The Nobody wants to Ban Guns Nonsense

Omg bucky, I hope you're right. I am so sick of hearing on the news everyday that someone else and someone else and someone else has been killed by a gun.

One man with an arsenal of knives would not have been able to kill so many people in Las Vegas. WE NEED BETTER GUN CONTROL. Stop deluding yourself into thinking that the way things currently are is ok! THIS IS NOT OK.

Silky said:

One man with an arsenal of knives would not have been able to kill so many people in Las Vegas. WE NEED BETTER GUN CONTROL. Stop deluding yourself into thinking that the way things currently are is ok! THIS IS NOT OK.

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The guy in Vegas had the materials to make a bomb, and also a plane. He would have been far more dangerous had he chose one of those options.

Must be a slow Saturday night for TD. Not enough “gun” threads, “by golly I’ll initiate one.” Best to start before 2230 hrs, but should see renewed traction Sunday morning!

PirateMk1 said:

Very few people will fight the government should they come knocking. Most will tuck their tail between their legs and cower. Only those with unusual conviction or are exceptionally well armed will stand up or stand up to the government. There are very few of those.

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Then there would be none of 'em.

The government is not going to come knocking on a hundred million doors. Even if it did, it has 8000 M1 battle tanks to do the knocking -- down. The military would never do it besides.

Local law enforcement could not stop the Las Vegas guy until after he killed three score citizens so how are local law enforcement going to organize nationally to bang on the hundred million doors. Local law enforcement would not do that either unless Roy Moore rounded up a bunch of 'em to include the civilian armed to the teeth rightwingnuts.

State police in the states would arrest their commander before they'd receive and act on his orders to bang on your door. Texas Rangers I don't know so possibly someone could speak to 'em but I doubt they'd bang on many doors.

The Las Vegas victims at the country music concert outdoors likely owned guns as in plural. Even if all of 'em could carry or did carry they'd still have been in the shooting gallery horror and tragedy they found themselves in anyway.

At the recent church slaughter a guy on the scene had a gun and used it to chase off the lunatic crackpot with his gun who never should have had a gun to begin with. The church massacre also proves existing gun laws are insufficient and inadequate even if fully enforced which is impossible to do regardless.

As we see right before our eyes too many people with legal ownership of guns have minds that don't work right. I myself own one handgun and I have no expectation of anyone knocking on my door. It's the guy coming through the window at 2 a.m that I'm thinking about. That wouldn't be you either.

Tangmo said:

Then there would be none of 'em.

The government is not going to come knocking on a hundred million doors. Even if it did, it has 8000 M1 battle tanks to do the knocking -- down. The military would never do it besides.

Local law enforcement could not stop the Las Vegas guy until after he killed three score citizens so how are local law enforcement going to organize nationally to bang on the hundred million doors. Local law enforcement would not do that either unless Roy Moore rounded up a bunch of 'em to include the civilian armed to the teeth rightwingnuts.

State police in the states would arrest their commander before they'd receive and act on his orders to bang on your door. Texas Rangers I don't know so possibly someone could speak to 'em but I doubt they'd bang on many doors.

The Las Vegas victims at the country music concert outdoors likely owned guns as in plural. Even if all of 'em could carry or did carry they'd still have been in the shooting gallery horror and tragedy they found themselves in anyway.

At the recent church slaughter a guy on the scene had a gun and used it to chase off the lunatic crackpot with his gun who never should have had a gun to begin with. The church massacre also proves existing gun laws are insufficient and inadequate even if fully enforced which is impossible to do regardless.

As we see right before our eyes too many people with legal ownership of guns have minds that don't work right. I myself own one handgun and I have no expectation of anyone knocking on my door. It's the guy coming through the window at 2 a.m that I'm thinking about. That wouldn't be you either.

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You own a handgun...... IN CHINA?

I call BS on that one.

PirateMk1 said:

Most of the LEO's and military will follow their orders. Its what they do.

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I wouldn't book that bet.

Virtually every overthrow of a government has been with the assistance of the military and LEO. Why would we be any exception?

Tangmo said:

Then there would be none of 'em.

The government is not going to come knocking on a hundred million doors. Even if it did, it has 8000 M1 battle tanks to do the knocking -- down. The military would never do it besides.

Local law enforcement could not stop the Las Vegas guy until after he killed three score citizens so how are local law enforcement going to organize nationally to bang on the hundred million doors. Local law enforcement would not do that either unless Roy Moore rounded up a bunch of 'em to include the civilian armed to the teeth rightwingnuts.

State police in the states would arrest their commander before they'd receive and act on his orders to bang on your door. Texas Rangers I don't know so possibly someone could speak to 'em but I doubt they'd bang on many doors.

The Las Vegas victims at the country music concert outdoors likely owned guns as in plural. Even if all of 'em could carry or did carry they'd still have been in the shooting gallery horror and tragedy they found themselves in anyway.

At the recent church slaughter a guy on the scene had a gun and used it to chase off the lunatic crackpot with his gun who never should have had a gun to begin with. The church massacre also proves existing gun laws are insufficient and inadequate even if fully enforced which is impossible to do regardless.

As we see right before our eyes too many people with legal ownership of guns have minds that don't work right. I myself own one handgun and I have no expectation of anyone knocking on my door. It's the guy coming through the window at 2 a.m that I'm thinking about. That wouldn't be you either.

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See post 25.

jimbo said:

I wouldn't book that bet.

Virtually every overthrow of a government has been with the assistance of the military and LEO. Why would we be any exception?

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If the order to take peoples guns goes out they will do it. Bet on it.

PirateMk1 said:

Most of the LEO's and military will follow their orders. Its what they do.

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Orders from whom? No one controls any of the sheriffs but the sheriff's themselves. No state level official can order any local police force to do anything.

Rucker61 said:

Orders from whom? No one controls any of the sheriffs but the sheriff's themselves. No state level official can order any local police force to do anything.

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They do all the time from the state and the feds and Sheriffs will go along because almost all of the Sheriffs have been coopted by lifelong LEO's and very few are "civilians". The term LEO is a more recent and now accurate moniker. They used to be called peace officers and their primary job was simply to keep the peace. Not anymore.

PirateMk1 said:

They do all the time from the state and the feds and Sheriffs will go along because almost all of the Sheriffs have been coopted by lifelong LEO's and very few are "civilians". The term LEO is a more recent and now accurate moniker. They used to be called peace officers and their primary job was simply to keep the peace. Not anymore.

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Not in Colorado. The vast majority of sheriffs here have actually sued to state regarding new gun laws and have refused to enforce them. I'd suspect the rest of the western US is similar.

Do you think there would be violent objection to violations of the 2nd, 4th and possibly 5th Amendments? How many cops have to die before those tyrants giving the orders rethink this policy?

Rucker61 said:

Not in Colorado. The vast majority of sheriffs here have actually sued to state regarding new gun laws and have refused to enforce them. I'd suspect the rest of the western US is similar.

Do you think there would be violent objection to violations of the 2nd, 4th and possibly 5th Amendments? How many cops have to die before those tyrants giving the orders rethink this policy?

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There would be very little opposition, most people would go along with it. Half of them cheering. Very few cops would die if any, Americans are now domesticated. There are very few wild or even feral Americans left.

PirateMk1 said:

There would be very little opposition, most people would go along with it. Half of them cheering. Very few cops would die if any, Americans are now domesticated. There are very few wild or even feral Americans left.

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You can believe that if you wish. Perhaps your opinion is colored by your location.

Rucker61 said:

You can believe that if you wish. Perhaps your opinion is colored by your location.

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Colorado is following close behind California. They will be like California very soon. I travel the country extensively. Americans are too nice and polite. Too domesticated.

PirateMk1 said:

Colorado is following close behind California. They will be like California very soon. I travel the country extensively. Americans are too nice and polite. Too domesticated.

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Not the 55 counties that don't include the Denver metro area and Boulder. Those area are blue, and make the state blue just due to population. The rest of the state is pretty red.

Rucker61 said:

Not the 55 counties that don't include the Denver metro area and Boulder. Those area are blue, and make the state blue just due to population. The rest of the state is pretty red.

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Just like California, once it tips its an avalanche.

TurtleDude said:

I realize lots of left-wingers feel an almost impulsive need to try to defend Democrats on their schemes against the NRA and gun owners but that was really stupid

why do you think that the anti gun nonsense almost always comes from left wingers?

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I think you're blathering paranoid nonsense. Guns are here to stay. It's like when you said "liberals have been worshiping communism for the last 80 years". Utter crap.

But keep on fear-mongering. You might help boost gun sales which are now depressed. You must be getting a commision from the NRA.

lurchadams said:

I think you're blathering paranoid nonsense. Guns are here to stay. It's like when you said "liberals have been worshiping communism for the last 80 years". Utter crap.

But keep on fear-mongering. You might help boost gun sales which are now depressed. You must be getting a commision from the NRA.

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I guess you are totally clueless about Democrap run states like California, MD, NY, NJ, CT and what sort of idiotic laws those scum bags have imposed on honest American citizens

TurtleDude said:

I guess you are totally clueless about Democrap run states like California, MD, NY, NJ, CT and what sort of idiotic laws those scum bags have imposed on honest American citizens

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And yet people still manage to get guns, legally or illegally whenever they want no matter what those "liberal scum bags" try to do. Then whenever one of our tragic mass shootings occur, nothing changes.

The NRA owns both parties. But keep attacking me and spreading your fear and hate. I know it makes you feel better.

lurchadams said:

And yet people still manage to get guns, legally or illegally whenever they want no matter what those "liberal scum bags" try to do. Then whenever one of our tragic mass shootings occur, nothing changes.

The NRA owns both parties. But keep attacking me and spreading your fear and hate. I know it makes you feel better.

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what would make me feel really good is that the courts actually interpret the second amendment as the founders intended and we wouldn't have you all trying to use gun control as a scheme to harass honest Americans who don't support liberals

PirateMk1 said:

Most of the LEO's and military will follow their orders. Its what they do.

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I am familiar with a chain of command from having been in it thx.

PirateMk1 said:

See post 25.

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I came, I saw, I conquered. See Post #30.

All the same you've missed several major factors, one being Gen. Kelly missing lunch on the day someone leaked his DHS memo to use the National Guard to round up undocumented immigrants. As opposed to all immigrants. Or maybe it wuz to sort of round up all immigrants as long as the National Guard was going to be at it, which it wuz not after all as the hungry Gen. Kelly was brought to his senses after being fed an MRE (Meals Rejected by Everyone).

The military chain of command is absolutely clear on the Posse Comitatus Act. Statement from the U.S. Northern Command....

The PCA does not apply to the U.S. Coast Guard in peacetime or to the National Guard in Title 32 or State Active Duty status. As required by Title 10 USC, Section 375, the secretary of defense issued Department of Defense Directive 5525.5, which precludes members of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps from direct participation in a search, seizure, arrest, or other similar activity unless participation in such activity by such member is otherwise authorized by law.

The PCA generally prohibits U.S. military personnel from direct participation in law enforcement activities. Some of those law enforcement activities would include interdicting vehicles, vessels, and aircraft; conducting surveillance, searches, pursuit and seizures; or making arrests on behalf of civilian law enforcement authorities. Prohibiting direct military involvement in law enforcement is in keeping with long-standing U.S. law and policy limiting the military’s role in domestic affairs.

The Posse Comitatus Act > U.S. Northern Command > Article View


General Lori J. Robinson, USAF Commander Northern Command.


United States Northern Command is a Unified Combatant Command of the U.S. military tasked with providing military support for civil authorities in the U.S., and protecting the territory and national interests of the United States within the contiguous United States, Alaska, Puerto Rico, Canada, Mexico, The Bahamas, and the air, land and sea approaches to these areas.


I cite the Northern Command statement mainly because the Command includes Washington DC, i.e., the Military District of Washington and the Joint Force Headquarters National Capital Region. Commanding general of Northern Command is a highly screened professional if you don't know the fact. Gen. Kelly meanwhile had been commander of Southern Command which protects us against invasion by any country south of Mexico.

Posse Comitatus leaves the state National Guard under the command of the governor of each state, unless the NG is activated to federal service by Potus. So fifty state governors and 50 state authorities to include counties would probably have to think about that before trying to independently order the NG to do seizures and everything that might entail. Or to support the civil authorities in seizures of anything.

Then each governor or Potus would need to get the gun owning LEA to agree to a mass seizure of the guns of their family, friends, neighbors, colleagues, ministers and parishioners armed to their teeth in the pews, to include various assorted six-pack rednecks holed up in the hills across the 50 states. Each state. (So perhaps 8000 M1 main battle tanks might not be enough eh. After all, tank commanders might be hesitant to blow up the house they grew up in and with their parents barricaded in it besides.)

One might also need to consider NG crossing state lines. For a hypo instance, say the patriotic armed to the teeth governor of Texas orders his Texas Rangers to California to do the seizures the California authorities would not order to occur throughout the Golden State. And then on to Oregon and to Washington -- maybe even to Vancouver to preclude or stop alleged subsequent gun smuggling into the USA.

As we can get some notion of it, this isn't quite Norad Tracks Santa izzit. Nor would I put it past Trump to call in the Russian Army to get things under control.

Jus sayin.

lurchadams said:

And yet people still manage to get guns, legally or illegally whenever they want no matter what those "liberal scum bags" try to do. Then whenever one of our tragic mass shootings occur, nothing changes.

The NRA owns both parties. But keep attacking me and spreading your fear and hate. I know it makes you feel better.

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I agree the NRA owns both parties. They are well organized. We need to do much better to stop them

TurtleDude said:

I hear it all the time-all we want is "sensible gun control" or
"common sense gun control"

wrong. lots of Democrats want bans. bans on all kinds of stuff


https://www.nraila.org/articles/201...-wants-to-ban-commonly-owned-semi-autos-again

the bill would prohibit AR-15s and dozens of other semi-automatic rifles by name (as well as their “variants” or “altered facsimiles”), and any semi-automatic rifle that could accept a detachable magazine and be equipped with a pistol grip, an adjustable or detachable stock, or a barrel shroud. And that’s just a partial list. “Pistol grip” would be defined as “a grip, a thumbhole stock, or any other characteristic that can function as a grip,” meaning the ban could implicate even traditional stocks or grips specifically designed to comply with existing state “assault weapon” laws.

Needless to say, semi-automatic shotguns and handguns would get similar treatment.

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I don't want to ban guns. I think guns are useful tools. I got my rifleman merit badge in the Boy Scouts, and honestly the only reason I wanted to go to Scout camp was to get that.

But I'm very, very, very sick of innocent people being gunned down en masse and the only "acceptable" solution being "more guns".

Tigerace117 said:

I don't want to ban guns. I think guns are useful tools. I got my rifleman merit badge in the Boy Scouts, and honestly the only reason I wanted to go to Scout camp was to get that.

But I'm very, very, very sick of innocent people being gunned down en masse and the only "acceptable" solution being "more guns".

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well thats a rather silly argument. Unless there is a gun ban there will be more guns. Its like people who complain the "rich get richer". well unless investments stop making money or the rich are taxed more than they make, that will always happen.

so educate me what laws you want to prevent or at least substantially diminish that which you claim to be upset about