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The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22:654]***

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Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

Rucker61 said:
What if they wrote a bill for universal background checks knowing that universal background checks cannot be enforced without comprehensive registration? Are they then dishonest in claiming UBCs will improve safety, or are the dishonest in that they will then ask for registration when UBCs prove ineffective?
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Show me where the people in this group said that they know UBC can't be enforced without registration. If they have said that then I'd agree they are being dishonest. Otherwise I'd just say that you and they disagree, not that they are being dishonest.
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

vegas giants said:
That is an opinion that may prove to be completely false
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An opinion from the foremost criminal justice and law enforcement organization in the US.
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

roughdraft274 said:
Show me where the people in this group said that they know UBC can't be enforced without registration. If they have said that then I'd agree they are being dishonest. Otherwise I'd just say that you and they disagree, not that they are being dishonest.
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See the word "if"? I'm not claiming that they do know. Ignorance abounds. However, the DOJ pointed out in their 2010 report "Summary of Select Firearm Violence Prevention Strategies" that an effective UBC does in fact require registration.
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

Rucker61 said:
See the word "if"? I'm not claiming that they do know.
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Ok. That's why I put "otherwise" in my response. If they didn't say they know then you and they just disagree.If they did say it, they are being dishonest.
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

roughdraft274 said:
Ok. That's why I put "otherwise" in my response. If they didn't say they know then you and they just disagree.If they did say it, they are being dishonest.
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What if they persist, once that requirement has been pointed out to them, like we saw in Colorado?
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

Rucker61 said:
What if they persist, once that requirement has been pointed out to them, like we saw in Colorado?
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Just because you point it out it doesn't mean that they have to agree with you. I could sit you down and let a thousand scientists explain to you that climate change is real and that mankind's actions play a role in it but you could still deny it without being dishonest.
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

roughdraft274 said:
Just because you point it out it doesn't mean that they have to agree with you. I could sit you down and let a thousand scientists explain to you that climate change is real and that mankind's actions play a role in it but you could still deny it without being dishonest.
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I didn't point it out - 55 Colorado sheriffs pointed it out. They didn't disagree. They just flat ignored it because they had an unassailable majority.
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

Rucker61 said:
An opinion from the foremost criminal justice and law enforcement organization in the US.
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An opinion nonetheless. If UBC was enacted....no one will die. The experiment has no significant downside
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

vegas giants said:
An opinion nonetheless. If UBC was enacted....no one will die. The experiment has no significant downside
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If we lock up all males from age 15-29, it won't kill anyone, and might even save lives. What's the downside?
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

Rucker61 said:
I didn't point it out - 55 Colorado sheriffs pointed it out. They didn't disagree. They just flat ignored it because they had an unassailable majority.
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http://america.aljazeera.com/articl...call-for-universal-gun-background-checks.html

And I can find many that think UBGC would work. Again, for the third time, if they simply disagree, then it's not dishonesty. You can keep twisting all you want. It doesn't change the very obvious and simple answer.
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

Rucker61 said:
If we lock up all males from age 15-29, it won't kill anyone, and might even save lives. What's the downside?
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There is a significant downside to that and anyone can see that. Even you
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

Rucker61 said:
What if they wrote a bill for universal background checks knowing that universal background checks cannot be enforced without comprehensive registration? Are they then dishonest in claiming UBCs will improve safety, or are the dishonest in that they will then ask for registration when UBCs prove ineffective?
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bingo. Sarah Brady, a B list Washington insider became an A lister when her husband was crippled and she used his injury to become the head of the gun control movement in DC. Does anyone think she was going to give it all up once the Brady Bill was passed
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

roughdraft274 said:
Show me where the people in this group said that they know UBC can't be enforced without registration. If they have said that then I'd agree they are being dishonest. Otherwise I'd just say that you and they disagree, not that they are being dishonest.
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well the OBAMA DOJ said that. and since you anti gun posters constantly talk about COMMON SENSE anyone with a brain has to know its common sense that unless you have a list of who owns what guns when, you cannot prove that say I sold Rucker a gun that I have owned for 20 years AFTER the date of the UBGC became effective without registration.
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

TurtleDude said:
well the OBAMA DOJ said that. and since you anti gun posters constantly talk about COMMON SENSE anyone with a brain has to know its common sense that unless you have a list of who owns what guns when, you cannot prove that say I sold Rucker a gun that I have owned for 20 years AFTER the date of the UBGC became effective without registration.
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Then have registration. Problem solved
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

roughdraft274 said:
Ok. That's why I put "otherwise" in my response. If they didn't say they know then you and they just disagree.If they did say it, they are being dishonest.
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not ignorant-willfully blind since that fact was constantly repeated to them every time they claimed UBGCs would be effective.
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

TurtleDude said:
not ignorant-willfully blind since that fact was constantly repeated to them every time they claimed UBGCs would be effective.
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They are entitled to their opinion....which is all it is
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

TurtleDude said:
not ignorant-willfully blind since that fact was constantly repeated to them every time they claimed UBGCs would be effective.
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What fact?
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

vegas giants said:
Then have registration. Problem solved
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its unconstitutional and the most desired law for every gun banning group. anyone who owns guns who supports registration is either an idiot or wants most guns banned

it has no useful purpose and does nothing to help gun owners
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

roughdraft274 said:
What fact?
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that you cannot enforce a law banning private sales conducted without a background check unless you have registration of all firearms.
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

TurtleDude said:
well the OBAMA DOJ said that. and since you anti gun posters constantly talk about COMMON SENSE anyone with a brain has to know its common sense that unless you have a list of who owns what guns when, you cannot prove that say I sold Rucker a gun that I have owned for 20 years AFTER the date of the UBGC became effective without registration.
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I'm not anti gun. Stop lying.
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

TurtleDude said:
its unconstitutional and the most desired law for every gun banning group. anyone who owns guns who supports registration is either an idiot or wants most guns banned

it has no useful purpose and does nothing to help gun owners
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It is not unconstitutional and you are simply lying about what registration means
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

roughdraft274 said:
I'm not anti gun. Stop lying.
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If you support any gun control at all he will claim you are an anti gun banner who is afraid of guns. It is insulting, a lie and an attempt to bully you into silence
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

TurtleDude said:
that you cannot enforce a law banning private sales conducted without a background check unless you have registration of all firearms.
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Well that's just simply not a fact. I would say that it's a fact that you could enforce it much better with registration. But you could still enforce it without.
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

vegas giants said:
It is not unconstitutional and you are simply lying about what registration means
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it is unconstitutional and its designed to allow gun banners to round up guns that have been declared illegal. There is no evidence that registration has been successful in any part of the USA when it has been applied to guns people already owned. and the compliance rate is less than 20% in the cases that have been studied.

Tell us why you claim I am a gun banner when you want to ban all felons from owning guns and you want registration as well?
 
Re: The new Charade: ITS GUN SAFETY not GUN BANS[W:22]

TurtleDude said:
it is unconstitutional and its designed to allow gun banners to round up guns that have been declared illegal. There is no evidence that registration has been successful in any part of the USA when it has been applied to guns people already owned. and the compliance rate is less than 20% in the cases that have been studied.

Tell us why you claim I am a gun banner when you want to ban all felons from owning guns and you want registration as well?
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I am as much of a gun banner as you. So you admit you are a gun banner now?
 
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