The future of Colt?

cpgrad08 · Feb 12, 2017

So it looks like Colt is going back to making DA/SA revolvers once again with the introduction of the Colt Cobra .38 spl. They have hinted that this is just the beginning of the them bring back other revolvers from the dead (like the classic python.) What do you think of this move by Colt and does this show the Revolver is alive and well in a age where many considered it obsolete technology?

Personally as a Revolver lover I love the idea of Colt and SW becoming rivals in the Revolver wold once again. I think this is a good way for Colt not to have all it's eggs in one basket after their bankruptcy a few years ago.

https://www.americanrifleman.org/articles/2017/1/1/the-keefe-report-colt-cobra-a-new-factory-double-action-colt/

chuckiechan · Feb 12, 2017

cpgrad08 said:
So it looks like Colt is going back to making DA/SA revolvers once again with the introduction of the Colt Cobra .38 spl. They have hinted that this is just the beginning of the them bring back other revolvers from the dead (like the classic python.) What do you think of this move by Colt and does this show the Revolver is alive and well in a age where many considered it obsolete technology?

Personally as a Revolver lover I love the idea of Colt and SW becoming rivals in the Revolver wold once again. I think this is a good way for Colt not to have all it's eggs in one basket after their bankruptcy a few years ago.

https://www.americanrifleman.org/articles/2017/1/1/the-keefe-report-colt-cobra-a-new-factory-double-action-colt/

It's possible it has to do with California trying to get "headstamping" of cartridge cases. So far they haven't been successful. And states like California are going to turn their attention to semi automatic pistol owners and start f'ing with them. Revolvers leave no cases, and don't have the baggage semi auto's do.

TurtleDude · Feb 12, 2017

colt's made a bunch of marketing mistakes in the recent history of the company. In the mid to late 80s, the demand for 1911 handguns started to accelerate due to USPSA/IPSC gaining lots of new members and the Colt 1911 in 45 ACP and then 38 Super were the guns of choice. Colt refused to make their pistols more friendly to competitors while Caspian and Springfield Armory did. I remember talking to a top gunsmith who said he'd modify a 70s series 1911 to a full house limited gun for 1400 dollars but if he built it on a caspian it would be 1300 and he'd supply the gun. The reason why, Caspian frames were made with the beavertail safety cut, the slides had the Bomar sight cut and the package came with the larger thumb safety etc. IN other words, Caspian saved him 10 hours of milling machine time. Colt refused to cater to shooters like us and while Colt was seen as the best made 1911, Springfield and Caspian started taking a huge share of the market. Then when the police departments started adopting double stack 9mm Pistols, Colt was nowhere to be seen in that Market and Glock, and Smith and wesson dominated. Colt's Double eagle, and attempt to compete with Smiths double action 45 (645) was junk and had an inferior trigger.

Colt also got fat off the M16 contract and once again, while Colt AR 15s were the cream of the crop. But Colt lost both the M16 contract and lots of market share as other makers started creating well made AR 15s that were as good as the Colt but cheaper. Plus, colt lower receivers require "large hole" accessories while just about everyone else uses standard size pins.

Hard to say how Colt will end up but their track record has been poor in responding to a changing market

Winchester · Feb 12, 2017

cpgrad08 said:
So it looks like Colt is going back to making DA/SA revolvers once again with the introduction of the Colt Cobra .38 spl. They have hinted that this is just the beginning of the them bring back other revolvers from the dead (like the classic python.) What do you think of this move by Colt and does this show the Revolver is alive and well in a age where many considered it obsolete technology?

Personally as a Revolver lover I love the idea of Colt and SW becoming rivals in the Revolver wold once again. I think this is a good way for Colt not to have all it's eggs in one basket after their bankruptcy a few years ago.

https://www.americanrifleman.org/articles/2017/1/1/the-keefe-report-colt-cobra-a-new-factory-double-action-colt/

Good name to bring back, I hope they do it right and they're quality pieces. That being said I'm a Ruger guy with aspirations of becoming a Freedom Arms guy. :2razz:

cuban smokes · Feb 12, 2017

I like both revolvers & semi autos as each design has it's positive attributes. I wish Colt all the best in their business .......

cpgrad08 · Feb 12, 2017

Winchester said:
Good name to bring back, I hope they do it right and they're quality pieces. That being said I'm a Ruger guy with aspirations of becoming a Freedom Arms guy. :2razz:

I'm so sorry. :2razz:

cpgrad08 · Feb 12, 2017

TurtleDude said:
colt's made a bunch of marketing mistakes in the recent history of the company. In the mid to late 80s, the demand for 1911 handguns started to accelerate due to USPSA/IPSC gaining lots of new members and the Colt 1911 in 45 ACP and then 38 Super were the guns of choice. Colt refused to make their pistols more friendly to competitors while Caspian and Springfield Armory did. I remember talking to a top gunsmith who said he'd modify a 70s series 1911 to a full house limited gun for 1400 dollars but if he built it on a caspian it would be 1300 and he'd supply the gun. The reason why, Caspian frames were made with the beavertail safety cut, the slides had the Bomar sight cut and the package came with the larger thumb safety etc. IN other words, Caspian saved him 10 hours of milling machine time. Colt refused to cater to shooters like us and while Colt was seen as the best made 1911, Springfield and Caspian started taking a huge share of the market. Then when the police departments started adopting double stack 9mm Pistols, Colt was nowhere to be seen in that Market and Glock, and Smith and wesson dominated. Colt's Double eagle, and attempt to compete with Smiths double action 45 (645) was junk and had an inferior trigger.

Colt also got fat off the M16 contract and once again, while Colt AR 15s were the cream of the crop. But Colt lost both the M16 contract and lots of market share as other makers started creating well made AR 15s that were as good as the Colt but cheaper. Plus, colt lower receivers require "large hole" accessories while just about everyone else uses standard size pins.

Hard to say how Colt will end up but their track record has been poor in responding to a changing market

Hopefully this latest Bankruptcy puts them back on track on being one of America's premier gun makers, but it does seem whenever Colt gets a huge government contract they pretty much tell the civilian market to F'off. I will be getting the new Cobra once they become available.

Winchester · Feb 12, 2017

cpgrad08 said:
I'm so sorry. :2razz:

So many things wrong with that, lol. I don't even know off the top of my head how many Rugers I own. I'd have to open the safe and count them. IMO, best bang for the buck in well made revolvers.

cpgrad08 · Feb 12, 2017

Winchester said:
So many things wrong with that, lol. I don't even know off the top of my head how many Rugers I own. I'd have to open the safe and count them. IMO, best bang for the buck in well made revolvers.

Your talking to a SW fan boy when it comes to Revolvers. :lol:

Winchester · Feb 12, 2017

cpgrad08 said:
Your talking to a SW fan boy when it comes to Revolvers. :lol:

I figured. You guys are almost as bad as apple fanbois. :2razz:

cpgrad08 · Feb 12, 2017

Winchester said:
I figured. You guys are almost as bad as apple fanbois. :2razz:

I can say the same about you Rugers boys. So many of you go on and on how your Ruger can shoot +p+p+p+p +p stupid hot ammo. :lol:

Winchester · Feb 12, 2017

cpgrad08 said:
I can say the same about you Rugers boys. So many of you go on and on how your Ruger can shoot +p+p+p+p +p stupid hot ammo. :lol:

Without blowing up.

Ruger is really good about doing special runs. I love, love my blackhawk .44 special, so much so I bought two of them. Now I find out they made a .44 special in the GP101. :mrgreen:

cpgrad08 · Feb 12, 2017

Winchester said:
Without blowing up.

Ruger is really good about doing special runs. I love, love my blackhawk .44 special, so much so I bought two of them. Now I find out they made a .44 special in the GP101. :mrgreen:

SW gives me huge discounts for having a security license. Plus I do not need a 400 gr .44 mag round that travels at mach 10 out of the barrel.

Winchester · Feb 12, 2017

cpgrad08 said:
SW gives me huge discounts for having a security license. Plus I do not need a 400 gr .44 mag round that travels at mach 10 out of the barrel.

No one "needs" those, but damn they're fun to shoot. My Super Blackhawk Hunter with the bisley grips is sooooo sweet to shoot. :lol:

But back to the topic at hand, I have to admit I've wanted to get my hands on some of the old Colt snake revolvers.

cpgrad08 · Feb 12, 2017

Winchester said:
No one "needs" those, but damn they're fun to shoot. My Super Blackhawk Hunter with the bisley grips is sooooo sweet to shoot. :lol:

But back to the topic at hand, I have to admit I've wanted to get my hands on some of the old Colt snake revolvers.

My M69 .44 mag with Grips for the 500 magnum on it it an amazing carry-able .44.

I had a Colt Trooper Mk.3 for a while and I really loved it.

beerftw · Feb 12, 2017

cpgrad08 said:
So it looks like Colt is going back to making DA/SA revolvers once again with the introduction of the Colt Cobra .38 spl. They have hinted that this is just the beginning of the them bring back other revolvers from the dead (like the classic python.) What do you think of this move by Colt and does this show the Revolver is alive and well in a age where many considered it obsolete technology?

Personally as a Revolver lover I love the idea of Colt and SW becoming rivals in the Revolver wold once again. I think this is a good way for Colt not to have all it's eggs in one basket after their bankruptcy a few years ago.

https://www.americanrifleman.org/articles/2017/1/1/the-keefe-report-colt-cobra-a-new-factory-double-action-colt/

Colt is going back to revolvers because they made amazing revolvers, but the important reason why is because in recent years colt has lost alot of govt contracts, for a long time they were contracted for the m-16 and the 1911, the 1911 is rarely used anymore by military, and the police and non military agencies who use them can contract 1911's to other companies besides colt, which tends to have a much higher price tag.

Colt is reorganizing itself, to cater more to the civilian world than it has in the past, and colt revolvers were always revered.

TurtleDude · Feb 12, 2017

beerftw said:
Colt is going back to revolvers because they made amazing revolvers, but the important reason why is because in recent years colt has lost alot of govt contracts, for a long time they were contracted for the m-16 and the 1911, the 1911 is rarely used anymore by military, and the police and non military agencies who use them can contract 1911's to other companies besides colt, which tends to have a much higher price tag.

Colt is reorganizing itself, to cater more to the civilian world than it has in the past, and colt revolvers were always revered.

I don't know about that. Colt revolvers were never popular among people who actually shot revolvers a lot. When I was shooting PPC in the 80s, if you didn't shoot a Smith, you were seen as not serious. in the steel speed events these days, SW dominates the competitions. Smith keeps up with the market and their clockwork is awesome . colts were well made but the actions were not as good.

beerftw · Feb 12, 2017

TurtleDude said:
I don't know about that. Colt revolvers were never popular among people who actually shot revolvers a lot. When I was shooting PPC in the 80s, if you didn't shoot a Smith, you were seen as not serious. in the steel speed events these days, SW dominates the competitions. Smith keeps up with the market and their clockwork is awesome . colts were well made but the actions were not as good.

I am not referring to competition revolvers, I am speaking of revolvers in general, that the average joe uses. Colt has had an amazing reputation for revolvers, and made their mark during the civil war with the various cap and ball revolvers then later with the peacemaker.

Their revolvers are top notch, sure they are not designed with a shooting contest in mind, but they are revered, and it is a shame colt pushed them to the side for so many years until their military contracts ended.

Tanngrisnir · Feb 12, 2017

Winchester said:
No one "needs" those, but damn they're fun to shoot. My Super Blackhawk Hunter with the bisley grips is sooooo sweet to shoot. :lol:

But back to the topic at hand, I have to admit I've wanted to get my hands on some of the old Colt snake revolvers.

Super BH props, esp for the bang-for-the-buck factor.

For the money, Ruger just kills.

TurtleDude · Feb 12, 2017

beerftw said:
I am not referring to competition revolvers, I am speaking of revolvers in general, that the average joe uses. Colt has had an amazing reputation for revolvers, and made their mark during the civil war with the various cap and ball revolvers then later with the peacemaker.

Their revolvers are top notch, sure they are not designed with a shooting contest in mind, but they are revered, and it is a shame colt pushed them to the side for so many years until their military contracts ended.

back in the eighties the comment you used to hear a lot of was

Colt sticking to autos, Smith sticking to revolvers and things would be better :mrgreen:

Lutherf · Feb 12, 2017

cpgrad08 said:
So it looks like Colt is going back to making DA/SA revolvers once again with the introduction of the Colt Cobra .38 spl. They have hinted that this is just the beginning of the them bring back other revolvers from the dead (like the classic python.) What do you think of this move by Colt and does this show the Revolver is alive and well in a age where many considered it obsolete technology?

Personally as a Revolver lover I love the idea of Colt and SW becoming rivals in the Revolver wold once again. I think this is a good way for Colt not to have all it's eggs in one basket after their bankruptcy a few years ago.

https://www.americanrifleman.org/articles/2017/1/1/the-keefe-report-colt-cobra-a-new-factory-double-action-colt/

My take is that the gun market has expanded quite a bit over the past few years and new gun owners tend to be more comfortable with revolvers. Add in a touch of nostalgia for the "snake guns" and my bet is that they'll do well with the line.

Chomsky · Feb 15, 2017

beerftw said:
Colt is going back to revolvers because they made amazing revolvers, but the important reason why is because in recent years colt has lost alot of govt contracts, for a long time they were contracted for the m-16 and the 1911, the 1911 is rarely used anymore by military, and the police and non military agencies who use them can contract 1911's to other companies besides colt, which tends to have a much higher price tag.

Colt is reorganizing itself, to cater more to the civilian world than it has in the past, and colt revolvers were always revered.

TurtleDude said:
I don't know about that. Colt revolvers were never popular among people who actually shot revolvers a lot. When I was shooting PPC in the 80s, if you didn't shoot a Smith, you were seen as not serious. in the steel speed events these days, SW dominates the competitions. Smith keeps up with the market and their clockwork is awesome . colts were well made but the actions were not as good.

beerftw said:
I am not referring to competition revolvers, I am speaking of revolvers in general, that the average joe uses. Colt has had an amazing reputation for revolvers, and made their mark during the civil war with the various cap and ball revolvers then later with the peacemaker.

Their revolvers are top notch, sure they are not designed with a shooting contest in mind, but they are revered, and it is a shame colt pushed them to the side for so many years until their military contracts ended.

TurtleDude said:
back in the eighties the comment you used to hear a lot of was

Colt sticking to autos, Smith sticking to revolvers and things would be better :mrgreen:

I believe the comments of BeerFTW are accurate, up until around the time Turtle claims: mid 1980's.

I can attest that prior to that, Colt wheelguns were perceived by at least some sectors of the general public as a higher quality gun, and priced accordingly. That's not to say Smiths were not perceived as quality - they were! Generally, Smiths were thought of as the best - accept for Colt! Colt just had the last extra bit of panache. And they cost more. Significantly more. So many of us stuck with Smiths. And Smiths remained far more ubiquitous.

Value oriented guys who didn't depend on a gun for work, weren't serious hobbyists, or just were tight with their cash, often went with Rugers. They were considered an upstart of sorts, and were becoming popular in the late 70's into the 80's and getting good reviews in the gun rags. Charter Arm's were seen as semi-functional, and considered as knocking on the door of Saturday Night Specials. They were the domain of low paid rent-a-cops who could afford nothing else, and wouldn't likely ever fire it - which was considered good as they likely wouldn't know how if they had to!

All the city street cops I knew carried Smiths, while the dicks liked to flash Colts. Maybe 'cuz the dicks made more money? I dunno. But kinda' funny the delineation there.

That's the way I remember the scene in my neck of the woods back then, and that's all LE was using until the mid to late 80's. Then 9mm autos came on the scene, and everything exploded. Goodbye speedloaders, hello clips!

TurtleDude · Feb 15, 2017

Chomsky said:
I believe the comments of BeerFTW are accurate, up until around the time Turtle claims: mid 1980's.

I can attest that prior to that, Colt wheelguns were perceived by at least some sectors of the general public as a higher quality gun, and priced accordingly. That's not to say Smiths were not perceived as quality - they were! Generally, Smiths were thought of as the best - accept for Colt! Colt just had the last extra bit of panache. And they cost more. Significantly more. So many of us stuck with Smiths. And Smiths remained far more ubiquitous.

Value oriented guys who didn't depend on a gun for work, weren't serious hobbyists, or just were tight with their cash, often went with Rugers. They were considered an upstart of sorts, and were becoming popular in the late 70's into the 80's and getting good reviews in the gun rags. Charter Arm's were seen as semi-functional, and considered as knocking on the door of Saturday Night Specials. They were the domain of low paid rent-a-cops who could afford nothing else, and wouldn't likely ever fire it - which was considered good as they likely wouldn't know how if they had to!

All the city street cops I knew carried Smiths, while the dicks liked to flash Colts. Maybe 'cuz the dicks made more money? I dunno. But kinda' funny the delineation there.

That's the way I remember the scene in my neck of the woods back then, and that's all LE was using until the mid to late 80's. Then 9mm autos came on the scene, and everything exploded. Goodbye speedloaders, hello clips!

That's interesting and yeah the Python was a "prestige" look at me gun but I grew up as a hard core competitive shooter and that is my background and I always saw the colt 1911 as the best made American centerfire Auto while I saw the Smiths as the revolvers you bought if you wanted to WIN. plus Smith was cutting edge when it came to hunting handguns since they were the ones that lead the way with the 44 mag. Rugers were seen as good buys for the money but most of the Rugers were a bit bulky for what you got -semi auto or revolver and that is due to the fact that cast frames were-at the time-slightly weaker than machined frames of the same size.

BTW the real hard core target revolver shooters had a crush on the DAN WESSON revolver for a few years because the barrel was better supported and the steel long distance IHMSA shooters were using them in the revolver class in 357 MAX for the 200 yard ram targets. The problem was, the timing on the DW revolvers was finicky and required lots of maintenance.

But I never saw the colt line of revolvers as being more "prestigious" than the Smiths and I was lucky-I always had the ability to buy the top of the line gear to compete with

Chomsky · Feb 15, 2017

Lutherf said:
My take is that the gun market has expanded quite a bit over the past few years and new gun owners tend to be more comfortable with revolvers. Add in a touch of nostalgia for the "snake guns" and my bet is that they'll do well with the line.

There was a time when a wheelgun was steadfastly advised as a newb's first handgun and learning tool.

I consider safety the highest priority in teaching gun handling, and I think there's something to be said about simplicity and an easy & intuitive understanding of the device involved.

If I were to teach or inspire a newb - especially a women or youngster - I'd grab a quality revolver with a 6 inch barrel and a case of .22LRs, and drag them to the range to learn & experience the joys of target plinking. Then see where they care to take it from there. Guess I'm really old school.

TurtleDude · Feb 15, 2017

Chomsky said:
There was a time when a wheelgun was steadfastly advised as a newb's first handgun and learning tool.

I consider safety the highest priority in teaching gun handling, and I think there's something to be said about simplicity and an easy & intuitive understanding of the device involved.

If I were to teach or inspire a newb - especially a women or youngster - I'd grab a quality revolver with a 6 inch barrel and a case of .22LRs, and drag them to the range to learn & experience the joys of target plinking. Then see where they care to take it from there. Guess I'm really old school.

that's good thinking. I taught my then 7 year old son, 12 years ago, to shoot with a little Walther 22 semi auto because it fit his small hands and the double action trigger on my 22 revolvers was heavy as was the weight of those K frames. But at age 11, when I took him to a top training facility to do Level 2-3 handgun (the basic and advanced self defense and tactical shooting courses) I got him a Model 10 38 which was loaded with mild target loads. Those courses require reloading while moving etc and I knew that its pretty much impossible to have an AD while reloading a revolver with a speed loader. When he was 12, he was shooting a Kimber 1911 in 9mm and his last few times there, it was a SW M&P but the revolver was the best choice as a rookie. The only problem is that some older women have a problem with the 12 pound trigger pull most DA revolvers require,

The future of Colt?

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