by flogger View Post
    Offensive shootings outnumber defensive shootings 32 to one as I recently illustrated elsewhere by your own FBI.

    You just like the idea of killing bad guys like they do in the movies and just cant wait for it to happen
    you're lying yet again. I have shot someone-you have not. I don't want to do it again. It's a last choice. You just love criminals and hate the idea that one of their victims might hurt them
    Quote Originally Posted by jet57 View Post
    Yeah; a shotgun IS a rifle; it uses a different load.
    Quote Originally Posted by jet57 View Post
    You know that Reagan signed the Brady Bill - right?
    Quote Originally Posted by jet57 View Post
    I'm smart on the gun issue and what we need to do about it.

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    Re: To Those Who Don't Live In The USA, Stop Criticizing Our Gun Rights

    Quote Originally Posted by Into the Night View Post
    Depends on your home, doesn't it? Some people have rather large ranches. They will tend to use a long gun.
    What Im saying is that if you do defend yourself with a long gun it will probably be at your home. If you're away from home and you defend yourself with a firearm it will almost always be a handgun since handguns are much more portable and much easier to carry not to mention carry concealed if you're a concealed carrier. You are most likely not going to go into town with a long gun but you might go with a handgun.

    Quote Originally Posted by Into the Night View Post
    You can kill with a pistol at much longer range than point blank!! They are pretty effective out to 50 yds. 30 yds are even better. Those are the distances most gunfights tend to take place.
    Only if you hit a vital area. At such ranges its not just power that's a concern but also accuracy which really goes out the window if you're using a handgun at those ranges. If, under ordinary circumstances, at ten yards you can land two shots on a target with a handgun in an area small enough to cover with your hand you're quite good with a handgun. That's under ordinary circumstances when you're shooting at a paper target at a range, not during the heat of a gunfight. In the heat of a real gunfight you can expect your accuracy to diminish by at least half, so if we're talking 50 yards or even 30 yards you can see just how hard it would be to hit a man sized target in a vital area. At such a range I would rather have a rifle or even a shotgun provided the shotgun has a tight choke.

    Quote Originally Posted by Into the Night View Post
    Shotguns don't have much range. They are not very effective beyond 40 yds. Using a slug will get you another few yards.
    They do have better range if you use a tight enough choke. They do make shotguns for taking turkey and they're really powerful and have really tight chokes. That way you can guarantee a head shot on the turkey at a long enough distance without destroying the body.

    Quote Originally Posted by Into the Night View Post
    Rifles are a great long range weapon. Some are effective up to 1000 yds. That's about a mile, dude.
    1000 yards is a little more than three fifths of a mile and yes there are rifles effective at that range, there are also rifles that are effective at over a mile, or at several miles.

    Quote Originally Posted by Into the Night View Post
    Is your home a mile long? Some rancher's property is!
    Which is why as I said before, you might be using a rifle for home defense while you're at home, but you probably will not be using a rifle if you aren't at home. Although police officers sometimes keep rifles and shotguns in their squad cars, most ordinary citizens don't carry rifles around or keep them in their cars although they might carry handguns.


    Quote Originally Posted by Into the Night View Post
    Shotguns have MUCH shorter range than practically any other gun, even pistols. What they hit is pretty well devastated, though. Rocks, arrows (I very rarely try to throw a bow at something to kill it!), handguns, shotguns, and rifles are ALL lethal. Your 'ballistic scale' doesn't mean much to a dead person.
    Again, it depends on the choke and also on the barrel length. Ballistic scales might not mean anything to dead people but they to mean a lot when you're talking about stopping somebody, which is what self defense is all about, the goal of self defense is to stop, not to kill.

    Quote Originally Posted by Into the Night View Post
    Generally, yes. A one on one confrontation favors the prepared. The good person with a gun has a good solid chance. Even better, there are a LOT more good people with guns than bad people with guns.
    Sadly though, there are tons of good people with guns, some of them who are even police officers and soldiers, who don't have good training with guns. Getting a good gun is just half the battle, the other half is getting good training to use it effectively.

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    Re: To Those Who Don't Live In The USA, Stop Criticizing Our Gun Rights

    Quote Originally Posted by Into the Night View Post
    Don't know many people that build little shrines around their gun and worship it. You really DO have a distorted view of America, don't you?
    Sounds like he does. He should stay in his little island country.

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    Re: To Those Who Don't Live In The USA, Stop Criticizing Our Gun Rights

    Quote Originally Posted by flogger View Post
    Except for the fact you are over 40 times less likely to be shot dead in the UK you mean?
    But you're more likely to be stabbed, bombed, or ran over. Dead is dead, it doesn't matter how its done.

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    Re: To Those Who Don't Live In The USA, Stop Criticizing Our Gun Rights

    Quote Originally Posted by flogger View Post
    Except for the fact you are over 40 times less likely to be shot dead in the UK you mean?
    Are you suggesting that everyone in America has an equal chance of being shot, regardless of geography, age or criminal activity?
    Individuals can not be reasoned out of beliefs they were not reasoned into.

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