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Why Guns Should Be Confiscated[W:730]

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Re: Why Guns Should Be Confiscated

ttwtt78640 said:
That (bolded above) nonsense is not what I said at all. Those with a mental illness that are formally adjudged to pose a danger to themselves or others should not own guns. Those mentally ill that are adjudged to pose a danger to others should also not be allowed to roam freely among us.
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you talk about this like it is a 100% sure thing that is easy to identify and separate.
 
Re: Why Guns Should Be Confiscated

haymarket said:
you talk about this like it is a 100% sure thing that is easy to identify and separate.
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Nope, but that is precisely why we wisely require due process of law - to prevent easy and overly broad ways of having the government remove freedom from people.
 
Re: Why Guns Should Be Confiscated

ttwtt78640 said:
Nope, but that is precisely why we wisely require due process of law - to prevent easy and overly broad ways of having the government remove freedom from people.
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And let me guess - in the end nothing happens.
 
Re: Why Guns Should Be Confiscated

haymarket said:
And let me guess - in the end nothing happens.
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If we let that be the case, as we saw in Floriduh, then yes. It is moronic to call for ever more laws when the problem is simply not enforcing those laws that we now have. You can't avoid giving folks criminal records or labeling them as dangerously mentally ill and them claim that the current NICS BGC laws don't work. No system based on a database works if the database lacks the required data. The problem is party (mostly?) that "see something, say something" was allowed to be implemented by government officials in Floriduh as "hear something, excuse something" thus the "weird kid" never faced a judge - apparently to keep from having to report troubling racial or ethnic disparity in the system.
 
Re: Why Guns Should Be Confiscated

ttwtt78640 said:
If we let that be the case, as we saw in Floriduh, then yes. It is moronic to call for ever more laws when the problem is simply not enforcing those laws that we now have. You can't avoid giving folks criminal records or labeling them as dangerously mentally ill and them claim that the current NICS BGC laws don't work. No system based on a database works if the database lacks the required data. The problem is party (mostly?) that "see something, say something" was allowed to be implemented by government officials in Floriduh as "hear something, excuse something" thus the "weird kid" never faced a judge - apparently to keep from having to report troubling racial or ethnic disparity in the system.
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But the NRA and extremists who support them do NOT want gun laws to work. Not do they want mental health initiatives to work also as we already see with their parsing about who is mentally ill but still fully capable of packing heat despite not being of sound mind.

The NRA is a joke and so are those who apologize and enable them. Sadly, the joke is on the American people.
 
Douchemarket

haymarket said:
But the NRA and extremists who support them do NOT want gun laws to work. Not do they want mental health initiatives to work also as we already see with their parsing about who is mentally ill but still fully capable of packing heat despite not being of sound mind.

The NRA is a joke and so are those who apologize and enable them. Sadly, the joke is on the American people.
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Laws proven not to save lives are rightly opposed.

People who argue against our rights are a joke.
 
Re: Why Guns Should Be Confiscated

haymarket said:
But the NRA and extremists who support them do NOT want gun laws to work. Not do they want mental health initiatives to work also as we already see with their parsing about who is mentally ill but still fully capable of packing heat despite not being of sound mind.
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You mispelled ACLU.
https://www.aclu.org/blog/disabilit...involuntary-commitment-wont-stop-gun-violence
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/15/us/gun-access-mentally-ill.html
https://www.aclu.org/blog/disability-rights/gun-control-laws-should-be-fair

The current definition of mentally ill prohibited status in 18 USC 922g is from a law written in 1968. There have multiple opportunities since 1968 with the Democrats in charge to tighten up those restrictions. They are equally to blame.

The NRA is a joke and so are those who apologize and enable them. Sadly, the joke is on the American people.
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The Democrats would have ridden roughshod over the 2nd Amendment a long time ago if not for the NRA. If ACLU could count to ten without skipping number two the NRA wouldn't need to get involved. Instead ACLU chooses to deny the validity of three SCOTUS decision to avoid protecting all of our civil rights.
 
Re: Douchemarket

Spartacus FPV said:
Laws proven not to save lives are rightly opposed.

People who argue against our rights are a joke.
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Laws which help create a livable society are supported.

And you don't have any right to have whatever weapon you want. Never have.
 
Re: Why Guns Should Be Confiscated

haymarket said:
But the NRA and extremists who support them do NOT want gun laws to work. Not do they want mental health initiatives to work also as we already see with their parsing about who is mentally ill but still fully capable of packing heat despite not being of sound mind.

The NRA is a joke and so are those who apologize and enable them. Sadly, the joke is on the American people.
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What the NRA wants (or does not want) is of no importance to me. What is important to me (and should be to all of us) is requiring the use of due process of law to remove or restrict one's constitutional rights. Should those not of sound mind be allowed to vote or to drive on public roadways?
 
Re: Why Guns Should Be Confiscated

haymarket said:
I never mentioned them.
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I know. You blamed the NRA for actions that the ACLU should be given credit for.
 
Re: Why Guns Should Be Confiscated

Rucker61 said:
I know. You blamed the NRA for actions that the ACLU should be given credit for.
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I do not follow you.
 
Re: Douchemarket

haymarket said:
Laws which help create a livable society are supported.

And you don't have any right to have whatever weapon you want. Never have.
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Actually, I would argue that until NFA 1934 we did have a right to what ever weapon we wanted. Field artillery, armed warships and privately owned rapid fire weapons were all perfectly legal to own.

Now, of course, various SCOTUS decisions have added limits to where we have the right to keep and bear all firearms that are "bearable arms" "in common use for lawful purposes" "having a reasonable relationship to the preservation and efficiency of a well regulated militia".
 
Re: Why Guns Should Be Confiscated

haymarket said:
I do not follow you.
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The primary reason that there aren't stricter laws regarding mental illness and gun ownership is due to opposition by ACLU, not the NRA.
 
Re: Why Guns Should Be Confiscated

Lursa said:
??? People with disabilities are often more vulnerable to crimes of the person. Why should they lose their right to a self-defense option that helps put them on more equal footing with an attacker?I realize you didnt say all disabilities but it seemed like a pretty broad statement.
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All laws involve curtailing of some freedom, it's the entire definition. We could go through 100K laws and ask the same question.

Because it's better for everyone that people with certainl mental disabilities that significantly increase the danger of owning a firearm (to us) should have that restricted. Leave them with stun guns and tasers, pepper spray and mace, bats and knives and dogs and alarms and deadbolts...is hardly leaving them without an ability to defend themselves.
 
Re: Why Guns Should Be Confiscated

Mach said:
All laws involve curtailing of some freedom, it's the entire definition. We could go through 100K laws and ask the same question.

Because it's better for everyone that people with certainl mental disabilities that significantly increase the danger of owning a firearm (to us) should have that restricted. Leave them with stun guns and tasers, pepper spray and mace, bats and knives and dogs and alarms and deadbolts...is hardly leaving them without an ability to defend themselves.
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Holy ****, what an honest post. I cannot disagree more but I must applaud your honesty.

Very revealing and terrifying of your end goals, but damn.
 
Re: Why Guns Should Be Confiscated

Mach said:
All laws involve curtailing of some freedom, it's the entire definition. We could go through 100K laws and ask the same question.

Because it's better for everyone that people with certainl mental disabilities that significantly increase the danger of owning a firearm (to us) should have that restricted. Leave them with stun guns and tasers, pepper spray and mace, bats and knives and dogs and alarms and deadbolts...is hardly leaving them without an ability to defend themselves.
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Most of you anti gunners want to limit everyone not just those adjudicated mentally incompetent
 
Re: Why Guns Should Be Confiscated

Mach said:
All laws involve curtailing of some freedom, it's the entire definition. We could go through 100K laws and ask the same question.

Because it's better for everyone that people with certainl mental disabilities that significantly increase the danger of owning a firearm (to us) should have that restricted. Leave them with stun guns and tasers, pepper spray and mace, bats and knives and dogs and alarms and deadbolts...is hardly leaving them without an ability to defend themselves.
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Leaving them with access to knives and gasoline doesn't mean they aren't a danger to others, either.

What are those certain mental disabilties, and why haven't the Democrats changed to law once since 1968?
 
Re: Why Guns Should Be Confiscated

TurtleDude said:
Most of you anti gunners want to limit everyone not just those adjudicated mentally incompetent
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Generalization. Slippery slope. Strawman.

You've got nothing TD, you never do.
 
Re: Why Guns Should Be Confiscated

Mach said:
All laws involve curtailing of some freedom, it's the entire definition. We could go through 100K laws and ask the same question.

Because it's better for everyone that people with certainl mental disabilities that significantly increase the danger of owning a firearm (to us) should have that restricted. Leave them with stun guns and tasers, pepper spray and mace, bats and knives and dogs and alarms and deadbolts...is hardly leaving them without an ability to defend themselves.
Click to expand...

Thanks for clarifying at least mental disabilities.
 
Re: Why Guns Should Be Confiscated

haymarket said:
you talk about this like it is a 100% sure thing that is easy to identify and separate.
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Removing guns...any guns...100% from America will never happen either.

See: War on Drugs, Prohibition (AND...such prohibitions create MORE crime)

Do you really want to live in a country where only cops and criminals have guns?
 
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Re: Douchemarket

haymarket said:
Laws which help create a livable society are supported.

And you don't have any right to have whatever weapon you want. Never have.
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Guns that protect lives and provide self-defense specifically help create a livable society. If you choose not to take that path in your own self-interests, that is your right. But you certainly shouldnt have the right to diminish ours.
 
Re: Why Guns Should Be Confiscated

Lursa said:
Removing guns...any guns...100% from America will never happen either.

See: War on Drugs, Prohibition (AND...such prohibitions create MORE crime)

Do you really want to live in a country where only cops and criminals have guns?
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Not at all.
 
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